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How can a dead man hear God; they are dead in trustpasses and sin. No one comes to the Faher unless the Father draw/drags Him. It is grace we are saved, not freewill.How is it not God calling all people? Everyone has the chance for salvation. Everyone can hear the call. But not everyone will hearken onto it! Some will go in their ways and defy the call to Salvation by their own choice.
Enjoyed your debate; God BlessI purposely addressed OTHER side issues regarding judgment & faith/unto salvation -
and you STILL refuse scripture teaching on it.
With that, I'm unsubsubcribing to this thread and shake the dust from my strappy sandals.
Those with ears will hear the truth.
Universalism is a FALSE doctrine.
ps ben: what do YOU care if I agree w/ you or not or know "your god" or not? - I make it into heaven anyways. right? So who cares!
"For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in His own order; Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at His coming." (I Cor. 15:22-23). There is no doubt concerning the totality of salvation for every man-- whatever was affected by death through Adam, shall be MADE ALIVE THROUGH CHRIST. The triumph of Christ is far greater than the sin of Adam. But the point that is before us is that of TIMING-- with "every man in his own order." There is DIVINE ORDER in this NEW CREATION that is being brought forth, as God gathers one by one a people unto Himself. From Calvary until this present time, God has been working in what is rightly termed "HIS FIRSTFRUITS." We who are living at the ending of this age (web ed. note: which still could be a long ways away) are still being drawn into this "firstfruits order." But never forget, the firstfruits of a harvest are the PROMISE that all the rest of the harvest will follow in its time.YOU don't know that... BUT I DO KNOW HE IS!.
AmenJohn 5:19-30 NIV
19Jesus gave them this answer: "I tell you the truth, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does. 20For the Father loves the Son and shows him all he does. Yes, to your amazement he will show him even greater things than these. 21For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son gives life to whom he is pleased to give it. 22Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all judgment to the Son, 23that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father, who sent him.
24"I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life. 25I tell you the truth, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. 26For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son to have life in himself. 27And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man.
28"Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29and come out—those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned. 30By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but him who sent me.
Absolutely - once again, IT REFUTES UNIVERSALISM - we've provided dozens of scriptures that directly and indirectly teach this by support.John 5:19-30 NIV
27And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man.
28"Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice
29and come outthose who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned.
I purposely addressed OTHER side issues regarding judgment & faith/unto salvation -
and you STILL refuse scripture teaching on it.
With that, I'm unsubsubcribing to this thread and shake the dust from my strappy sandals.
Those with ears will hear the truth.
Universalism is a FALSE doctrine.
ps ben: what do YOU care if I agree w/ you or not or know "your god" or not? - I make it into heaven anyways. right? So who cares!
There you go with your credible seminaries; they are human build with a religious bias. I trust nothing of man and his religion.
Every post of yours was informative.What do you mean you don't trust man? You can't read your Bible without trusting another man. You can't even take the manuscripts we have, arrange them in the order they're suppossed to go in, and then translate them, so don't sit there and say you don't trust others when you're quoting from a modern translation of the Bible.
Also - it is very dangerous and unwise to say "the Greek says this or that" when you don't read or speak the language.
Truth always stands up to the hardest questions. Truth isn't always what one would like it to be.
Searching for sources and quotes to support an argument devoid of truth doesn't make it any more true - it simply makes the person doing that more of a fool.
What do you mean you don't trust man? You can't read your Bible without trusting another man. You can't even take the manuscripts we have, arrange them in the order they're suppossed to go in, and then translate them, so don't sit there and say you don't trust others when you're quoting from a modern translation of the Bible.
Also - it is very dangerous and unwise to say "the Greek says this or that" when you don't read or speak the language.
Truth always stands up to the hardest questions. Truth isn't always what one would like it to be.
Searching for sources and quotes to support an argument devoid of truth doesn't make it any more true - it simply makes the person doing that more of a fool.
(not related to hell issue - I AM unsubsubscribed - I came here thru the forum link and I'm not debating)I agree totally with what I said; BUT I do trust the anointing in people. For years I have rejected man and His teaching and have followed the leading of the Holy Spirit which is in all of us. Sure I read my Bible but I let my spirit not my brain leads me. It is more then language; or religion; it is by God Spirit. You can call me a fool all you want; but I have seen things so deep and awesome. The religious realms goes round in round with anything spiritual; but they rejected Gods anointing or are totally anti anointing; in other words anti Christ (same thing)
(not related to hell issue - I AM unsubsubscribed - I came here thru the forum link and I'm not debating)
*YOU DO REALIZE THAT YOU TOO ARE JUST A "MAN"?? FALLIBLE LIKE ALL OTHERS?? AND LIKE ALL OTHERS WHO ALSO CLAIM CHRIST??
You are not incapable of error yourself as a human and as a self proclaiming Christian. Unless you believe we should seek YOU for our truth about God & all things spiritual?
**
Every post of yours was informative.
I would like to add that his denial of the Greek doesn't work either because it isn't only those few passages that teach that these people won't enter God's kingdom at any time.
The entire new testament repeats that it's permanent in different ways.
When you read all the verses provided here, the truth is obvious that people are not getting out of this place and entering heaven.
What else I notice is that they don't have any scriptures that explain this so called process of people getting back out. They just use verses that pertain to life right now while we have the opportunity to accept Christ for our eternal life.
Or they just read it into passages anywhere they want.
God has spelled it all out. Its my opinion that denying this much information is proving that they just don't want to believe what God has said by His word.
In Revelation, it says those who worshipped the beast will be tormented and the smoke will go up forever and ever.
Wrong? A mistake? interpret it however you want?
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