Hell fire!

[razeontherock]

I guess I ask, what does the sting of death being sin and the power of sin being the law have to do with O death where is thy sting, O grave where is thy victory?

Christ rose from death, conquering death by death, having fulfilled the law

 

[razeontherock]

is it wrong to come up with guesses as to what heaven or hell will be like?

Perhaps

 

[tackattack]

@ashout- It's not off topic to discuss what hell is life and which hell we're talking about. We did get a little sidelined by purgatory, but we'll but that behind us, as it's extra Biblical and I like my Bible with not a word added or taken away. Nor are we debating, we're sharing, discussing civilly and enjoyably in my case. I love diversity with a Unity of Spirit! God made such a lessed and wonderfully fun life for us.

Interesting thoughts, whats strange is whats mentioned in their fear of death (not the other) or in relation to "the pains of" death (Christ loosed) and likewise the sting of death, but the victory of the grave. Comparing the wording. I would have thought, any such sting would be associated with the other, or rather "O grave". But then again, if you look at Paul saying O death where is thy sting, O grave where is thy victory, he follows up right behind it with "the sting of death is sin and the power of sin is the law"

For some reason (to me anyway) are the comparisons being made right? Or rather, what does that have to do with the price of beans (as most compare it)? leaving that little part out of the equation (as to how it might relate) so to speak. Whereas on the otherhand (elsewhere) it says, sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under the law but under grace (whereas under the law itself) is where he stated "being dead" wherein we were held. Ever notice that?

I guess I ask, what does the sting of death being sin and the power of sin being the law have to do with O death where is thy sting, O grave where is thy victory? And I am aware it speaks of when this mortal puts on immortality the saying shall come to pass, but its how he states it (in comparison to the other elsewhere).

Brainfreeze

I have heard alot on it in various ways, but my question always remains

I think I agree with Barnes' notes onthe subject. This is a personification by the apostle of death. Sin is the means by which the consequence of death is issued. ie. without sin there would be no death. We are all sinners, so we all die. Jesus didn't sin, but chose to die, knowing that he could overcome death due to his purpose in His Father's plan, and by His Father's power. Remember Romans 6:23 .. I think this verse ties in well with that.
"For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."

As far as the later part "and the power of sin is the law"
Remember that the primary audience was Jews, which were under the law. Have you heard the term "Law of Death"? look at Romans 8:2 "because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death." (sometimes also referred to as the law of condemnation - check 2 corin.3:9) The Mossaic law empowered a personified sin here. It used fear and condemnation to instill death-bed guilt, fear and remorse. I still feel under the law at times, despite my best efforts.

Now we are starting to diverge a little.. so hell... yeah.... don't wanna go there.

 

[Fireinfolding]

Christ rose from death, conquering death by death, having fulfilled the law

I agree bro Christ is the end of the law. It was the way its worded ...The sting of death is sin, the power of sin is the law, whereas we know sin shall not have dominion over you for you are not under the law but under grace. Therefore, Let not sin reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.

It was the "this mortal" in relation to sin in respects to the law (we are not under). Its actually hard for me to word my question aright, I havent yet formed my question right

Ever have a question you cannot word aright, from scripture? I do, and I say to myself, "How on earth do I word my question"?

God bless brother

 

[Fireinfolding]

@ashout- It's not off topic to discuss what hell is life and which hell we're talking about. We did get a little sidelined by purgatory, but we'll but that behind us, as it's extra Biblical and I like my Bible with not a word added or taken away. Nor are we debating, we're sharing, discussing civilly and enjoyably in my case. I love diversity with a Unity of Spirit! God made such a lessed and wonderfully fun life for us.



I think I agree with Barnes' notes onthe subject. This is a personification by the apostle of death. Sin is the means by which the consequence of death is issued. ie. without sin there would be no death. We are all sinners, so we all die. Jesus didn't sin, but chose to die, knowing that he could overcome death due to his purpose in His Father's plan, and by His Father's power. Remember Romans 6:23 .. I think this verse ties in well with that.
"For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."

As far as the later part "and the power of sin is the law"
Remember that the primary audience was Jews, which were under the law. Have you heard the term "Law of Death"? look at Romans 8:2 "because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death." (sometimes also referred to as the law of condemnation - check 2 corin.3:9) The Mossaic law empowered a personified sin here. It used fear and condemnation to instill death-bed guilt, fear and remorse. I still feel under the law at times, despite my best efforts.

Yeah, you know tackattack...I cannot even word my question aright, just as I was saying to Raze, I have had it for a long time, the best was (a long while back) I would just simply ask whats this (the sting of death being sin and the power of sin being the law) have to do with a dead body? When we are not under the law but under grace where sin has no dominion. It seems like to one, he is speaking of physical death of the mortal body (even this body of death) elsewhere he is given over to death that the life of Christ is revealed in his mortal body, whereas elsewhere it says likewise, "let not sin reign in your mortal body" (as I posted above).

And cant word the rest of what I want to ask, this impossible the sting of death, loosing the pains of death, and as it speaks of the sting of death (being sin) and His specifically coming again "without sin" Im catching as linking. Whats throwing me is in some places it seems naturally applied (but then no not really) and other places spiritually applied (but then no not really)... ok thats the best I can do here

Now we are starting to diverge a little.. so hell... yeah.... don't wanna go there.

Back on topic, I agree. I wouldnt chose "this place of torment" as coming highly reccomended.

God bless you

 

[razeontherock]

...I cannot even word my question aright

I have had it for a long time, the best was (a long while back) I would just simply ask whats this (the sting of death being sin and the power of sin being the law) have to do with a dead body? When we are not under the law but under grace where sin has no dominion. It seems like to one, he is speaking of physical death of the mortal body (even this body of death) elsewhere he is given over to death that the life of Christ is revealed in his mortal body,

And cant word the rest of what I want to ask, this impossible the sting of death, loosing the pains of death, and as it speaks of the sting of death (being sin) and His specifically coming again "without sin" Im catching as linking. Whats throwing me is in some places it seems naturally applied (but then no not really) and other places spiritually applied (but then no not really)...

Sister, I know you've seen me say this before, but this is a perfect application of it to see the depth of what I mean:

I do believe that when we shall behold Him, as He really is, that seeing His finished work on the Cross would be more than sufficient to totally flood our being with worship, for all of Eternity!

There's just no emoticon or punctuation that comes anywhere near close to emphasizing this adequately. I'm not saying that this is "all there is" to the next Life, but personally I think I'll find it to be the best part. And you are asking about things that Angels cannot comprehend, so it should come as no surprise that human language falls short here. The closest I can come to anything touching it is:

"that ye, being rooted and grounded in love, (Eph 3:18) May be able to comprehend with all saints what [is] the breadth, and length, and depth, and height; And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God."

(Romans 8:18) For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time [are] not worthy [to be compared] with the glory which shall be revealed in us."

AND

(1 John 3:1) Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God"

Plus a little OT: (Psalm 96:9) O worship the LORD in the beauty of holiness"

 

[Avelina777]

if hell is torture, i don't want to go there, if hell is to stop existing, i don't want to do that.

lets just agree on this: Hell bad, heaven good.

Amen brother

 

[Fireinfolding]

Sister, I know you've seen me say this before, but this is a perfect application of it to see the depth of what I mean:

I do believe that when we shall behold Him, as He really is, that seeing His finished work on the Cross would be more than sufficient to totally flood our being with worship, for all of Eternity!

There's just no emoticon or punctuation that comes anywhere near close to emphasizing this adequately. I'm not saying that this is "all there is" to the next Life, but personally I think I'll find it to be the best part. And you are asking about things that Angels cannot comprehend, so it should come as no surprise that human language falls short here. The closest I can come to anything touching it is:

"that ye, being rooted and grounded in love, (Eph 3:18) May be able to comprehend with all saints what [is] the breadth, and length, and depth, and height; And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God."

(Romans 8:18) For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time [are] not worthy [to be compared] with the glory which shall be revealed in us."

AND

(1 John 3:1) Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God"

Plus a little OT: (Psalm 96:9) O worship the LORD in the beauty of holiness"

Great verses bro

Yeah, there are some real stumpers yet for me Raze Im not "all growed up" yet so I am far from perfect in my knowledge and understanding. I just get glimpses.

But man... sometimes it does become sorta impossible to convey to another what it is you are comparing and the question your entertaining (when you know your not catching it right) and you want to post it (and you try to) but the thought will come... "just forget about going there"

Though, I do wish that thought would come (a little more often) before stepping into "something else" (the way I do)

Thankfully we do add to our faith experience right?

God bless you brother!

 

[razeontherock]

Yup yup yup! This is why I wish more would engage in your habit, of comparing Scriptures. Rather than claiming a point and trying to establish it. The way you go about it, the Light makes entrance And then as a Body, we all have a better glimpse of what the Spirit is trying to tell us. That's the way it supposed to work!

 

[Avelina777]

Great verses bro

Yeah, there are some real stumpers yet for me Raze Im not "all growed up" yet so I am far from perfect in my knowledge and understanding. I just get glimpses.

But man... sometimes it does become sorta impossible to convey to another what it is you are comparing and the question your entertaining (when you know your not catching it right) and you want to post it (and you try to) but the thought will come... "just forget about going there"

Though, I do wish that thought would come (a little more often) before stepping into "something else" (the way I do)

Thankfully we do add to our faith experience right?

God bless you brother!

Amen what a great attitude!!!!

 

[Fireinfolding]

Yup yup yup! This is why I wish more would engage in your habit, of comparing Scriptures. Rather than claiming a point and trying to establish it. The way you go about it, the Light makes entrance And then as a Body, we all have a better glimpse of what the Spirit is trying to tell us. That's the way it supposed to work!

Thats IT bro!!! The entrance of His words! For example, the disciples sat around when he said something to them.

John 16:18 They said therefore, What is this that he saith, A little while? we cannot tell what he saith.

Its like most of the time folks sit around and give their own discourses, their opinions, and post their own words, but his disciples wanted to know what HE MEANT when he said something, they'd hang on HIS EVERY WORD (because He had the WORDS)

What is this HE SAITH, we cannot TELL what HE SAITH... wow yeah bro.

More like considering Him, what He said, throwing up something "to consider" and for the other (perhaps how he worded something) would strike a chord in them (so they could compare) and somehow a fellowship would naturally come forth, their common ground and focus on Christ and His words (hearing Him, and comparing) feeling after (so to speak). Not sure if I am really putting that as good as I could but it struck me when you said that. I cant agree more there.

I look for that in someone sharing, first thing I note is how carefully they are combing, comparing and how they use His words because I want to be around that (I receive benefit from that).

God bless you, you hit the nail on the head with that one bro

 

[Fireinfolding]

Amen what a great attitude!!!!

Your too sweet, after stepping into the same stuff with me huh?

God bless you sis

 

[razeontherock]

Yup again:

(1 John 1:7) "But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin."

Powerful stuff, highly under-rated

 

[Avelina777]

Yup again:

(1 John 1:7) "But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin."

Powerful stuff, highly under-rated

Agreed!!

 

[Avelina777]

Your too sweet, after stepping into the same stuff with me huh?

God bless you sis

LOL I am God bless you too sis

 

[Fireinfolding]

Yup again:

(1 John 1:7) "But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin."

Powerful stuff, highly under-rated

So sorry bro! I reread your post and you said something kind about my sharing (and I do thank you!) and I so didnt acknowledge that (Im so sorry!) I zoomed right into the other parts (and heard "bingo") and I was off to respond! So when I responded it might have come off as, yeah your right about me

I so didnt mean it that way bro!!

(turns ten shades of red) LOL

Amen, bro and God bless you!

(man, I so want to crawl under a rock) LOL

 

[razeontherock]

No problem, I understood what you meant. (Funny now that you mention it though)

 

[Fireinfolding]

No problem, I understood what you meant. (Funny now that you mention it though)

Thanks bro your so good with my quirkiness

 

[razeontherock]

Um, takes one to know one?