Help - I need a name!!

[Didaskomenos]

Indeed, noone I know of (and certainly not I!) suggests the bible does not contain any symbolism, imagery, or other not-to-be-taken-literal text; however, what I (and others) declare, is that a straight forward reading is sufficient to identify those texts - it is obvious, in other words. And NEVER twist what a straightforward, literal reading suggests because some men disagree with it.

In other words, we hold 'Let God be true, but every man a liar' in regard, and are prepared first to accept what it declares before listening to someone say, 'No, that does not agree with x/y/z (be that science or whatever' - when really what they mean is THEY do not agree with what the Scripture plainly declares. It will take more than man saying "I don't agree that's what it says or means", especially when the argument they put forth is based on man's word.

Regarding the suggestion that God inspired man to write, but not what to write exactly (if I understand the suggestion) ... think on it for a moment and you will see the futility of it. Along the same lines with 'God inspired the original, but did not preserve it' - like saying, He made sure we got it right the first time, but let us stuff it up subsequently...

But even you make unconscious interpretive decisions based upon what you know to be true. When the Bible refers to the sun rising, you call it "phenomenal language" because you know good and well that the earth actually turns round the sun. You believe that "the circle of the earth" is a divine insight into science, because everyone knows the earth is round. The more knowledge one has of the universe, the better he understands in what way to take the Scriptures.

And please don't tell me we've got another KJV-onlyist here. We haven't had one since. . . Ed? Anyone remember him? The reason I assume you are a KJV-onlyist is that they are the ones who usually pull that garbage about God preserving the Bible. It highlights one of the worst problems with the fundamentalist view of the Bible. If God wanted an authoritative "written Word" that was perfect in every imaginable way, scientifically verifiable, historically accurate in all places, surely he could have thought of a better way of doing it than spreading its writing out over centuries, using humans to write it, and then making sure they didn't screw it up down the line. He could have done what he did with the original Ten Commandments! Instead, he had certain of his followers tell of their testimonies for the record. It's human in every way because that's the way God chose to do it. He didn't want some worshipable manuscript that could replace him. He set in order what continues to this day - the testimony of men brings other men to know God.

 

[Asar'el]

But even you make unconscious interpretive decisions based upon what you know to be true. When the Bible refers to the sun rising, you call it "phenomenal language" because you know good and well that the earth actually turns round the sun. You believe that "the circle of the earth" is a divine insight into science, because everyone knows the earth is round. The more knowledge one has of the universe, the better he understands in what way to take the Scriptures.

Actually, very conscious interpretive decisions; and no, when the bible refers to the sun rising I think exactly of that - the sun rising. Likewise the circle of the earth. And it's not my knowledge of the universe that I use to understand the bible, but the bible I use to understand the universe.

And please don't tell me we've got another KJV-onlyist here.

Consider yourself not told, I guess... but since you know, isn't that kind of moot?

We haven't had one since. . . Ed? Anyone remember him? The reason I assume you are a KJV-onlyist is that they are the ones who usually pull that garbage about God preserving the Bible.

Thank you for sharing your compassionate understanding of my belief. Does calling it garbage make you feel better about your opposition to it?

It highlights one of the worst problems with the fundamentalist view of the Bible. If God wanted an authoritative "written Word" that was perfect in every imaginable way, scientifically verifiable, historically accurate in all places, surely he could have thought of a better way of doing it than spreading its writing out over centuries, using humans to write it, and then making sure they didn't screw it up down the line. He could have done what he did with the original Ten Commandments! Instead, he had certain of his followers tell of their testimonies for the record. It's human in every way because that's the way God chose to do it. He didn't want some worshipable manuscript that could replace him. He set in order what continues to this day - the testimony of men brings other men to know God.

How nice of you to tell us how much better you think God could have done things... but since people like me actually believe the bible to be just what you declare ... I don't see this 'worst problem' you speak of. Perhaps the problem is yours?

What you believe about the gospel of Christ, and about the written word, is your affair; I'd appreciate it if you allow me the same courtesy - minus the 'garbage' labels and the like.

 

[major_minor]

I suppose what matters most is this: What is it that you believe. We are to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling. I concur, some scriptures are literal, others allegories, others parables.
But if you don't believe God created the world as in Gen., then how did it happen? Does that belieft line up with the other scriptures? Line upon line..precept upon precept. I am glad you ARE searching, that's awesome. None of us has the right to condemn another for what they believe. Even if I WERE to say I believe in capital punishmen, yet the Ten Commandments are clear: Thou shall not kill. Let God take it up with me. Its OK to have diffenring opinions, lest be not a stumbling block to your neighbor.
As far as Biblical interpretaion, I'll give you one guess as to why THOUSANDS of "religions" exist. Yep, open to interpretaion. The theory I live by is this: Is it a heaven or hell issue? SO I dance in church, you don't. You kneel, I don't. You have to wear a 3-piece suit to church, and I can wear jeans. Does it matter? No. Major on the majors, minor on the minors.
I have several OPINIONS and beliefs of which I hold in faith. God will let me know one day of my ignorance, or of my revelations. Either way, hold fast to Jesus, for He is the Messiah, He died for our sins, we are redeemed, and He IS coming agin to judge.

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

I suppose what matters most is this: What is it that you believe. We are to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling. I concur, some scriptures are literal, others allegories, others parables.
But if you don't believe God created the world as in Gen., then how did it happen? Does that belieft line up with the other scriptures? Line upon line..precept upon precept. I am glad you ARE searching, that's awesome. None of us has the right to condemn another for what they believe. Even if I WERE to say I believe in capital punishmen, yet the Ten Commandments are clear: Thou shall not kill. Let God take it up with me. Its OK to have diffenring opinions, lest be not a stumbling block to your neighbor.
As far as Biblical interpretaion, I'll give you one guess as to why THOUSANDS of "religions" exist. Yep, open to interpretaion. The theory I live by is this: Is it a heaven or hell issue? SO I dance in church, you don't. You kneel, I don't. You have to wear a 3-piece suit to church, and I can wear jeans. Does it matter? No. Major on the majors, minor on the minors.
I have several OPINIONS and beliefs of which I hold in faith. God will let me know one day of my ignorance, or of my revelations. Either way, hold fast to Jesus, for He is the Messiah, He died for our sins, we are redeemed, and He IS coming agin to judge.

There should be no disagreements. Only 5% is even close to being unclear. And that, don't try to do by yourself, ask God.

 

[Asar'el]

There should be no disagreements. Only 5% is even close to being unclear. And that, don't try to do by yourself, ask God.

The problem is not the subject matter, or how much of it is to some degree unclear; the problem, as usual, is people, and the differences that make us people. Differences are not only inevitable, they are declared by Scripture as fact; and yes, usually it's a matter of doing things by ourselves ...

What is an issue of heaven or hell? What is the sin unto death? That, in itself, is a matter of debate, lol.

Belief and unbelief; what you believe, and what you believe not. A journey of discovery began in this world that will not finish until the day we pass into the next - and then only will we truly begin to discover.

I can only repeat the advice Jesus gave (and one of my most favorite verses)

But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

And again,

Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

I agree. The problem is that people don't seek the kingdom of God and righteousness first