HEATHEN: The Objects of GOD'S Wrath?

[TheManeki]

I'm sure that SoF isn't using "heathen" solely to refer to pagans. He probably means everyone other than Real True Christians[sup]TM[/sup]: Atheists, agnostics, Hindus, Buddhists, Pagans, Muslims, Taoists, non-Nicene Christians, liberal Christians....

Basically anyone who disagrees with him.

 

[cantata]

I'm sure that SoF isn't using "heathen" solely to refer to pagans. He probably means everyone other than Real True Christians[sup]TM[/sup]: Atheists, agnostics, Hindus, Buddhists, Pagans, Muslims, Taoists, non-Nicene Christians, liberal Christians....

Basically anyone who disagrees with him.

Bingo.

 

[Caitlin.ann]

Heathen or pagan, I don't mind either but I generally use the term "pagan". Isn't there a specific pagan path called heathenism though?

 

[GrayCat]

Yeah, believers in Norse Reconstructionism and Asatru ( both slightly different) often prefer Heathen to describe their paths. It means "of the heath or the earth".

 

[Caitlin.ann]

Yeah, believers in Norse Reconstructionism and Asatru ( both slightly different) often prefer Heathen to describe their paths. It means "of the heath or the earth".

Okay, thanks for the clarification. I remember people at another site I frequent calling themselves "heathen" in particular but have never researched it. I figured it related to Norse paths, but wasn't sure if it was one particular one or many. Thanks again.

 

[~Wisdom Seeker~]

[BIBLE]Romans 9:13-24[/BIBLE]

I like to check when people post scripture, to make sure they are posting it verbatum. (I don't know you. And I've learned not to trust people on faith that their character is as honorable as my own. No offense)

I think this passage is meant to teach us humans that God created us, God's in control, and whether we understand it or not. God is God.

 

[Caitlin.ann]

RendaLane, who exactly are you directing your statement to? I'm a bit confused there.

 

[~Wisdom Seeker~]

The O.P. obviously.

 

[Caitlin.ann]

The O.P. obviously.

Oh well excuse me for not being certain when I didn't see anything about who the post was being directed towards.

 

[ShieldOFaith]

The Christian God in my opinion is a reflection of society at large..In Human Society there's people who love others and reach out to help people, there's people who are sort of apethetic and don't really care about others, and there's people who actively seek to harm anyone different from them and who feel alot of hatered and anger. And some people manifest a combination of these emtions and actions in their lifetime. The Christian God, in my view, is a mixture of all of these when you look at the conflicting bible passages, because some scripture says he's loving while other's says he's vengeful, and lots of stuff in between.

GrayCat, howdy.

There is no 'Human Society', 'Combinations', or conflicting Bible passages. There is one thing, one and only one thing that makes Christianity. Jesus Christ and Him crucified and risen from the dead!

God is very loving. He also is the One who chose who would become born again. It is holy and deep. Something that you need to study to understand fully.

However, like I said before, if you are not a Christian you will never fully understand it.

 

[psychedelicist]

GrayCat, howdy.

There is no 'Human Society', 'Combinations', or conflicting Bible passages. There is one thing, one and only one thing that makes Christianity. Jesus Christ and Him crucified and risen from the dead!

God is very loving. He also is the One who chose who would become born again. It is holy and deep. Something that you need to study to understand fully.

However, like I said before, if you are not a Christian you will never fully understand it.

and you as a christian will never feel the anger or outrage the rest of us feel at being left out of that little loop of knowledge and knowing that we will burn for it. and also i have to wonder why you brought the topic up in the first place if you know we cannot undertand it? its bad enough calling us inferior but you try and enlighten us with this thread nonetheless.

if we were meant to burn, we will. we do not need the proverbial other side trying to soften the blow by helping us try and understand why. if this is out of pity we want none, and the only other reason i can see for you to bring this up is that you are troubled by it as well (though you would never admit it outright) and are doing this to make yourself feel a little bit better, in which case we also don't want it.

luckily life and god would never be this callous so we really have nothing to fear.

 

[GrayCat]

All right, i can respect your opinion.

Thank you for responding politely to my post, without any huge capitalized words or five exclamation points in a row LOL

 

[Harpuia]

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]13 As it is written, "Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated." http://bible1.crosswalk.com/OnlineS...omans+9&section=0&version=nkj&language=en#F27 [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica] 14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not! 15 For He says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion." 16 So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, "For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth." 18 Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens. 19 You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who has resisted His will?" 20 But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, "Why have you made me like this?" 21 Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor? 22 What if God, wanting to show His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, 23 and that He might make known the riches of His glory on the vessels of mercy, which He had prepared beforehand for glory, 24 even us whom He called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles? --Romans 9[/FONT]
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Ok, this is the most controversial passage of Scripture in the Bible. I can only hope you understand why. If you don't; here is the reason.


1. God is saying that He hates someone.


2. God is saying that he will have Mercy on whom He wants, and others He will harden.


3. Some vessels were prepared for Destruction! Some were prepared for Mercy!


Now, all of you who are not "Calvinists" are going to lose your minds a bit here in this passage. It will come in three phases.



First: you will struggle to understand it.



Second: you will begin to understand it.




Third: RAGE!!!



This is understandable. It is hard to swallow that GOD would harden someones heart. It is hard to understand that God loved Jacob and hated Esau. It is hard to understand that GOD would raise Pharaoh up just so He could lay the Smack Down upon him and show forth His power!!!



The hardest thing to swallow in this passage of Scripture is this here:



[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica] 20 But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, "Why have you made me like this?" 21 Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor? [/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]This is all very HARD to swallow. This is all very HARD to think on. However, I believe it is necessary for us to learn the Word of God and understand it thoroughly.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]This is the very heart of Ethics and Morality. Because now you are forced to make a judgment call.
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[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]IS GOD RIGHT OR WRONG IN DOING WHAT HE DOES?[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Of course the answer is: HE IS RIGHT!!![/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]SOLI DEO GLORIA.
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How about you run for CF President? lol.

 

[Beanieboy]

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]
1. God is saying that He hates someone.


2. God is saying that he will have Mercy on whom He wants, and others He will harden.


3. Some vessels were prepared for Destruction! Some were prepared for Mercy!


Now, all of you who are not "Calvinists" are going to lose your minds a bit here in this passage. It will come in three phases.

On the contrary:
The bible also says that "For God so loved the world..."
That's everyone.

However, from my observations, it seems more that you are trying to justify your own hatred of your neighbour by showing the "hatred" of God, and trying to show how it aligns with your own. To do so, one has to ignore the call to love their neighbor.

 

[StarCannon]

*yawns* May the lightning of Thor strike the fool down.

 

[Caitlin.ann]

*yawns* May the lightning of Thor strike the fool down.

Agreed.

 

[Maren]

*yawns* May the lightning of Thor strike the fool down.

And afterward may Loki take his soul.

 

[Vene]

*yawns* May the lightning of Thor strike the fool down.

Agreed.

And afterward may Loki take his soul.

Now, now, is that any better than what SoF does?

 

[GrayCat]

Yeah, that'd stop the rants about hell and God's wrath.

 

[Caitlin.ann]

Now, now, is that any better than what SoF does?

Slightly.