Help! I'm a heathen!

The_White · Aug 10, 2004

Absolute sense. The one thing that holds many people back on condemning others is that they stand condemned by the same standard.

But this one is where the straight person can be totally sure they will not be caught a week later doing the same thing.

Couple this with the fact that we tend to be revulsed by sexual activity we are not personally inclined towards (whether it be sado-masochism, "water games", bondage, or same-sex relations) and you have the perfect recipe for the intense dislike you experience. Couple that with a couple of bible verses that can be used to appear to bolster your feelings, and off you go...

That sounds every bit as plausable (if not more so) than my suggestion

To readheadmt: in order to quote someone type (with no enter between them)
[
quote
]
the quote you want
[
/quote
]
also you can put an =username after the first quote to have it by that person. Hope that helps

Karl - Liberal Backslider · Aug 10, 2004

Erm... I know how to quote people, as in my last post...

The_White · Aug 10, 2004

Sry that bit was to readheadmt since

readheadmt said:
I goofed up trying to quote only part of your post. The stress of being a newbie!

CaDan · Aug 10, 2004

redheadmt said:
The question was asked about why the United Church of Christ is considered "black" by my husband's friend. The answer is that the UCC that I go to is an "Open and Affirming" church, meaning that they welcome people regardless of their sexual orientation. My husband's friend is obsessed with the sins of homosexuals. I'm not exaggerating when I say the he thinks about homosexuals ALL OF THE TIME. Even my husband has a difficult time understanding why he focuses so much energy on the verses in the Bible that deal with homosexuality. We have come up with a theory that he is a very angry person who needs a scapegoat to spew all of his bitterness at.

If I were gay, I'd found a church called "Samaritan Open Church." Too bad most people wouldn't get the joke.

But they could have ice cream anyway!

Firefly · Aug 10, 2004

redheadmt said:
I had that theory for a while, but I don't think so. An alternate theory that I have is that homosexuality is a good thing for him to focus on because he may have committed many of the other sins mentioned in the Bible, but homosexuality is the one sin that he will NEVER take part in. So, he can feel superior and self-righteous on this one issue. Does this theory make any sense?

It does make sense. A whole lot of sense. I've always subscribed to the
theory they obsess because they hate that very thing about themselves.
This gives me something new to ponder...

seebs · Aug 10, 2004

redheadmt said:
The question was asked about why the United Church of Christ is considered "black" by my husband's friend. The answer is that the UCC that I go to is an "Open and Affirming" church, meaning that they welcome people regardless of their sexual orientation. My husband's friend is obsessed with the sins of homosexuals. I'm not exaggerating when I say the he thinks about homosexuals ALL OF THE TIME. Even my husband has a difficult time understanding why he focuses so much energy on the verses in the Bible that deal with homosexuality. We have come up with a theory that he is a very angry person who needs a scapegoat to spew all of his bitterness at.

That's very common. The thing is, as long as he doesn't have that temptation, it's "safe". If he were focusing on sins that he himself commits, then he'd have to think about his own behavior.

He needs to read Romans 2. When we condemn, we are hypocrites because we do the same thing. He may think he doesn't do the same thing, but Paul, who was very insightful, says otherwise.

Your husband probably experiences lust. It's the same thing. It's wrong for the same reasons. That he's compartmentalized it doesn't change anything.

Aduro Amnis · Aug 10, 2004

I'm not 100% Christian, but I do attend a Christian church so I can probably leave you with some words of wisdom

'To be a conservative Christian makes you ignore the highest commandments of Jesus, tolerance and love.'

Good Luck

Machiavelli · Aug 10, 2004

'To be a conservative Christian makes you ignore the highest commandments of Jesus, tolerance and love.'

Well, I'm not exactly a conservative Christian myself, but I find the above words to be somewhat problematic. Conservative Christians don't have a monopoly on lack of tolerance and love. What's more, many conservative Christians exhibit very loving and tolerant characteristics.

An ideology doesn't necessarily define the individual, or the content of their character. One can be a conservative Christian, disagree strongly with the views of his or her more liberal counterparts, yet still have respect for the other individual as a person, and as a brother or sister in Christ.

The_White · Aug 10, 2004

This is true Machiavelli, possibly in should be

To be a conservative Christian can make you ignore the highest commandments of Jesus, tolerance and love, but then again, so can being a:
Baptist
Methodist
Orthodox
Anglican
Roman Catholic
etc
etc
etc
Bhuddist
Islamic
Jewish
Pagan
Athiest
etc
etc
etc
in fact, being human can cause you to ignore these.

Diane_Windsor · Aug 11, 2004

To the OP, I'm liberal (politically speaking) too. I too favor abortion rights for women, etc., etc. Keep in mind that Jesus never went to the Roman Emperors and demanded that they change their immoral laws (such as forced Emperor worship-that's breaks a Commandment there!) to suit His moral teachings. I have absolutely no problem supporting the liberal stances of the Democratic party when Jesus did nothing to bring down the immoral laws of the Roman Empire. Christ is the example we should follow correct?

Keep in mind that you do not have to answer to any other sinful human beings for your beliefs. You only have to answer to God Herself. Place it in God's hands, and She'll take care of it.

In Christ's Love

Aduro Amnis · Aug 11, 2004

Diane, you call God a woman

I haven't seen many Christians who refer to God as a woman but more power to yah

seebs · Aug 11, 2004

Aduro Amnis said:
Diane, you call God a woman

I haven't seen many Christians who refer to God as a woman but more power to yah

Well, gender's just us projecting at God anyway, I think. I don't think assigning gender to God makes any sense. Use whichever one feels best, it doesn't mean anything anyway.

UberLutheran · Aug 11, 2004

redheadmt said:
I am politically liberal. I absolutely can't stand Bush. I believe that the gay marriage amendment idea is ludicrous and terribly wrong. I am pro-choice. My problem is that the Christians that I know believe that I can not be a Christian and also have liberal beliefs. Even my born again husband puts me down and says stuff like "you either follow the map (the Bible) or you don't." My husband's best friend doesn't come here anymore after he found out the I go to a United Church of Christ. I get really depressed trying to rationalize my political beliefs with my faith in God. Does anyone have any encouraging words or advice?

"I am a child of God, created in God's image and beloved of God, and I am worthy of love and respect."

OBTW: I'm a Christian and my political and social beliefs are very liberal -- nor am I a fundamentalist.

I have a born-again, staunchly Calvinist sister and brother-in-law -- and they've learned NOT to argue religion or theology with me because I've read enough of the Bible (and taught myself the Greek and Hebrew to read it for myself in the original languages) that I will argue with them, point-by-point -- and I can argue them down.

UberLutheran · Aug 11, 2004

seebs said:
Indeed.

So, given that one of His children is here, asking for support and a welcome into the faith, why are you kicking her in the stomach?

he can do it (so he does it).

It's called "loving the sinner and doing whatever it takes to make their lives as miserable and wretched as possible."

When people engage in sanctified slander and using Scripture as a weapon with which to inflict the maximum amount of pain on others, I remind myself of something Jesus once said, "Most assuredly I tell you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to Me."

CaDan · Aug 11, 2004

Aduro Amnis said:
Diane, you call God a woman

I haven't seen many Christians who refer to God as a woman but more power to yah

It's kinda weird the first few times and then you get used to it and then on Father's Day, your priest has to say, "Maybe this Sunday, we will refer to God as 'Father'."

Oh, my church is liberal? Sorry, hadn't noticed!

Starstreak M86 · Aug 11, 2004

Aduro Amnis said:
Diane, you call God a woman

I haven't seen many Christians who refer to God as a woman but more power to yah

God the Holy Spirit is a woman in Proverbs, Ecclesiasticus and the Wisdom of Solomon (as well as the Apocryphal Odes of Solomon and the Gospel of the Hebrews). As well as one of Jesus' parables in the Gospel of Luke.

God takes on both roles (God has no 'gender', but takes on genderal roles).

Anastasis · Aug 12, 2004

redheadmt said:
I am politically liberal. I absolutely can't stand Bush. I believe that the gay marriage amendment idea is ludicrous and terribly wrong. I am pro-choice. My problem is that the Christians that I know believe that I can not be a Christian and also have liberal beliefs. Even my born again husband puts me down and says stuff like "you either follow the map (the Bible) or you don't." My husband's best friend doesn't come here anymore after he found out the I go to a United Church of Christ. I get really depressed trying to rationalize my political beliefs with my faith in God. Does anyone have any encouraging words or advice?

Well all I have to say to how your husband treats you is:

I hope that helps - as for the politics...
Why can't you hold a certain set of personal beliefs and still not think that it's the gov't role to enfore them?

I think the Protection of Marriage Amendment is a bunch of bunk - but it has nothing to do with my relationship with Christ.
I don't think the Constitution is any place for an Ammendment that restricts the rights of citizens.

But this belief ya'll really might not agree with:
I don't think the government has any role in marriage whatsoever. Marriage is a religious institution and should be left up to religious organizations. Government should recognize Civil Unions only. If a gay couple wants to get married and their church supports it then that falls squarely under freedom of religion.
I think that would satisfy both sides but I could be wrong.

*gets down off soapbox*

But seriously now, redheadmt, if you love God and try to do God's work, who cares what your political beliefs are? I don't think Christ does.

seebs · Aug 12, 2004

Anastasis said:
But this belief ya'll really might not agree with:

I don't think the government has any role in marriage whatsoever. Marriage is a religious institution and should be left up to religious organizations. Government should recognize Civil Unions only. If a gay couple wants to get married and their church supports it then that falls squarely under freedom of religion.

Total agreement. If and when the state allows civil unions with all the rights of marriage, my wife and I will get a civil divorce and a civil union, and keep our marriage safely out of the hands of the government.

jo-shmo · Aug 13, 2004

CaDan said:
Those Pharisees. Man, always playin' games with the ice cream.

First, they're all like, "Free Ice Cream." But then they're like, "But first you have to watch this educational video." And you're all like, "But you said 'Free Ice Cream.'" And they're all like, "But we can't just give away ice cream. It is too yummy and delicious." And you're all like, "Man, that's a rip off. You lied to me." And they're all like, "It wasn't a lie. We're not charging any MONEY for the ice cream." And you're all like, "That doesn't seem right." And they're all like, "Looks like you're too dumb if you can't understand a simple thing like ADVERTISING." And you're all like, "I just wanted some ice cream." And they're all like, "Go away. No ice cream for you."

And then you look and they don't even have any ice cream. All they have is that crappy Italian Ice stuff that isn't anything like ice cream.

That's what I think of Pharisees.

BWAAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHA.........BWAHAHWHAHHWHAHWHWH...

Oy ....

Diane_Windsor · Aug 13, 2004

Aduro Amnis said:
Diane, you call God a woman

I haven't seen many Christians who refer to God as a woman but more power to yah

*sarcasm* I did? Shiver me timbers Batman! To the Batmobile Robin! We need to judge and condemn her! */sarcasm*

Seriously, I once made the mistake of referring to God as a She on another MB and was promptly told that I was being blasphemous Yeah right! If that MB really would like to be accurate then we should all refer to God as It, like another poster said-God is genderless. I really do not see Her as getting all upset at how people may refer to Her.

Help! I'm a heathen!

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