having trouble understanding romance

[chaoticdestiny]

I am in a very complicated situation and need some assistance in understanding what parts of it are religion based and what parts are societal based, and hoping some of you are willing to help.

My ex bf has a friend who is very religious (follower of Christ). He came over to our house about a year ago for dinner. After the night of the dinner we started talking about religion (just between the two of us) via email. There was a strange energy between us that night and I was trying to figure out what it was. I thought perhaps it was just that I should learn more about Christianity from him. And for the most part that is what we talked about. This went on for about two months. Talking almost every day, mostly about religion and our differing opinions on things. Then we continued talking, still almost daily for another month, but would also talk about other things.

Somewhere in this time we both started having romantic feelings for each other. We had a lot in common except for the religion, our minds work the same way, and we made each other very happy. My ex (his friend) is an alcoholic, mentally abusive and sometimes physically abusive. a lot of this his friend (the one I've been talking to) doesn't know about. because of their friendship I did my best to never mention any of those things.

I left my ex about three months after his friend and I started talking. This had nothing to do with the friend, I was waiting for an apartment to open up at a place I could afford.

about a month after the break- up I hinted that I had feelings for him and he has been acting strange ever since. I know he has feelings for me, because he has hinted at it, and his body language screams it every time we see each other. And he never misses a bbq at my ex's house if he knows I will be there. (my ex and I still see each other because of our son and I feel more comfortable being there while they visit, though no one really knows that)

So this talking and then not talking went on for a few months, till one day I finally said, look I care too much about you to pretend I don't have feelings anymore. It hurts me too much to pretend with you. But I'm willing to keep things a secret until we can figure everything out.

Since then he has gone back and forth between being very distant and very friendly or flirtatious. He won't pursue me, but when we run into each other, which is at least once a week, he is always really friendly and flirts. (unless one of us is with my ex or someone who knows him because of my ex's issues)

So I text him to say hi and don't get a reply. When I try to ask about it he reflects the questions and I don't want to push the issue too much because I'm afraid I'll push him too far away.

I've fallen completely in love with him. I've prayed for God to show me what to do, to give me a sign or help me to understand. I normally run into him within a day or two of asking for help.

I've tried to fight the way I feel, but even now, months after this "strange" behaviour started I still miss him every day. I think a lot of this is because of the mixed signals I'm getting from him.

So I want to know how much of his behaviour is possibly because, from what I understand the bible "frowns" upon being in a relationship with those who haven't been saved.

I'm also wondering if he see's me leaving my ex (it was basically a common law marriage of 5 yrs), in some negative way, because I believe leaving your spouse is also not allowed or frowned upon.

I of course also acknowledge there could be some "bro code" issues going on here because a lot of people don't believe in going after a friends ex. But this isn't just some silly attraction for me. I haven't loved someone in this way for 15 years, I didn't even realize it until he started pulling away. I also don't belive its a silly attraction for him. (though I think he is a little obsessed with the sin of lust)

I think that love is one of Gods greatest gifts. And I think that though this may not be ideal, that if it was a blasphemy to Him he would not be pushing us together over and over. I literally run into him more than I do a lot of the neighbors I have in my apartment complex.

It's all just really confusing to me and would greatly appreciate any information, advice or enlightenment you can share with me.

(As for my personal beliefs I consider myself a non-lost agnostic, who takes what is good from many religions and combines them. I have some issues with the bible and while I believe in God and Jesus, I don't always agree with how the bible portrays them, which is the main reason I don't consider myself a Christian)

I'd like to thank you in advance for any help and/or prayers you are willing to give.

 

[seashale76]

This guy that you like is friends with your ex. You have a child with your ex. Even if he likes you- and it is likely he does from what you've said- it comes down to the 'bro code' thing over anything else. A relationship with you would put both of these men in a very awkward situation- and because you have a child- you're always going to have contact with your ex. However- if he's a Christian and you're an eclectic mish mash that isn't Christian- then that is also going to be a major factor- as well. So- I'd say it is a combination of both.

Literally- in our religion- one is not supposed to marry outside of the faith. I know some people do- but they are purposefully ignoring and compromising their faith to do so. The only people who get a pass on that are those who were married and then one becomes a Christian- and then whether or not they stay married is up to the non-Christian spouse.

I know it can be confusing when you feel the attraction between another person and yourself- but if that other person has multiple concerns over starting a relationship with you and has not made a move- then you just need to learn to let it go and move on.

 

[chaoticdestiny]

I wanted to thank you for your information. It was good of you to answer my question when so many read it and didn't.

Now I have an additional question. How is it that you believe in something that tells you who you can fall in love with? Judging not based on if a person is good, just on if they believe this one narrow minded book.

I don't know if I could ever believe in a religion that does that. And that takes me right back to why I think the bible is crap

 

[seashale76]

I wanted to thank you for your information. It was good of you to answer my question when so many read it and didn't.

Now I have an additional question. How is it that you believe in something that tells you who you can fall in love with? Judging not based on if a person is good, just on if they believe this one narrow minded book.

I don't know if I could ever believe in a religion that does that. And that takes me right back to why I think the bible is crap

Love is an action word- not a feeling. For the Christian, everything can be related back to communion/eucharist. Marriage is a sacrament. It is also considered a martyrdom. You deny yourself for the sake of your spouse. You also aren't joined together with someone who also isn't in communion. When you engage in fornication or marry out of the faith- it is a proclamation that you are refusing to deny yourself for the sake of Christ and are choosing to engage your passions- you are knowingly excommunicating yourself. When one is baptized into Christ they are part of the body of Christ- the temple of the Holy Spirit- receiving Christ in the Holy Mysteries. Willfully sinning in this manner is serious business- one risks their soul unless they repent and return to the hospital for what ails us.

 

[chaoticdestiny]

Love may be an action word, but it is a feeling. It's a mix of a million emotions and desires, some that can be described and some that cannot.

Is that a generally accepted thing in Christianity? That love isn't a feeling, just an action? If so, what do you call the feelings that most people would call love?

Honestly, I'm curious. This could help explain a few things

 

[seashale76]

Attraction doesn't equal love. Feelings and emotions- while we all have them- are rather fickle things. I'm also not speaking for Christianity when I'm talking about that particular topic- but my own view. However- the bible mentions different types of love in the Greek.

Greek words for love - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Christianity- despite what you think- doesn't stop anyone from doing anything. However- one is either with the program or they're not- so to speak- and practicing Christians are supposed to know what the program is. Inter-faith relationships always have one or both people involved compromising their beliefs. A practicing Christian would be compromising his/her beliefs to marry outside of their faith- as it is the same as declaring they no longer want to be a Christian. It is what it is.

Just because someone is attracted to you doesn't mean they want to take the chance on having a relationship with you. Some people know it won't work out and move on before they become too emotionally vested.

 

[seashale76]

dp

 

[chaoticdestiny]

any other opinions on the situation? or does that pretty much sum up everyone's thoughts on the situation?

 

[joey_downunder]

From iTablet:
the man you are interested in is (of course) the best person to approach. The best you'll get online is speculation.
What I can add is that I am the wife of a non-Christian. I foolishly kidded myself that a "moral man" was good enough. It is very difficult at times when I know my husband has a completely different worldview, priorities, perspectives etc.
If this relationship does progress further then this issue has to be addressed.

 

[paul1149]

I think you've enumerated the possible factors very well. The question is which ones are in play.

Christians love Jesus above all else. If we place anyone or any thing before Him it becomes an idol that will eventually draw us away. When we put Him first, everything else will fall into place according to His good and perfect will (Matthew 6.33).

Sexual relations have "one-flesh" spiritual connotations, so that is why marriage is only to be between two believers. Otherwise we will have deep conflict. (1Corinthians 6.15-20)

I don't know which factor is driving his conflicted behavior. I suppose the best thing would be to talk to him about it, in an oblique abstract way if necessary. My main concern is your misunderstanding of the Bible. It's a very common phenomenon that is very spiritually destructive. OTOH, Jesus' promise is that if we remain in His word, we will know the truth and the truth will make us free. (John 8.31-ff) You value both truth and prayer. Why not pursue this further with the Lord?

 

[paul1149]

Also, to your question about romance, and about feelings v. actions. Feelings and romance are great, but only when the right foundation is in place. The emotions are like a fire. When they are in the fireplace they warm us and give light and comfort. But out of place they can burn down the whole house. This is why the Bible teaches us to guard the heart and get the fundamentals right. Once they are in place, we are free to enjoy the feelings safely and fruitfully.

So in the best case, love will include both feelings and actions. But doing the right thing and building the house correctly has to come first, and that is why the distinction sometimes must be made. Our natural human focus on feelings often ends in disaster because as a culture we have largely forgotten the sound counsel of the Word of God.

 

[Spaceman 3]

Hi Chaotic...

From a man's perspective:

1. This man is your ex's friend. He is also a 'Christian'.

I would expect that he feels very uncomfortable about dating you, in consideration of his relationship with your ex. He's probably a bit anxious about it too, especially if your ex is prone to bouts of verbal & physical abuse.

As a Christian, it would negate any witness of Christ that he has, if your ex was to discover the truth that your relationship essentially started while you & your ex (his friend) were still together.

Even if he was prepared to abandon his friendship with your ex, they would be forever entangled, because of your son. Does he consider a relationship with you to be worth it?

On one occasion, I had a beautiful woman pursue me. Whilst she was younger than me by a few years, she already had a child of two years old. I was with her for a month or so, during which time I began to feel that I was falling in love with her. At this point I decided to get the hell out! I was a young single guy - I didn't really need the lifelong baggage of a child that wasn't mine with an ex/father of her child on the scene. Some people can do that, I couldn't. I often think about her, but I never regret what I did under the circumstances

2. Maybe he's just stringing you along.

3. I'm inclined to believe that romance is a human invention designed for poetry, literature, music & films etc. It's all a bit of a 'lovely, fluffy dreamstate' to describe sexual attraction. It's not love - love is bloody hard work!

3. Maybe he's gay... LOL

 

[chaoticdestiny]

I wanted to thank you for the additional responses. It gives me some things to consider.

When I try to talk to him about the situation he pulls away and won't talk or says he doesn't like anyone. And I would easily take all of this at face value if it wasn't for one thing, the look on his face when he sees me.

His eyes always light up and he gets this smile. His body language screams that he likes me. I guess that is where the question originated.....

anyway thank you again for the help

 

[Sedoy]

If he is a good Christian he knows that not matter the level of attraction it is not going to work out between you two. Bible specifically warns against being “unequally yoked” with unbelievers.

Love is an emotion but is comes from choice not from emotion. He chose to love God you did not. Same way he can choose to love you but he knows that it is wrong. Attraction is not enough to make somebody love. People are attracted to all kinds of things they are not supposed to.

Do not make good man fall into sin. Leave him alone. Sounds like his first love is God and obeying God.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I am in a very complicated situation and need some assistance in understanding what parts of it are religion based and what parts are societal based, and hoping some of you are willing to help.

My ex bf has a friend who is very religious (follower of Christ). He came over to our house about a year ago for dinner. After the night of the dinner we started talking about religion (just between the two of us) via email. There was a strange energy between us that night and I was trying to figure out what it was. I thought perhaps it was just that I should learn more about Christianity from him. And for the most part that is what we talked about. This went on for about two months. Talking almost every day, mostly about religion and our differing opinions on things. Then we continued talking, still almost daily for another month, but would also talk about other things.

Somewhere in this time we both started having romantic feelings for each other. We had a lot in common except for the religion, our minds work the same way, and we made each other very happy. My ex (his friend) is an alcoholic, mentally abusive and sometimes physically abusive. a lot of this his friend (the one I've been talking to) doesn't know about. because of their friendship I did my best to never mention any of those things.

I left my ex about three months after his friend and I started talking. This had nothing to do with the friend, I was waiting for an apartment to open up at a place I could afford.

about a month after the break- up I hinted that I had feelings for him and he has been acting strange ever since. I know he has feelings for me, because he has hinted at it, and his body language screams it every time we see each other. And he never misses a bbq at my ex's house if he knows I will be there. (my ex and I still see each other because of our son and I feel more comfortable being there while they visit, though no one really knows that)

So this talking and then not talking went on for a few months, till one day I finally said, look I care too much about you to pretend I don't have feelings anymore. It hurts me too much to pretend with you. But I'm willing to keep things a secret until we can figure everything out.

Since then he has gone back and forth between being very distant and very friendly or flirtatious. He won't pursue me, but when we run into each other, which is at least once a week, he is always really friendly and flirts. (unless one of us is with my ex or someone who knows him because of my ex's issues)

So I text him to say hi and don't get a reply. When I try to ask about it he reflects the questions and I don't want to push the issue too much because I'm afraid I'll push him too far away.

I've fallen completely in love with him. I've prayed for God to show me what to do, to give me a sign or help me to understand. I normally run into him within a day or two of asking for help.

I've tried to fight the way I feel, but even now, months after this "strange" behaviour started I still miss him every day. I think a lot of this is because of the mixed signals I'm getting from him.

So I want to know how much of his behaviour is possibly because, from what I understand the bible "frowns" upon being in a relationship with those who haven't been saved.

I'm also wondering if he see's me leaving my ex (it was basically a common law marriage of 5 yrs), in some negative way, because I believe leaving your spouse is also not allowed or frowned upon.

I of course also acknowledge there could be some "bro code" issues going on here because a lot of people don't believe in going after a friends ex. But this isn't just some silly attraction for me. I haven't loved someone in this way for 15 years, I didn't even realize it until he started pulling away. I also don't belive its a silly attraction for him. (though I think he is a little obsessed with the sin of lust)

I think that love is one of Gods greatest gifts. And I think that though this may not be ideal, that if it was a blasphemy to Him he would not be pushing us together over and over. I literally run into him more than I do a lot of the neighbors I have in my apartment complex.

It's all just really confusing to me and would greatly appreciate any information, advice or enlightenment you can share with me.

(As for my personal beliefs I consider myself a non-lost agnostic, who takes what is good from many religions and combines them. I have some issues with the bible and while I believe in God and Jesus, I don't always agree with how the bible portrays them, which is the main reason I don't consider myself a Christian)

I'd like to thank you in advance for any help and/or prayers you are willing to give.

From the sound of it, he doesn't want to damage his friendship with your ex. You may not consider your ex's feelings about you and the friend being a couple as a big issue...but I'd bet that he does. I don't know how long they've been friends, or how good of friends they are, but that seems to clearly be the issue.

It doesn't really come into anything like a "bro-code" anyway, its a respect issue. He respects his friend's (your ex's) feelings enough to want to avoid potentially hurting him. That's part of it. The other part may be that since you have a child with your ex, he'd never be free of that betrayal of his friend if you started dating or were a couple. It's not as if he could betray him, apologize and try to explain his feelings for you, and then just avoid your ex thereafter. Inevitably, he's going to have continued contact with your ex, the friend he betrayed, because you'll have continued contact with him. Are you really having a hard time understanding that? Can you put yourself in his shoes and imagine that he fathered a child by your best friend, it didn't work out, they broke up, and now he wants to see you instead. You could basically count on no longer having that friend....right?

He seems like a nice guy, and even though you have good conversations and he's a bit flirty and you have a lot in common, you might also consider he's not as into you as you are him. It could be that he just finds you attractive and thinks you're a really cool girl to talk to. He's decided (seemingly) that pursuing you isn't worth losing a friend. I can't speak for every guy, but I'd give up all my friends to be with my wife...without hesitation. I didn't have to...I only had to give up one (a friend of hers/fwb of mine)...but I honestly didn't even think twice about it.