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Historicity of the change of the Sabbath Commandment

BABerean2

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Gal 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Gal 3:17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

Gal 3:18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

Gal 3:19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.

Gal 3:20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.

Gal 3:21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.

Gal 3:22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.

Gal 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

Gal 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

Gal 3:27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Gal 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

.......................................................................


Act 15:1 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.


Act 15:2 When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question.


Act 15:3 And being brought on their way by the church, they passed through Phenice and Samaria, declaring the conversion of the Gentiles: and they caused great joy unto all the brethren.


Act 15:4 And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.


Act 15:5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.


Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.


Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;


Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.


Act 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?



Act 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.


Act 15:24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that
certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:


Act 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;


Act 15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

.

 
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Berean forgot a verse:

Act 15:21 "For from ancient generations Mosheh has, in every city, those proclaiming him – being read in the congregations every Sabbath."

Why would they say this after the 4 prohibitions? It is because they would learn the rest of the torah each sabbath when it is read. Keeping the law is a progressional thing where you hear it read and incorporate it into your life. The 4 prohibitions were given so they would not continue to do acts of pagan worship which is just the start of their new walks.
 
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BobRyan

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Indeed for this was part of the "solution" to the Acts 15 "problem". The solution included the fact that Moses is preached "every Sabbath" -- and that BOTH Jews AND gentiles are hearing him preached - as we see in Acts 13, Acts 17:1-4, and Acts 18:4-6 "Every Sabbath" -- BOTH Jews AND Gentiles.

This post-cross full-gospel - "IN ALL of SCRIPTURE" beginning with Moses and the prophets - was the teaching pattern of Christ Himself in Luke 24.
26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?
27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

And in Luke 16 teaching "IF they do not listen to Moses neither will they listen though one rise from the dead"
 
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BobRyan

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To this very DAY - ALL are lost apart from faith.

apart from faith ALL are condemned by scripture - the Word of God - as sinners.

"Sin IS transgression of the LAW" 1 John 3:4 -- even in the NT

Gal 3:22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
Gal 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Ga 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

-- until "FAITH" comes the lost are under the condemnation of the law - in both OT and NT
 
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BABerean2

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Maybe because it was a fact that the Jewish Christians already knew what was found in these 4 prohibitions.

Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
Act 15:21
For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

And somehow you think this fact completely reverses Acts 15:24.

Act 15:24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:

..........

And maybe you think it also reverses Paul's words in Galatians chapter 4 where he says we are to "cast out" the Sinai "covenant"...


Gal 4:24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.


Gal 4:25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.


Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.





Gal 4:30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.


Gal 4:31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

 
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BobRyan

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It does not reverse it - it sets the context for it. Thus Acts 15 is not a rejection of the Bible - it is a strong endorsement of it. For in the "actual Bible" - there never was a command for gentiles to be circumcised.

The gentiles IN the synagogues every Sabbath - in Acts 13, Acts 17:1-4, Acts 18:1-6 are not circumcised - they are "God fearing gentiles" and not members of the Jewish nation - at all.

At the level of "entire Jewish nation" there were not enough Gentiles attaching themselves to that religion to make a dent compared to the total number of Jews.

But in the tiny-CHRISTIAN-church sect of Judaism the number of Gentiles coming in was soon going to DWARF the number of Jews in it - and so the Jews in Jerusalem especially some of the Christian Pharisees hatched a plan to try and preserve the distinctively Jewish nature of their religion - even while large numbers of gentiles were joining the church and would soon overwhelm it in their numbers.
 
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Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law

They were trying to get them to join judaism - circumcision for entry and oral law to subject them to their doctrines

And maybe you think it also reverses Paul's words in Galatians chapter 4 where he says we are to "cast out" the Sinai "covenant"...

Again, you are missing the allegory. The commandments arent bondage but oral pharasaic laws are (traditions of men). For instance I could ask you: "Does the constitution make you free or slave?" Most americans would say the constitution makes us free. In the same way, the laws of the Creator make men free. Society without laws = anarchy

Jas_2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
 
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bugkiller

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But then read v 24 as quoted. The deal for me is the Christian isn't obligated to the law as some causing the problem and the council were trying to do.

bugkiller
 
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bugkiller

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The solution was not a requirement to attend the synagogue. If it was you're disobedient.

bugkiller
 
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Exo_12:49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

Lev_24:22 Ye shall have one manner of law, as well for the stranger, as for one of your own country: for I am YHVH your Elohim.

Num_15:29 Ye shall have one law for him that sinneth through ignorance, both for him that is born among the children of Israel, and for the stranger that sojourneth among them.
 
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bugkiller

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No. Sin is also a transgression of the law. Sin isn't only a transgression of the law. Sin was in the world before the law. Rom 5:13 The law was added because of transgression. Gal 3:19

bugkiller
 
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bugkiller

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Your quotes are strictly only for Israel.

bugkiller
 
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bugkiller

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Sorry but the law of Moses isn't the oral law.

bugkiller
 
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BABerean2

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You are trying to separate the commandments from the oral pharisaic laws in Galatians chapter 4.


Gal 4:24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.



However, the word in the text is "covenant".

Some try to ignore a word in order to make their doctrine work, just as they must ignore the fact that Titus was not compelled to be circumcised.

Any doctrine that requires one to ignore or change scripture cannot be correct.


As seen in Matthew chapter 5 we are under a higher law, instead of lawless.

Mat 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: (Torah)


Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. (Higher Law)



1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.

1Jn 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

1Jn 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

.
 
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I'm sorry you can't see that there are two laws at work in the NT. There are many passages that shows that it was "traditions of men" or "oral law" that was the problem. If you think torah is bondage instead of freedom then you need to have a deep rethink.

Also, to think that the only commandment is to believe is intellectually naive. Many of you on here post the same verses over and over thinking that belief nullifies righteousness (torah). Do you really think its ok to steal, kill and destroy like satan now? (But oh no, you guys back peddle and say you have to keep those. WHICH IS IT? OBEY OR DISOBEY?)

2Pe 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them concerning these matters, in which some are hard to understand, which those who are untaught and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do also the other Scriptures.

Here is an example for you Berean:


Gal 4:9 But now after you have known Elohim, or rather are known by Elohim, how do you turn again to the weak and poor elementary matters, to which you wish to be enslaved again? Footnote: 1See v.3, Col. 2:8 & 20. (ORAL LAW)

Link to another letter of Paul:

Col 2:8 See to it that no one makes a prey of you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary matters of the world, and not according to Messiah. (ORAL LAW)

Col 2:20 If, then, you died with Messiah from the elementary matters of the world, why, as though living in the world, do you subject yourselves to regulations: Footnote: 1See v. 8, and Gal. 4:3 & 9.

Col 2:21 "Do not touch, do not taste, do not handle" – (ORAL LAW)


Berean, can you see the connection? Galations chapter 4 is connected to oral law quite plainly when you reference the key words Paul was using. Please look at what scripture is saying and be a true Berean.
 
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BobRyan

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To this very DAY - ALL are lost apart from faith.

apart from faith ALL are condemned by scripture - the Word of God - as sinners.

"Sin IS transgression of the LAW" 1 John 3:4 -- even in the NT

Gal 3:22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
Gal 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Ga 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

-- until "FAITH" comes the lost are under the condemnation of the law - in both OT and NT


So then - to this very day ... "SIN IS transgression of the LAW" 1 John 3:4
1 John 2:1 "These things I write to you that you SIN NOT"


There are few texts that I have seen posted here - that do not get your "no" response.

Sin is also a transgression of the law. Sin isn't only a transgression of the law.

Your argument is 'with the text'.

Gen 26
4 And I will make your descendants multiply as the stars of heaven; I will give to your descendants all these lands; and in your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed; 5 because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.”

Those who "imagine" that Gen 2:1-3 declares no day to be sanctified, blessed, made holy - binding on all mankind - need to read the text and see how God summarized it in Ex 20:11.

Those who "imagine" that it was ok to take God's name in vain, worship idols, kill, lie ... steal for Adam and Eve - need to "read the Bible" at 'least' as closely as these guys do -

The Baptist Confession of Faith,
the Westminster Confession of Faith ,
D.L. Moody,
R.C Sproul,
Matthew Henry,
Thomas Watson
Eastern Orthodox Catechism
The Catholic Catechism
 
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bugkiller

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Why is there a day of preparation? Di you not understand what bondage properly and legally keeping the Sabbath as written is? Most likely not because you don't keep it as written.

bugkiller
 
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Why is there a day of preparation? Di you not understand what bondage properly and legally keeping the Sabbath as written is? Most likely not because you don't keep it as written.

bugkiller

I'm sorry, but that is plain stupid

Keeping the sabbath is not bondage - IT IS FREEDOM

How?

You get to take a whole day off of working at anything (a form of slavery). So when you rest and enjoy life how in the world is that bondage? Crazy man...
 
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bugkiller

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Which doesn't include the Christian. Yes we know you believe people like me aren't Christian. You can't put me under condemnation because I'm in Jesus Christ - Rom 8

8 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
So then - to this very day ... "SIN IS transgression of the LAW" 1 John 3:4
1 John 2:1 "These things I write to you that you SIN NOT"



There are few texts that I have seen posted here - that do not get your "no" response.
You know very well its not the text but the partial text twisting the Scripture into something it never says. No sir. Your argument is with Moses -

5 And Moses called all Israel, and said unto them, Hear, O Israel, the statutes and judgments which I speak in your ears this day, that ye may learn them, and keep, and do them.

2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.

3 The Lord made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day. Deut 5
Those who "imagine" that Gen 2:1-3 declares no day to be sanctified, blessed, made holy - binding on all mankind - need to read the text and see how God summarized it in Ex 20:11.
Bob no one here says a day wasn't sanctified in Gen 2:1-3. You try to put that on others by forcing the Scripture to say something it doesn't.
Those who "imagine" that it was ok to take God's name in vain, worship idols, kill, lie ... steal for Adam and Eve - need to "read the Bible" at 'least' as closely as these guys do -
Who is doing this, Bob?
The Baptist Confession of Faith,
the Westminster Confession of Faith ,
D.L. Moody,
R.C Sproul,
Matthew Henry,
Thomas Watson
Eastern Orthodox Catechism
The Catholic Catechism
marleky

bugkiller
 
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