Heaven is an impossibility?

[Plecto]

Hi. I've been wondering about this issue, hope some of you could answer me

All humans have free will, therfore we can choose to do evil deeds. If heaven is a place with no sin and where everyone is happy, how can we then have free will? Let's say that a man killed several people by mistake and then died, would he be able to remember this when going to heaven? If so, I'm pretty sure he'd be very unhappy. If we would have no bad feelings in heaven we would be stripped of many of the features that make us human, right?

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Hi. I've been wondering about this issue, hope some of you could answer me

All humans have free will, therfore we can choose to do evil deeds. If heaven is a place with no sin and where everyone is happy, how can we then have free will? Let's say that a man killed several people by mistake and then died, would he be able to remember this when going to heaven? If so, I'm pretty sure he'd be very unhappy. If we would have no bad feelings in heaven we would be stripped of many of the features that make us human, right?

Very good question. Its something that I have thought about. We are all tempted to sin. Temptation comes from the devil. Adam and Eve sinned because of the devil's temptation. Now when all the saved are in heaven, after the second coming, when the devil is destroyed he can no temp anyone since he would be dead.

Another thing to remember is that we will not be human. We will be given incorruptible bodies. We shall be angellic. We will have emotions but not bad ones. The bible says there will be no more sorrow or pain or crying.

 

[BjorkIsCool]

Once we move on from this life and enter the place known as heaven we will retain a memory of our time here in this suffering universe, but we will be too joyous and enlightened to dwell on it. If or when someone does think of a memory from this universe they will feel a pang of pain/sorrow and hence not dwell on it; and hence that's why our memories of this universe will remain faint in heaven.

Heaven is another plane of existence. It must have natural boundaries and laws the same as this universe. As long as we exist we will always have free will i believe. I don't think the nature of heaven will let someone become overcome by a memory from this world.

What comes after heaven i don't know.

I wouldn't claim i'm 100% correct on anything though.

 

[Nadiine]

Hi. I've been wondering about this issue, hope some of you could answer me

All humans have free will, therfore we can choose to do evil deeds. If heaven is a place with no sin and where everyone is happy, how can we then have free will? Let's say that a man killed several people by mistake and then died, would he be able to remember this when going to heaven? If so, I'm pretty sure he'd be very unhappy. If we would have no bad feelings in heaven we would be stripped of many of the features that make us human, right?

I believe we have freedom of choices.... not so much "free will".

Aside from that, while we have a freedom to make choices, a Christian
HAS made their choice to serve Christ. Therefore, after judgment, He grants our request of giving us eternal life w/ Him in willing service.

We welcome anything or any way God provides it. (if it meant no
free will/choice later).
Further, once God judges all sin, there won't BE any sin for us to
choose to do; we will not have this sin nature we have and will
not be in any rebellion of any kind.
That's the whole point of judgment - to be rid of sin once and for all
without the inclination to it.

We aren't stripped of anything in heaven, we GAIN everything we
wanted - Eternal Righteousness
(I'll also add that it's your sin nature that would view it this way
to begin with - as if this would be the better scenario?)

 

[Tissue]

I believe we have freedom of choices.... not so much "free will".

Not really a difference.

@OP: One possible answer is that sin stems from ignorance. Once we properly see the wonder of things above, we will freely choose to live righteously.

 

[Emmy]

Dear Plecto. Adam and Eve were loving and obedient UNTIL they were tempted by a Serpent. Theiy ignored God`s loving advice to them, and believed/followed a lying temptor. God banished Adam and Eve and instead of repenting, they, and all who came after them, followed their own selfish will. We are on Earth to learn to love God above all else, He made us in His image, He loves us, and wants us back again. Heaven is our original home, and God wants us with Him for eternity. Jesus told us to become perfect, as God is perfect. But we live in an imperfect world, to exchange our selfish/wilful character into obedient and loving children of our Heavenly Father. That is not easy, and we have Jesus to help and guide us. We have years to change, we have God to forgive us each time we fall short, and by and by we will become better; IF we want to. Heaven is the place where God`s obedient children will live, it isa glorious possibility, If we repent, exchange our old nature into a new nature. The Bible will explain it more in detail, Plecto. I say this humbly and with love. Greetings from Emmy, sister in Christ.

 

[wannabeadesigirl]

I think heaven will be so wonderful because we will remember the pain we suffered on earth, but we will see where that pain brought us in completion, and when we see the end result that pain will result in more joy.
I believe this because Jesus, in his glorified body, still has the scars from his crucifixion, therefore he must have knowledge of what happened to him.

 

[Plecto]

Thanks for the response

I still don't get it though. To feel bad is a human feeling. Are you saying that in heaven is like walking around with a constant intoxication of cocaine? If I can't feel any bad feelings it would strip me of many of my human features.

 

[Joveia]

I would think it depends on what kind of bad emotions/thoughts you're talking about. Jesus was perfect and he felt absolutely terrible a lot of the time - Isaiah says he was a man of sorrows and acquainted with grief. So you can be perfect and feel terrible, especially if someone close to you dies. But I think the perfection in heaven is always having perfect intentions towards everyone. So you won't feel the negative emotion of e.g. envy, or arrogance, ever.

 

[Nadiine]

Not really a difference.

@OP: One possible answer is that sin stems from ignorance. Once we properly see the wonder of things above, we will freely choose to live righteously.

I don't think they're the same at all.

Free will is being able to do ANYTHING we want at will....
we don't actually have that and God can & does override our
will by not allowing us to do things - or hindering us from it.

We also can only operate within options we're given. Making
choices within the parameters we have. Not so much free will
to change those options set before us to have things our way.

Plecto:

I still don't get it though. To feel bad is a human feeling. Are you saying that in heaven is like walking around with a constant intoxication of cocaine? If I can't feel any bad feelings it would strip me of many of my human features.

If someone thinks heaven will be horrible and worse place than
where we are now, they truly need to reread the bible or get some
faith.

I don't know why you would want to be clinging onto this mortal,
sin nature body we have as if it's something we want to have
in heaven.

If you want to feel bad as a human, then maybe you don't want heaven at all?

 

[elephunky]

We wont be human in heaven, our spirits will rise to heaven, no all the other things attached to it. Free will as humans on earth and perfectness as spiritual beings in heaven

 

[Plecto]

Beeing perfect is not commiting any sins, right? Even though our spirits rise to heaven it is still the same spirit we have here on earth, and it is our spirit that makes us who we are? So it would still be ME that goes to heaven. Free will and perfectness does not collaborate. If we have free will then I can choose, even in heaven, to do sins.

 

[Armistead]

We will have freewill in heaven without sin. Adam and Eve had freewill before they sinned. They even knew it was wrong to eat from the tree, but they chose not to do it. It's a long doctrine, but freewill can exist without evil. It was God that deemed that evil would come to this world, not so much to bring freewill, because it already existed, it was just limited due to lack of knowledge. The fall gave us knowledge. That in itself was not evil, it is our choice or how we act on knowledge that makes it evil.

We will have no desire to act on evil in heaven because of beings will transform to the image of God and all things will be made clear. Once we have total understanding, truth and love, evil cannot exist.

 

[BreadAlone]

MOD HAT

Closed for Staff Review

 

[K9_Trainer]

Mod Hat On

Thread has been moved from Theology to Exploring Christianity. Please remember, the OP is the only non Christian allowed to post in this thread.

Thanks

Mod Hat Off
​

 

[ebia]

Hi. I've been wondering about this issue, hope some of you could answer me

All humans have free will, therfore we can choose to do evil deeds. If heaven is a place with no sin and where everyone is happy, how can we then have free will? Let's say that a man killed several people by mistake and then died, would he be able to remember this when going to heaven? If so, I'm pretty sure he'd be very unhappy. If we would have no bad feelings in heaven we would be stripped of many of the features that make us human, right?

I recommend reading "The Great Divorce". This is a subject much better explored in narrative than talked about in propositional terms.

Of course, one shouldn't talk about it being "in heaven". It's (New Heavens and) New Earth. The historic, original, Christian hope is for this creation to be put right and God's "Kingdom to come on earth as it is in heaven". Not to be whisked off to some other place. Certainly not a non-physical realm - that's gnostic, not Christian.