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Yes, the propaganda is expected. This was a horrific act of terrorism and we all need to work together to end the jihadist savagery.Israel is bombing civilians in the south of Gaza
‘The strikes are everywhere’: Palestinians flee south in Gaza but cannot escape bombs
I asked you the questions first. I also asked you the questions since you wanted me to be more clear and say what I mean. I was hoping they helped.How about saying what you mean rather than expecting me to read your invisible ink.
In your post 611 you made a false accusation against me that I had made "a deliberate attempt to not condemn the Palestinian attack." when I had already denounced the attack in my post 497. You have not apologised for this nor removed the false accusation from your post as I requested.
Now you fire a volley of six further questions and expect me to answer them all. You are assuming a position of superiority over me that you do not in any way deserve.
But if you really want to have an exchange of questions let's make it fairer and more equal and keep it to one question at a time. You've had your first move with the question about condemning the Oct 7 attack so here's my first move:
According to the Jewish human rights organisation B'tselem since the beginning of the Second Intifada, 10,672 Palestinians have been killed by Israelis and 1330 Israelis have been killed by Palestinians. Data does not include the current conflict.
see Database on fatalities and house demolitions
Here is the question: Given the holocaust do you think the life of an individual Israeli is worth more than the life of an individual Palestinian and requires much more concern and intervention by the international community?
Might is right is an easy doctrine to advocate when you live in the country with the most powerful army and so can decide who is right and who is wrong.
But what if a far more powerful alien force were to invade the US (we know that it is where aliens always go). Would it be more "humane" for the alien force to act against the US in the way you advocate?
from https://www.worldfuturefund.org/Reports/Imperialism/usmurder.html
It could be the aliens have decided that the US is the country with most blood on its hands and the most dangerous country, and so needs to be neutralised.
Posing a hypothetical scenario - even an impossible one - in order to illustrate a point is not a conspiracy theory.
I am surprised that the UN and other aid organizations aren't supplying items like this in Gaza:Gazans forced to drink dirty, salty water as the fuel needed to run water systems runs out
One vital supply missing from the aid convoys has been fuel. Without it, Gaza’s water system has crumbled.
“Fuel is water,” said Hall of CSIS. “Cutting off fuel is cutting off water.”
For Gazans, no power means taps have run dry. “Even if you are lucky and have a well, you will not be able to pump (water) to high floors because we don’t have electricity,” Al Shanti said.
Many of the water trucks Gazans rely on to fill water containers are unable to reach people’s homes because they lack fuel, and because of the bombardment,
Making water drinkable also relies on fuel.
All five wastewater treatment plants and two of the three desalination plants have stopped working. The enclave’s last remaining major desalination plant, which had been shut down for almost a week, resumed operations on Saturday but is at less than 7% of its usual capacity.
“The only water people have is essentially non-potable seawater mixed with sewage,” said Natasha Hall, a senior fellow with the Middle East Program at the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS).
Most of Gaza’s water comes from a coastal aquifer, a body of underground water that stretches along the coastline of the eastern Mediterranean from Egypt’s Sinai Peninsula up to Israel.
Around 97% is undrinkable; it’s salty, brackish, and contaminated by untreated wastewater and pollution.
I am surprised that the UN and other aid organizations are supplying items like this in Gaza:
Israel is bombing civilians in the south of Gaza
‘The strikes are everywhere’: Palestinians flee south in Gaza but cannot escape bombs
The IDF is not doing everything it can to prevent civilian casualties, and their response to the October 7th terrorist attack played right into the hands of Hamas. The IDF is making a grave mistake that will have negative consequences not only for Israel, but also the United States for many years to come.Your position is one of softness and weakness, when we don't have the luxury for that at this time. While Israel is already, to its disadvantage, doing all it can to minimize civilian casualties, you want them to even more fight with one arm behind its back.
Since the attack on Israel on October 7th, I have said on this forum that the massacre of civilians committed by Hamas was absolutely reprehensible and unjustifiable, that those responsible should be held accountable and have also said Hamas has committed many atrocities and must be eradicated. It's not necessary for me to repeat myself every time a rocket is fired towards Israel.Hamas has been targeting civilians with rockets every day since 10/7. Why aren't you protesting against that in this thread? Why the double standard?
No they won't. This is a war and in war civilians die. Israel has done all it can to minimize civilian death, but in the end, if civilians are there they will be killed. This is why war is an ugly ugly business. But when your enemy starts the war and then puts the citizens deliberately at risk it's no one's fault but theirs. Hamas should surrender which will save the citizens THEY put in harms way.Israel said it had struck more than 400 targets in the past 24 hours, after hitting more than 320 a day earlier, in some of the most intense aerial attacks on Gaza in recent days. The Gaza Health Ministry, which is controlled by the armed group Hamas, said that it had recorded the highest single-day death toll of the war: at least 704 people killed in dozens of strikes on homes, a refugee camp and other places. It was not possible to independently verify the toll.
Even if the death toll is half what the Health Ministry claims, that is a terrible price to pay.
Israel understandably wants to reduce the risk to their soldiers by destroying as much of the Hamas military infrastructure as possible. But, in doing so, they are killing thousands of civilians, at least half of which are women and children. Israel's decision to write off the human toll as collateral damaga will have long term reprecussions.
The IDF has had a tremendous amount of input as to how to avoid civilian casualties. If you think there is something deficient in their plan please let them know. At this point they have warned civilians to go south and heavily bombed the Hamas terrorists who savagely killed over a thousand innocent civilians. I can't think of a better strategy, Hamas and their supporters have taken a heavy toll from the air strikes. Israel has not yet started a ground attack. If heavy blows to Hamas with almost no cost of live to Israel is "playing right into the hands of Hamas" then I am all for it.The IDF is not doing everything it can to prevent civilian casualties, and their response to the October 7th terrorist attack played right into the hands of Hamas. The IDF is making a grave mistake that will have negative consequences not only for Israel, but also the United States for many years to come.
Why should it? Everything it can can means it can't actually attack. Because to do so endangers civilians. What kind of war can be fought like that? Everything it it can means leaving all infrastructure intact so that Hamas has all the food, water and power it needs to continue the fight.The IDF is not doing everything it can to prevent civilian casualties, and their response to the October 7th terrorist attack played right into the hands of Hamas. The IDF is making a grave mistake that will have negative consequences not only for Israel, but also the United States for many years to come.
Saying you recognize something doesn't make it true. I could say that I recognize Trump as the president, doesn't mean Trump is actually the president.@rjs330
This is very different from "No one has recognized a Palestinian state". If you're arguing there isn't a Palestinian state to recognize then saying "no one has recognized a Palestinian state" is pointless, and misleading of what you actually think. This is another example of you moving the goal posts. Using this kind of sophistry to try win petty debating points is inappropriate given the gravity of the situation.
from State of Palestine - Wikipedia
No they won't. This is a war and in war civilians die.
In order to "Deploy a complete military blockade of the Southern and Eastern borders of Afghanistan, which are their primary logistical pathways of reinforcement and retreat. Maintain a constant aerial surveillance and control of the Northern and Eastern borders which have significantly less cover from aerial attacks." you need to be a much mightier military power. And who decides who was right between, for instance, Vietnam and the US? How is that decided?First of all...I didn't advocate a "might makes right" doctrine. I advocated a total war doctrine. I can provide links if you fail to understand the difference.
After all of those deaths and trillions of dollars spent in fighting the war on terror, al Qaeda, the Islamic State, and the Taliban still exist; al Qaeda is expanding its global presence, the Islamic State continues to be the deadliest terror group in the world, and the Taliban is probably stronger today than it was prior to the U.S. invasion in 2001.The war in Afghanistan resulted in around 1900 military deaths.
It resulted in 46000 civilian deaths and 52000 enemy combatants deaths.
In Iraq we had about 4000 military deaths, 200000 civilian deaths and around 57000 enemy combatants deaths.
All this over 3000 Americans being killed.
What's astounding to me is how many people continue to believe that using military force and all out war to defeat a terrorist group is the answer, when history has shown that it's not. Not only does it fail, it increases terrorism. Look at the increase in terrorism in Afghanistan and Iraq for example. Prior to the war on terror, attacks in these two countries averaged well under 100 per year.The ignorance of the nature of war is astounding.
According to B'tselem between the 2nd Intifada and now Palestinians have killed 449 "Israeli forces"Hamas and their sympathizers avoid valid combat targets....they try to avoid engaging in combat with the IDF.
from Israeli troops kill Hamas man who army says attacked post in West BankRAMALLAH, West Bank, Sept 29 (Reuters) - Israeli soldiers on Friday killed a member of the Hamas Islamist group who the army said was among assailants who threw fire bombs at a military post in the occupied West Bank.
from Beit Lid suicide bombing - WikipediaThe Beit Lid suicide bombing, (also named Beit Lid massacre[1][2][3][4]) was a double suicide attack by the Palestinian Islamic Jihad against Israeli soldiers at the Beit Lid Junction on January 22, 1995. It was the first suicide attack by Palestinian Islamic Jihad
You are still assuming you have a position of superiority over me which means that you get to ask all the questions and I have to answer them, whereas you don't need to answer any of my questions. "I asked you the questions first" is playground talk. Your further questions did not clarify what you meant by "blanketly condemn Hamas for all their actions before and during this conflict?"I asked you the questions first. I also asked you the questions since you wanted me to be more clear and say what I mean. I was hoping they helped.
Since you refused to answer them and instead impose one of your own, my initial reaction of the your answer is no was correct.
This worrying disregard for the lives of any and every Palestinian indicates that you do actually regard the life of an individual Palestinian of less value than the life of an individual Israeli although you did not address my question directly.So what that more Palestinians have been killed.
How bombings, blockades and import bans caused Gaza’s water system to crumbleHow bombings, blockades and import bans caused Gaza’s water system to crumble
Gaza’s already rudimentary water network has been obliterated, with 2.2 million residents trying to get by on three litres a day
So your idea is - don't trim your fingernails because they'll only grow back. Don't mow your grass because it will only grow back. The mere existence of Israel has come with "negative consequences" since before Israel even existed (Arabs were killing Jews in the land before 1948). You seem to be well-educated about terrorism, but you don't seem well-educated about Islam. There is a significant strain of Islam which wants to own and subjugate the world. Israel and America and the rest of the West will experience negative consequences no matter what they do or don't do.The IDF is not doing everything it can to prevent civilian casualties, and their response to the October 7th terrorist attack played right into the hands of Hamas. The IDF is making a grave mistake that will have negative consequences not only for Israel, but also the United States for many years to come.
Yet you repeatedly repeat yourself every time you swallow media lies about what Israel is doing wrong.Since the attack on Israel on October 7th, I have said on this forum that the massacre of civilians committed by Hamas was absolutely reprehensible and unjustifiable, that those responsible should be held accountable and have also said Hamas has committed many atrocities and must be eradicated. It's not necessary for me to repeat myself every time a rocket is fired towards Israel.
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