Harry Potter

[KrimsonDraegon]

Something that is hotly debated, even today, is Harry Potter. “Oh no,” you moan, “not another Harry Potter post.” But I assure you that I would not put in my two cents unless I had something new to add to the dispute. Harry Potter is a book about a young boy who attends a very special school with his two friends Hermione, and Ron. They are your average teenagers who live in the United Kingdom and every year encounter and conquer a variety of challenges. “So what’s wrong with the book? Sounds entertaining.” Well, there is one other thing I left out. The most important thing of all. Harry and Hermione and Ron are sorcerers. They attend a school known as “Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry.” “Oh. Well I certainly don’t want my children learning witchcraft.” This is my point though: the books do not teach witchcraft. The books are wholesome, entertaining, and I have not yet seen (or heard of) a person who has read these books attempting to perform witchcraft. Not even so much as a simple spell. These books do contain some spells; but let’s get real people. The books do not actually tell you how the spell works, or what you need for a potion. These books, for all intents and purposes, are just for fun. When we need to watch out for our children is when they go to the bookstore or library and pick out books like “A beginner’s guide to witchcraft” or “The Satanic Verses.” So while we squabble over a simple children’s book there are many children already out there who have joined covens, or who are purchasing and reading these books that really do instruct witchcraft. I am not attempting to tell you how to raise your children, or what to believe. What you choose to read, and what you allow your children to read is up to you. I am merely presenting the facts. I also know that there are those out there who are so one minded that they will never believe anything other than what they already believe. I would ask those people not to RESPOND to ANY of my messages OR to CONTACT me. Thank you.

 

[Arikereba]

When we need to watch out for our children is when they go to the bookstore or library and pick out books like “A beginner’s guide to witchcraft” or “The Satanic Verses.”

I'd just like to comment that "The Satanic Verses" does not in any way advocate satanism. It's a book that has its background in Muslim thought and is heavily critical of Islam, that certainly is philosophical and addresses the nature of good and evil... the title is misleading, though.

 

[Abbadon]

I agree that Harry Potter ain't bad, and the same goes for Dungeons and Dragons, and rock music!

D&D: The players make the story, so there's actually Christian potential there.

Rock: There are Christian rock bands, and not just the quiet, soft, nice kind.

 

[tulc]

“The Satanic Verses.”

uhmm do you mean "the Satanic Bible" By Anton LeVey?
tulc(just trying to help)

 

[Abbadon]

No, that's a different book. There's the Satanic Bible and then there's the Satanic verses. The Satanic verses have already been explained, the Satanic Bible is mostly an attack on "weak" ideas like belief in an afterlife and forgiveness, and support for using ritual magic.

Interesting side note, the pentagram was used by medival Christians to represent the five wounds of Christ. Some Christians with too much spare time that hung out with a lot of Kabbalists arranged YHWH around the pentagram, threw in the Hebrew letter Shin (which was supposed to represent fire and the Holy Spirit), and got YHShWH, or Yehoshua, the historical name of the person we know as good ol' JC. For some reason I haven't been able to find yet, they tossed Adam and Eve inside the pentagram.

The reason the pentagram became associated with Satanism was because of Eliphas Levi, who lived about a century ago. He wrote a lot of books about black magic and stuff, and in one of them he inverted the pentagram, tossed in a goat's head (Moloch), replaced Adam and Eve with Samael and Lilith (Kabbalistic bad-guys) and replaced YHShWH with the Hebrew name for Leviathan.

Sorry, I know this doesn't have much to do with the forum, but I just thought that was an interesting side note.

 

[Amielia]

I agree with krimsondraegon, i do not see the point of arguing over a childrens book. When I was younger we read it in my 6th grade class *the first book* for some reason, i cant remember now, they didnt seem to ahve a problem then I think ppl over analyze things. * but that is my opinion *

 

[KrimsonDraegon]

I meant the Satan bible. My bad.

Roleplaying games are good fun, but what the Christian Church doens't like about them is that they consume weak-minded people. Dungeons and Dragons uses references to Satanism, so I do not think it is something for Christians to play, but I haven't really studied D&D, so I do not know the whole story.

I love Christian Rock. I have many CD's, Skillet, dc Talk (which is rock, but it is soft rock), Pillar, Disciple, etc.

The only thing I have found in Harry Potter I do not agree with is that the four houses of Hogwarts are named from Satan's four generals who lead it's hellish armies. They are gryphynddor, hugglepus, slygtherin, and ravenclaw. I do not remember the exact spelling, but that is close enough.

Otherwise, I think that Harry Potter is great fun, and I enjoy how witty J.K. is, even if I do not like the attitude she has developed since becoming a success. For those of you who did read the books, something to think about. Professor Lupin's (The werewolf) name comes from the latin word for wolf (lupus = wolf).

 

[Arikereba]

The only thing I have found in Harry Potter I do not agree with is that the four houses of Hogwarts are named from Satan's four generals who lead it's hellish armies. They are gryphynddor, hugglepus, slygtherin, and ravenclaw. I do not remember the exact spelling, but that is close enough.

Do you have a citation for this?

If Satan's got a general named Hufflepuff, he really needs a better PR department...

Seriously, Rowling displays some pretty creative naming throughout the series, and I'm pretty sure the house names are just an extension of that.

 

[Karl - Liberal Backslider]

Sounds like a myth to me.

 

[Im_A]

i'm all for Harry Potter. i love all 3 of them and i'm for playing D&D. it's fantasy/fiction. if people want to take a hay day with spells and magic, then maybe Christians should judge the beloved C.S. Lewis for writing fantasy novels. that's all i have to say about this, because it is pointless getting ants in our pants over things like Harry Potter, D&D and other stuff. people forget it is fictional fantasy, but it's not worth the time of whether if it is a moral issue to watch or play if you ask me.

 

[seebs]

The only thing I have found in Harry Potter I do not agree with is that the four houses of Hogwarts are named from Satan's four generals who lead it's hellish armies. They are gryphynddor, hugglepus, slygtherin, and ravenclaw. I do not remember the exact spelling, but that is close enough.

Could you offer any kind of citation for this comment? I mean, I've been hanging around weird people for years, I've known occultists, I've read tons of stuff... And I've never heard anything the slightest bit similar to this until just today. The most similar I could think of would be the names chosen in The Screwtape Letters, e.g., "Screwtape" or "Wormwood".

 

[mark53]

Harry Potter (in Adelaide, South Australia) there is a real Harry Potter, he works, or did last year when I last heard his name worked as a T V reporter.

Oh well it was different!

When the last book came out last year I decided to read all of the books from page 1 book 1 right through. It took me 8 days!

There were many interesting thoughts that I had. One was that Harry's parents gave their life that he may life. If you read Harry Potter book with an open Christian mind you will find many exciting and challenging Christian ideas.

Even the simple thought that they celebrated Christmas each year.

If we really want to serach for evil and evil thoughts - we need to start with our own thoughts of ourselves and how we relate to other people, especially those who we disagree with. Just look at International Affairs - Middle East etc, etc.

If you are not sure if Harry Potter books are "safe" for children or any one PLEASE read them yourself (with an open, Jesus centered mind) and you may be surprised at what you read. LOOK FOR Christian thoughts and teachings in all that you read and NOT for what the other fella does!

 

[D'Ann]

Greetings All,

The Harry Potter books remind me of the Hobbit books written by Tolkien who was Catholic. Although, I don't know about Rowlings... what her faith is... I wonder though.

God's Peace,

D'Ann

 

[D'Ann]

Could you offer any kind of citation for this comment? I mean, I've been hanging around weird people for years, I've known occultists, I've read tons of stuff... And I've never heard anything the slightest bit similar to this until just today. The most similar I could think of would be the names chosen in The Screwtape Letters, e.g., "Screwtape" or "Wormwood".

I don't know many occultists and I'm not at all familiar with occultists thingies... At the same time, I would think that if the four houses were truly named after the four generals in Satan's army... I'm sure, the Christian speakers and all -would be broadcasting that on all of the T.V. and Radio channels. Is there some kind of proof to this claim? Please let me know. We read these books, but if there is some kind of hidden evil agenda, it would be nice to be clued in on it.

D'Ann

 

[Randall McNally]

Roleplaying games are good fun, but what the Christian Church doens't like about them is that they consume weak-minded people. Dungeons and Dragons uses references to Satanism, so I do not think it is something for Christians to play, but I haven't really studied D&D, so I do not know the whole story.

It's been a good 20 years since I have even cracked a D&D book, but I played pretty regularly in junior high. I had at least two editions of each volume and I do not remember any obvious references or connections to Satanism. There is certainly liberal use of demons, undead and such but the hell-structure is not particularly Judeo-Christian; it always seemed to me Norse or something. There were Nine Hells, IIRC, and no supreme overlord or anything.

More than anything it seemed to be an amalgam of several different mythologies.

 

[seebs]

I found someone once who was making all sorts of elaborate claims about what D&D teaches about the occult, actually tracked down some of the pages cited... It was hilariously bad misquoting.

I think a lot of churches just make stuff up to scare people.

 

[Abbadon]

The current third edition doesn't make any outright references to modern religion in the basic kit (except for the Dieties and Demigods book, but that was only Norse, I think Greek, and they did mention monotheistic campaign ideas). First edition was actually a little conservative for my tastes, only LAWFUL good characters could get into the seventh heaven, I always play chaotic good, and the general concensus among my D&D is that God is neutral good. The first edition has a list of books that inspired it, and Lewis and Tolkien (both Christian authors) showed up quite a bit.

The only "satanic" references I can find in D&D would be the possible use of a pentagram, but that was only became associated with Satanism and black magic in the early 20th century. Medieval Christians actually used it to represent the five wounds of Christ. The spell system, if you go according to the effects and not the titles, would place many of the Old Testament prophets in the wizard/sorcerer/magic-user classes, and not cleric or paladin. At least, as far as I've been able to figure out.

Oh! I almost forgot, here's my favorite D&D website, it's run by a Presbyterian minister!
http://www.mjyoung.net/dungeon/

According to the article he wrote ("Confessions of a D&D Addict"; check that out, too), he actually uses D&D as a ministry tool.

Oh, almost forgot again, I realized another "satanic" reference in D&D, the fact that the game contains "demons". These are imaginary story characters that the players might have their imaginary characters face.

 

[KrimsonDraegon]

I read the thing about Satan's generals off a Christian Website somewhere, I am looking for it and will post it as soon as I find it. (The Hogwart's houses are Slytherin, Ravenclaw, Gryphindor, and Hufflepuff, I know that, but the generals have a different spelling).

I do not know enough about D&D to make an informed decision, but from what I have seen it looks like a lot of fun. I am very into mythologies from any place. I particularly love Norse, and Japanese mythology. I did have a youth minister who was a DM and often brought in his books and played with some of the other kids.

I know it is not really an RPG, but I am a big fan of Black and White (B&W) and am anxiously awaiting the sequel (which at this rate may never come out, lol... HURRY UP LIONHEAD!) For those not familiar with B&W it is a game under the "god" genre. This means that you are in a position where you need to interact with the characters, but typically cannot directly influence them. In B&W you play a god, and need to gain believers, and battle other gods. You get to play as good (white) or evil (black) or a mixture of both Black and White!) (I try to start out good, but typically get angry at my followers as they tend to slack off and leave me all of the work, then I turn evil and electrocute some of them to get them in gear, lol).

To D'Ann. There is no hidden evil agenda.

 

[morningstar2651]

Harry Potter leads people to Satanism? -- FALSE

Rowling has confessed herself to be a great fan of C. S. Lewis, her use of "J. R." for her byline evokes "J. R. R." Tolkien, and she is a member of the Church of Scotland (that's Presbyterian, for American readers).

(Source)

Neither you nor your children will burn in Hell for all eternity for reading good fiction.

Also, here is a nice long list of demons...I'm pretty sure General Hufflepuff didn't make the list.

 

[GaelSong]

I love Harry Potter too. I think people get caught up in the witchcraft angle and forget it is a work of childrens fiction. You don't have to read it.