Harris and the Persistence of Memory

[Ana the Ist]

A special prosecutor was dispatched to investigate Biden's taking and disclosure of classified docs during his tenure as VP....turned over 7 years later (roughly) by his lawyers.

The prosecutor, unsurprisingly, didn't recommend charges for the sitting president...but to his credit, his reason for doing so was honest. He said what even those in denial struggled to deny after Biden's debate....his mind is gone. He couldn't remember well his time as VP...and couldn't remember much of anything regarding the docs. The sitting president.

Some would dismiss this as partisan hackery without knowing anything about the special prosecutor. I'd say that while nobody probably expected charges....at least he was honest. It would have been nice to see the same honesty from Harris...but she did what the media did....and lied to the public about the president.

Thoughts?

 

[Vambram]

In my opinion, if there was an Academy Award giving to best actress in a short news conference, I believe that Kamala Harris would win that proverbial Oscar award and any second place finisher would be waaaay behind in votes for that Oscar award.

 

[Ana the Ist]

In my opinion, if there was an Academy Award giving to best actress in a short news conference, I believe that Kamala Harris would win that proverbial Oscar award and any second place finisher would be waaaay behind in votes for that Oscar award.

I probably wouldn't have made the thread if I hadn't seen her begging for 10$ donations online maybe 7 times today.

Give 10$? Does she understand everyone is paying more for everything because of her administration? Has she even spent 10$ of her own money on the campaign?

She really had only 1 job this entire administration....be a woman, be non-white, and give answers that don't sound stupid. She succeeded on 2 of those. What is she even running on?

 

[Pommer]

Thoughts?

Vice-President does her job, taking point for her C-i-C, says what she has to say.

What did you expect she would do?

 

[Hammster]

A special prosecutor was dispatched to investigate Biden's taking and disclosure of classified docs during his tenure as VP....turned over 7 years later (roughly) by his lawyers.

The prosecutor, unsurprisingly, didn't recommend charges for the sitting president...but to his credit, his reason for doing so was honest. He said what even those in denial struggled to deny after Biden's debate....his mind is gone. He couldn't remember well his time as VP...and couldn't remember much of anything regarding the docs. The sitting president.

Some would dismiss this as partisan hackery without knowing anything about the special prosecutor. I'd say that while nobody probably expected charges....at least he was honest. It would have been nice to see the same honesty from Harris...but she did what the media did....and lied to the public about the president.

Thoughts?

Well, as Jon Stewart said “Can we see those videos?”

 

[A2SG]

The prosecutor, unsurprisingly, didn't recommend charges for the sitting president...but to his credit, his reason for doing so was honest. He said what even those in denial struggled to deny after Biden's debate....his mind is gone.

No, he never said that.

He couldn't remember well his time as VP...and couldn't remember much of anything regarding the docs. The sitting president.

Some would dismiss this as partisan hackery without knowing anything about the special prosecutor. I'd say that while nobody probably expected charges....at least he was honest. It would have been nice to see the same honesty from Harris...but she did what the media did....and lied to the public about the president.

Thoughts?

If you're going to cite special counsel Hur, at least take the time to read what he wrote. His report is easily available online.

Hur gave his reasons for not recommending prosecution: "However, for the reasons summarized below, we conclude that the evidence does not establish Mr. Biden's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt."

Also: "Nevertheless, we do not believe this evidence is sufficient, as jurors would likely find reasonable doubt for one or more of several reasons."

Granted, Hur did mention that Biden's memory was poor. Specifically, he described him as "a sympathetic, well-meaning, elderly man with a poor memory", but he did not say Biden's mind was gone. Not at any point in the report. He described him that way to show that a jury would likely not find that he displayed intent to commit a crime, a necessary component of the charge.

The full passage:

We have also considered that, at trial, Mr. Biden would likely present himself to a jury, as he did during our interview of him, as a sympathetic, well-meaning, elderly man with a poor memory. Based on our direct interactions with and observations of him, he is someone for whom many jurors will want to identify reasonable doubt. It would be difficult to convince a jury that they should convict him - by then a former president well into his eighties - of a serious felony that requires a mental state of willfulness.​

​

We conclude the evidence is not sufficient to convict, and we decline to recommend prosecution of Mr. Biden for his retention of the classified Afghanistan documents. ​

If you're gonna call for honesty, at least try to be honest.

-- A2SG, though, I know that's not in the right-wing rulebook....

 

[Ana the Ist]

No, he never said that.

I was paraphrasing.

If you're going to cite special counsel Hur, at least take the time to read what he wrote. His report is easily available online.

I did.

Hur gave his reasons for not recommending prosecution: "However, for the reasons summarized below, we conclude that the evidence does not establish Mr. Biden's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt."

Also: "Nevertheless, we do not believe this evidence is sufficient, as jurors would likely find reasonable doubt for one or more of several reasons."

Granted, Hur did mention that Biden's memory was poor. Specifically, he described him as "a sympathetic, well-meaning, elderly man with a poor memory", but he did not say Biden's mind was gone. Not at any point in the report. He described him that way to show that a jury would likely not find that he displayed intent to commit a crime, a necessary component of the charge.

The full passage:

We have also considered that, at trial, Mr. Biden would likely present himself to a jury, as he did during our interview of him, as a sympathetic, well-meaning, elderly man with a poor memory. Based on our direct interactions with and observations of him, he is someone for whom many jurors will want to identify reasonable doubt. It would be difficult to convince a jury that they should convict him - by then a former president well into his eighties - of a serious felony that requires a mental state of willfulness.​

​

We conclude the evidence is not sufficient to convict, and we decline to recommend prosecution of Mr. Biden for his retention of the classified Afghanistan documents. ​

If you're gonna call for honesty, at least try to be honest.

-- A2SG, though, I know that's not in the right-wing rulebook....

Yeah...let's take a look.

Mr. Biden wrote his 2007 and 2017 memoirs with the help of a ghostwriter. In a recorded conversation with his ghostwriter in February 2017, about a month afterhe left office, Mr. Biden said, while referencing his 2009 Thanksgiving memo, that he had "just found all the classified stuff downstairs." At the time, he was renting a home in Virginia, where he met his ghostwriter to work on his second memoir. Downstairs
from where they met was Mr. Biden's office, where he stored his papers. He moved out of the Virginia home in 2019, consolidating his belongings in Delaware-where FBI agents later found marked classified documents about the Afghanistan troop surge in his garage..

If he's a "well meaning elderly man with poor memory" regarding something from 2017....then it's not difficult to understand why his brain couldn't form a coherent sentence or idea for the first five minutes of the debate.

His brain is mush. I know it, Harris definitely knows it. You're clearly in denial.

Imagine....imagine a former VP telling his autobiographer that he has classified docs in his home....and then raiding the former president 4 years later for the same thing. There's nothing working upstairs with Biden and it clearly hasn't been for some time.

 

[A2SG]

I was paraphrasing.

No, you misrepresented what he said.

I did.

Coulda fooled me.

Yeah...let's take a look.

Mr. Biden wrote his 2007 and 2017 memoirs with the help of a ghostwriter. In a recorded conversation with his ghostwriter in February 2017, about a month afterhe left office, Mr. Biden said, while referencing his 2009 Thanksgiving memo, that he had "just found all the classified stuff downstairs." At the time, he was renting a home in Virginia, where he met his ghostwriter to work on his second memoir. Downstairs
from where they met was Mr. Biden's office, where he stored his papers. He moved out of the Virginia home in 2019, consolidating his belongings in Delaware-where FBI agents later found marked classified documents about the Afghanistan troop surge in his garage..

If he's a "well meaning elderly man with poor memory" regarding something from 2017....then it's not difficult to understand why his brain couldn't form a coherent sentence or idea for the first five minutes of the debate.

His brain is mush. I know it, Harris definitely knows it. You're clearly in denial.

I didn't say a word about Biden's mental state. I only quoted Hur. I've never met President Biden, I can't speak to his mental state myself. Then or now.

Imagine....imagine a former VP telling his autobiographer that he has classified docs in his home....and then raiding the former president 4 years later for the same thing. There's nothing working upstairs with Biden and it clearly hasn't been for some time.

You're free to interpret what happened any way you wish. But if you want to cite Hur's report, it doesn't make for a good case when you completely misrepresent what he said.

He didn't claim Biden's mind was gone. He said the evidence did not prove Biden's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, nor did he feel the jury would see it that way either. So he chose not to recommend prosecution.

What is clear, and beyond doubt, is that Biden didn't refuse to return the classified documents when asked to, nor did he intentionally obstruct efforts to retain them. Unlike some other former presidents I could name.

-- A2SG, but I won't, because they're not the topic of this thread....

 

[Ana the Ist]

No, you misrepresented what he said.

How?

Coulda fooled me.

I'm not needed for that lol.

You're free to interpret what happened any way you wish. But if you want to cite Hur's report, it doesn't make for a good case when you completely misrepresent what he said.

How so?

He didn't claim Biden's mind was gone.

He's quite literally choosing not to prosecute on the idea that Biden would likely present himself as unable to remember anything.

He said the evidence did not prove Biden's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, nor did he feel the jury would see it that way either.

The remarkable part of course is Biden’s memory kicking in around 2022 midterms when he was likely to get investigated by Congress regarding documents lol.

What is clear, and beyond doubt, is that Biden didn't refuse to return the classified documents when asked to

Biden cooperating with his own investigation of himself doesn't impress me the way it does you.

 

[A2SG]

How?

You claimed that Hur believed Biden's mind was gone. Hur never said anything even remotely like that.

Which was probably why you needed to paraphrase him instead of quote him, I suppose.

He's quite literally choosing not to prosecute on the idea that Biden would likely present himself as unable to remember anything.

No. He explicitly said:

"However, for the reasons summarized below, we conclude that the evidence does not establish Mr. Biden's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt."

Also: "Nevertheless, we do not believe this evidence is sufficient, as jurors would likely find reasonable doubt for one or more of several reasons."

And: "We conclude the evidence is not sufficient to convict, and we decline to recommend prosecution of Mr. Biden for his retention of the classified Afghanistan documents."

Insufficient evidence, and reasonable doubt were the specific reasons stated. Any inferences and assumptions beyond that you made up, all by yourself.

The remarkable part of course is Biden’s memory kicking in around 2022 midterms when he was likely to get investigated by Congress regarding documents lol.



Biden cooperating with his own investigation of himself doesn't impress me the way it does you.

Okay then.

-- A2SG, you're free to ascribe any nefarious motives to anyone's actions that you want to.....

 

[Ana the Ist]

You claimed that Hur believed Biden's mind was gone. Hur never said anything even remotely like that.

Context guy...Context.

We aren't talking about Joe's yearly checkup with his wife.

We're talking about whether or not he can be held accountable for a crime.

"elderly man with a poor memory"

If his memory is so bad he can't be held accountable for a crime then his mind is gone.

 

[A2SG]

Context guy...Context.

That's just another way of saying you're making stuff up.

I quoted him, remember? He did not say what you want to pretend he said.

We aren't talking about Joe's yearly checkup with his wife.

We're talking about whether or not he can be held accountable for a crime.

"elderly man with a poor memory"

If his memory is so bad he can't be held accountable for a crime then his mind is gone.

That wasn't the reason Hur gave for declining prosecution.

Read it again. It's there. You can find it if you try.

-- A2SG, or you can keep making stuff up....nothing wrong with a healthy.....

 

[Ana the Ist]

That's just another way of saying you're making stuff up.

Real word....real meaning.

Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years!

www.dictionary.com

How would you describe someone who's memory is so bad it's an excuse for their crimes?

It's not a question of whether or not he broke the law....he did. He had the documents in his possession, he shared them with someone he shouldn't have....those are the facts.

 

[A2SG]

Real word....real meaning.

Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years!

www.dictionary.com

How would you describe someone who's memory is so bad it's an excuse for their crimes?

Again, Hur never said Biden's memory excused anything.

It's not a question of whether or not he broke the law....he did. He had the documents in his possession, he shared them with someone he shouldn't have....those are the facts.

And Hur declined to prosecute because....

(sing along if you know the words!)

Insufficient Evidence and Reasonable Doubt!

-- A2SG, catchy tune.....

 

[Ana the Ist]

And Hur declined to prosecute because....

We can go the reasons Hur listed if you like...

They range from Biden forgot he had the docs to Biden forgot he wasn't supposed to share them.

 

[A2SG]

We can go the reasons Hur listed if you like...

They range from Biden forgot he had the docs to Biden forgot he wasn't supposed to share them.

Let's let Hur speak for himself, for a change:

"However, for the reasons summarized below, we conclude that the evidence does not establish Mr. Biden's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt."

"Nevertheless, we do not believe this evidence is sufficient, as jurors would likely find reasonable doubt for one or more of several reasons."

"We have also considered that, at trial, Mr. Biden would likely present himself to a jury, as he did during our interview of him, as a sympathetic, well-meaning, elderly man with a poor memory. Based on our direct interactions with and observations of him, he is someone for whom many jurors will want to identify reasonable doubt. It would be difficult to convince a jury that they should convict him - by then a former president well into his eighties - of a serious felony that requires a mental state of willfulness."

"We conclude the evidence is not sufficient to convict, and we decline to recommend prosecution of Mr. Biden for his retention of the classified Afghanistan documents."


-- A2SG, odd that you continue to "paraphrase", especially when the direct quotes prove your characterization wrong, each and every time....

 

[Ana the Ist]

No, he never said that.


If you're going to cite special counsel Hur, at least take the time to read what he wrote. His report is easily available online.

Hur gave his reasons for not recommending prosecution: "However, for the reasons summarized below, we conclude that the evidence does not establish Mr. Biden's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt."

Also: "Nevertheless, we do not believe this evidence is sufficient, as jurors would likely find reasonable doubt for one or more of several reasons."

Granted, Hur did mention that Biden's memory was poor. Specifically, he described him as "a sympathetic, well-meaning, elderly man with a poor memory", but he did not say Biden's mind was gone. Not at any point in the report. He described him that way to show that a jury would likely not find that he displayed intent to commit a crime, a necessary component of the charge.

The full passage:

We have also considered that, at trial, Mr. Biden would likely present himself to a jury, as he did during our interview of him, as a sympathetic, well-meaning, elderly man with a poor memory. Based on our direct interactions with and observations of him, he is someone for whom many jurors will want to identify reasonable doubt. It would be difficult to convince a jury that they should convict him - by then a former president well into his eighties - of a serious felony that requires a mental state of willfulness.​

​

We conclude the evidence is not sufficient to convict, and we decline to recommend prosecution of Mr. Biden for his retention of the classified Afghanistan documents. ​

If you're gonna call for honesty, at least try to be honest.

-- A2SG, though, I know that's not in the right-wing rulebook....

Repeating the same section over doesn't really help you here....let's look at one of the excuses for not prosecuting based on the evidence.

Several defenses are likely to create reasonable doubt as to such charges. For example, Mr. Biden could have found the classified Afghanistan documents at his Virginia home in 2017 and then forgotten about them soon after. This could convince some reasonable jurors that he did not retain them willfully.

He finds them in 2017....then Oops! Forgotten!

His mind is gone.

Shall we look at more reasons from the report?

Edit- this is the part of our conversation where you keep repeating yourself....maybe time for another meme

 

[Ana the Ist]

Let's let Hur speak for himself, for a change:

"However, for the reasons summarized below, we conclude that the evidence does not establish Mr. Biden's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt."

"Nevertheless, we do not believe this evidence is sufficient, as jurors would likely find reasonable doubt for one or more of several reasons."

"We have also considered that, at trial, Mr. Biden would likely present himself to a jury, as he did during our interview of him, as a sympathetic, well-meaning, elderly man with a poor memory. Based on our direct interactions with and observations of him, he is someone for whom many jurors will want to identify reasonable doubt. It would be difficult to convince a jury that they should convict him - by then a former president well into his eighties - of a serious felony that requires a mental state of willfulness."

"We conclude the evidence is not sufficient to convict, and we decline to recommend prosecution of Mr. Biden for his retention of the classified Afghanistan documents."


-- A2SG, odd that you continue to "paraphrase", especially when the direct quotes prove your characterization wrong, each and every time....

How about this one...

And the place where the Afghanistan documents were eventually found in Mr. Biden's Delaware garage-in a badly damaged box surrounded by household detritus-suggests the documents might have been forgotten.
In addition. Mr. Biden's memory was significantly limited, both during his
recorded interviews with the ghostwriter in 2017, and in his interview with our office in 2023.

Memory severely limited in 2017...and 2023.

We can safely assume if his memory was severely limited in 2017...it sure hasn't improved in 2023. That's probably why they delayed this interview with the special prosecutor and lawyered up....

Shall we continue?

Mind gone.

 

[A2SG]

Repeating the same section over doesn't really help you here....

It absolutely does. Quoting him shows clearly that what he said and what you're claiming he said aren't the same thing.

let's look at one of the excuses for not prosecuting based on the evidence.

Several defenses are likely to create reasonable doubt as to such charges. For example, Mr. Biden could have found the classified Afghanistan documents at his Virginia home in 2017 and then forgotten about them soon after. This could convince some reasonable jurors that he did not retain them willfully.

He finds them in 2017....then Oops! Forgotten!

His mind is gone.

Again, not what he said.

Interesting word there, "willfully," huh?

Shall we look at more reasons from the report?

Be my guest.

Oh wait...you're not doing that. For some reason.

Edit- this is the part of our conversation where you keep repeating yourself....maybe time for another meme

Considering my entire point is that he didn't say what you're pretending he said, then repeating what he did say makes the case exceptionally well.

I know you don't like that, but them's the breaks, kiddo.

-- A2SG, plus which, cut and paste don't cost nuthin'......

 

[Ana the Ist]

It absolutely does.

It doesn't...those are legal terms....not his actual reasoning.

Again, not what he said.

He's severely impaired.

Mind gone.

Interesting word there, "willfully," huh?

Indeed....you got Kamala lying in the video of the OP and Hur saying it's plausible that Biden had no idea what he was doing one moment to the next.

Oh wait...you're not doing that. For some reason.

Already did.

Considering my entire point is that he didn't say what you're pretending he said, then repeating what he did say

Repeating what he says just makes my paraphrasing of the report all the more reasonable.

Significantly limited are the words he used to describe the President's ability to recall things in 2017 and 2023.