Happiness?

[Oraia]

Alrighty, so I'm atheist. I want to share my thoughts on purpose and hear what religious folk have to say about it.

I believe that there is no purpose or meaning to life. If everyone on earth died tomorrow, the universe wouldn't change....well it would, but just as significantly as an spider crushed under a shoe...

I do also believe that life is existance and death is ... well the end...
therefore, one must use their life for a purpose, the lack of a purpose means that one must therefore create their own purpose and their own meaning.

So there's more or less what goes on in my head...
The following is my interpretation of purpose in... my mind if I were religious...

Morality is a must, so i'm not going to mention it...
Praising god or a deity in general, is what I've heard to be quite an important act. One must pray, give thanks, and some various things...

In my mind I'm thinking that the ultimate gift this god has given is life, and so either our purpose in life is to praise a god, or it's to live.. I figure that relationship between life and live make more sense.

Many people make it a point to be happy, what do you want? -- to be happy.

Do what you can to be happy, be happy, and live, what better praise can god receive than his children's happiness? Belief and happiness is all that seems to be truly necessary in my mind? but of course, there are books with loads more information making it seem that life is much more than that...

(PS. I'm a fan of those posters you see in childrens libraries and some schools that say "Smiling's contagious!" or something along those lines... It's much easier to make others happy when you're happy, ...a situation involving self-sacrifice to make someone else happy, is a bit less... happy

 

[liesje]

I'm really tired and that went straight over my head

 

[Oraia]

Glad I didnt hit you in the face ~_^ ...well I wanted to respond to your reply... but after reading it several times I really don't know what to say anymore... why did you reply without any input other than the seeming implication that you want to tell me that I typed up something that is too long and too complex to be of any of your interest? lol... I'm tired to and need to get up for work in 5 hours...

 

[liesje]

I didn't mean that it was to long and complex to be of interest, rather that in my current state of mental exhaustion my brain just isn't going to process it. I've had hardly any sleep the last few nights and I've just come home from a 9 hour shift at work. I'll reply when I feel slightly less like a cabbage and slightly more like a person.

By the way, welcome to CF

 

[Aino]

Alrighty, so I'm atheist. I want to share my thoughts on purpose and hear what religious folk have to say about it.

I believe that there is no purpose or meaning to life. If everyone on earth died tomorrow, the universe wouldn't change....well it would, but just as significantly as an spider crushed under a shoe...

I agree. The universe won't change a lot if and when the earth is going to blow or if all people on it, like you said, would die. For us people and the earth it will be a massive change though, and that's in my opinion a way to see how great God is - something so huge on our scale might on His one be so small and still he bothers to be interested in us.

I do also believe that life is existance and death is ... well the end...
therefore, one must use their life for a purpose, the lack of a purpose means that one must therefore create their own purpose and their own meaning.

I also partly agree with you on this statement, though for different reasons. Death is in my opinion not the end and that's why we have to live our lifes for a purpose. I as a christian think that I'm headed towards heaven because of the good my God has done to me through Jesus Christ and it makes me want to do good things to others who are less fortunate in their lifes as I've been (I don't [only] mean the religous side of it, but more importantly, the material one - IMO everyone should be allowed to have a decent life no matter who they are and whether they have money or not).

Morality is a must, so i'm not going to mention it...
Praising god or a deity in general, is what I've heard to be quite an important act. One must pray, give thanks, and some various things...

In my mind I'm thinking that the ultimate gift this god has given is life, and so either our purpose in life is to praise a god, or it's to live.. I figure that relationship between life and live make more sense.

I'm wondering why you think that anyone should feel like having to stop living to be a christian or some other type of religious person. Those two don't close each other out at all unless you perhaps think that becoming a christian / a follower of another religion makes you commit suiside or perhaps move to a cloyster. Let me tell you something: most religious people in the world don't think they need to do either of those things I mentioned. They're normal people like you: they study, work, meet their friends, have families, they have hobbies, they go out - they just happen to have a different set of values, ideas and thought than you, and they consider that a God exists and works.

As a christian I think that reading the Bible, praying, worshipping, attending a church and such are more of a gift then an obligation for me. I'm saved no matter how bad I've been, and no matter how many masses I've missed as long as I belong to God and accept Jesus as my saviour. A more active relationship to him, knowledge of him and support from other christians make it easier for me to stay that way. The moral responsibility of helping others comes along a little bit stronger, but that's what I believe a thinking and feeling person should do even if they weren't believers.

Many people make it a point to be happy, what do you want? -- to be happy.

Do what you can to be happy, be happy, and live, what better praise can god receive than his children's happiness? Belief and happiness is all that seems to be truly necessary in my mind? but of course, there are books with loads more information making it seem that life is much more than that...

Again, I think that a believing is what it takes to get to heaven from a christian point of view. Those books that you talk about take faith to another level. Like I said, pure practice of religion is simply to keep you in shape spiritually, and to make you more able to give spiritual advice to your closest ones when needed - there's no more purpose in itself. Those books ar ment to be advice for you! Deep down they often talk about the moral responsibility that I already mentioned before - that you should try to hold on to what's good, to love your neighbour as yourself and because of that do good to your closest ones as well. Indeed a happy human being is the best praise God can ever have, just remember that even for christians and other religious people life with all it's good sides, responsibilities and not so nice turns is just what you make of it.

To finish my statement I'd actually like to quote Saint Francis of Assisi as it suits here so well:

Preach the gospel at all times -- If necessary, use words.

I'm feeling a little disorganized right now, so I hope I didn't just write a lot of nonsense and forget to answer your beginning post - it was a nice one to respond to.

 

[Oraia]

I think you misunderstood the 3rd section(calling it 3rd cuz... you split it that way lheh) or I maybe unclear...

It's one thing to think of what you do as part of your faith an obligation or gift or whatever... but it just seems that I've seen many people who see it as an obligation... I don't think I said anything about suicide... but yeah, I've met people who do believe these things they must do... or rather... attend might be a more fitting word...

I went to a youth group service and the pastor made an interesting point, something like : attending these services every week doesnt necessarily mean you are seeking god, you need to believe (as you just said) and do as the bible teaches and what not...

anyway, I thought that was a pretty important thing for him to say... Especially when the first time I showed up, I was walking past people I've never met before... hearing bits of their conversations, and I was surprised to hear a couple were full of some malicious gossip about someone who apparently wasn't present... I dunno... situations like that make me think of how many people seem to be quite hypocritical and maybe they think that what they do... or maybe look like theyre doing is what matters....(I just noticed the thread subject completely changed to me clarifying one section...) anyway I think it's a fairly common thing to hear something like,,, it's not what you think, but what you do that really matters..... and there's also ... it's the thought that counts....

Yeah I think it's pretty safe to say, what you think and do matter...

I think another thing I meant to say was, it's one thing to genuinely show gratitude and praise to god, and another to do it because you are told to or taught to

 

[Aino]

First of all, the suicide thing was just a type of a joke or irony or I don't know what. Anyways, I didn't really mean it seriously.. I think deep down we were thinking and talking about the same thing, I may also not have myself as clear as I could have. Actually now that I review the part of my post I see myself that I didn't so successfully hide between the lines all the hypocricy and the supposed must-dos, but relied on everybodys mindreading skills. . So I guess I'll just "continue" my third section here..

As a consequence of my opinion about having prayer, worship and church sermons as a gift and a type of a spiritual support rather than an obligation, I think that people, who say that what you do "for God" matter and how much you are involved as well, are a little bit off the track or even mislead. Like the pastor that you mentioned had said, it's not the amount of sermons you attend, or the time that you spend fasting and praying or doing good deeds that saves you, but it's God that you believe in and trust your life upon. Telling anyone that would be false doctrine according to any church you might want to visit. He was right to say that attending church does not necessarily mean that you actually are a believe in God or seek him. In the US and Europe churches are huge social institutions as well as spiritual ones and especially young people attend, because their friends do, or because it's what their families tell them to do so.

It can of course be, that many churches don't stress the fact enough that you are saved by faith alone, but tend to more often preach the way you can or should take care of it by praying etc. and do good and because of that, people misinterpret attending church and such to be something you really have to do in order to be good. Of course we should not think that we can do whatever we want because God has saved us through Jesus, that is just trying to annoy God and just btw. not even socially acceptable. The point of mercy is, that no one has to be perfect or even try to push good things out of himself with the last bit of energy left. Good deeds should come from the free will we've got! We should not take faith for granted either, though, because it's really easily gone wind if you don't think about it and try a little to keep it.

And obviously I have to say to summarize myself, that I agree with you, when you say that there are really phony and hypocritical people among us, who don't even try to practice what they preach. It's not nice and it's not supposed to be so, but I think that you'll find those anywhere and finding them even in churches just proves the point, that christianity is all about no one being perfect..

 

[solarwave]

I believe that there is no purpose or meaning to life. If everyone on earth died tomorrow, the universe wouldn't change....well it would, but just as significantly as an spider crushed under a shoe...

I do also believe that life is existance and death is ... well the end...
therefore, one must use their life for a purpose, the lack of a purpose means that one must therefore create their own purpose and their own meaning.

I think this is probably the best way to see the world if there is no God since where does morality and purpose come from is there is no God. Sadly for the atheist this goes against all that is natural for a human.

I think I agree with what you have to say about purpose for religious people. I suppose it would be living a life in relationship with God and others and try to do the best you can with you time given.

 

[ModestGirlsRock]

.... many churches don't stress the fact enough that you are saved by faith alone, but tend to more often preach the way you can or should take care of it by praying etc. and do good and because of that, people misinterpret attending church and such to be something you really have to do in order to be good.

Saying "By Faith Alone" is a nasty business though. There is the argument that it means by simply believing sincerely or that it can mean believing yet intertwined with works. I do agree that just attending church and related activities doesn't mean you'll go to heaven. There has to be a strong relationship b/w you and God.How do we get that relationship? Through Jesus Christ, right? Religious groups such as Muslims and Jews would disagree with me, but I'm going off the Christian belief that Jesus Christ is the Savior. How to keep that relationship strong requires prayer (talking to God), fellowship, and edification. Edification means reading your bible and learning from more mature Christians such as a preacher.

Now, since no one is "perfect", I'm not going to be perfect in reading my Bible everyday and such, but reading or praying everyday shouldn't be a seething obligation. It should be a gift especially since it means that I have the opportunity to have personal time with God. A relationship can't grow if you don't spend time with them. How is a relationship with God any different? It's not.

 

[WhereIsReligion]

I think this is probably the best way to see the world if there is no God since where does morality and purpose come from is there is no God. Sadly for the atheist this goes against all that is natural for a human.

I think I agree with what you have to say about purpose for religious people. I suppose it would be living a life in relationship with God and others and try to do the best you can with you time given.

Really? Without god there is no moral? So if there was no god tomorrow you would lose all emotion and kill people? Please, morality changes though out history and time periods. At one time it was o.k/moral to own a slave, now it is not. at one time women were to be submissive, now they are able to have choice/more choice. Morality and Immorality come from different sources and sometimes the same source. (Hint Hint)