Grounds for divorce?

[porterross]

We are often quick to quote that scripture about adultery, but if you read the entire section, in context, you're going to find that the real sin involved in divorce is "the hardening of the hearts."

The reason you "cause her to commit adultery" is that in Christ's age, no woman remained "unmarried" after a divorce either.

The bible teaches that a man has to love his wife in the way that Christ loves the church. Christ died for his bride (the church).

You absolutely must get out of this situation.
Whether you choose divorce or separation, you cannot end up a statistic in the morgue because you fear displeasing God.

God loves you. You are His child.

God also said that the law was made to serve man, not man to serve the law.

Whether you ever remarry or not will have to be up to you and the Lord, but God would no more want a woman to remain where she could be murdered than you would want your child to do so.

God loved you enough to die for you.

He will understand that the true sin is your husband's violence and cruelty. He will not punish you for the sins of your husband.

TexasSky, SearcherKris and the others have nailed it and I hope you are able to see that you are being neglected and abused. It may not be easy to hear yourself say it, but it most definitely true.

Your husband has not loved you as he does himself, as Scripture commands. His love for you should be second only to that of his love for Christ, otherwise he fails to do as commanded.

I'm praying for you.

 

[Tink04]

But funny thing is when you take a leap of faith, God catches you and somehow opens doors you never knew possible.God bless you. My heart goes out to you. PM me if you need more tips/advice.

I can attest to this.

I have 4 kids between the ages of 6-13. I have been a stay at home mom and have only worked side jobs just to make a bit extra. We had separated back in July but in Nov I decided I was leaving for good. I had to go on Social Assistance because I didn't have a job. My rent is cheep but they don't pay very much. They didn't even give me enough to pay my rent and utilities. I had no money for food, gas for the van, Christmas gifts for the kids.

Now it's almost the end of Jan and God has blessed me greatly. I've near strangers come up to me in church and hand me gift cards for groceries, gas, or the mall. (to purchase Christmas gifts) Our family was sponsored for Christmas by a corporation and they even asked me what I wanted. I haven't gotten a Christmas gift for years.

I've been given enough that I have in turn been able to give to others who are in need. And then I have been given back that and more.

The decision to leave is a tough one and you have to be brave and strong to do it. But even though it's only been a short time that I have been out I can say it's well worth it.

I'm glad I listened to God and got out.

 

[dayhiker]

How did the talk with your pastor go?

 

[DivorceInChurch]

Despite how it may "feel" there is just never a situation, truly NEVER, where God speaks to you and tells you to divorce your spouse. There is also zero basis for this concept of praying to God for a "release" from your vows.
Having said all that, you cannot stay there and this needs to be fixed. What is critical is, even in the midst of such overt actions on the part of the husband, he will have some things to say as well and should be heard. In my opinion, for example, listing the hugging in bed incident with the car bump incident is maybe a stretch. It seemed like piling on. There is enough to go on with the threat of shooting the monitor and the car bump that you don't need to list off something like that, it dilutes your story a bit.
Personally for me, when things like that are discussed there indeed are always 2 sides, and it is troublesome to read when someone lists those as grievances against their spouse...the hugging thing I mean.
You open with the admission that you have some problems as well. I for one find these things far better if the person posting takes a stab at also listing off a couple things they have done....OR....the spouse actually can post.
Why? Well there is just way too much divorce in our churches, and to take a couple of typed paragraphs and then advise all kinds of ways to end the marriage ....the paradigm driving that is largely why there is so much diverse in churches.

I do not judge those who divorce...I have done it as well in my long ago past...before I met my Savior.
But it grieves me to see the scriptures so toeed aside as Ive read here. That the "real sin" is hard hearts and therefore as it stands with divorce anything goes...or that you can pray to be released, or worse, how your bad marriage can be SO dishonoring to God that it is actually God honoring to end it........poppycock.
All marriages are acts of obedience...and worthy to be worked and saved. Of course no one needs to be in danger to do that, and separations can work miracles if handled right and with church involvement.
Many times it takes something to get the attention of the other spouse. It is sometimes a package of
1. Living out the changes you know God wants YOU to make...after all you have power over YOU and YOU alone.
2. Counseling and pastoral involvement, men for accountability...most important the men who intervene with husband must be ones he respects. He needs to literally be "impeached on the stand" as it were. If he is able to avoid impeachement on the stand...then there is clearly lots more to the story.

I am new here, read 3 or 4 posts, and got saddened by how quickly divorce is suggested AND how all the cliches about grounds and God releasing you etc etc got used.

Please just pray in earnest...not pray with an agenda other than God's will. Don't tell God what His will SHOULD be then pray for confirmation.

Its very strange that the gospel of Jesus Christ is all about sacrifice...putting the needs of others BEFORE ourselves....knowing we will have trials and counting those as tests of and strengtheners of our faith, and taking joy in them EXCEPT in the divorce arena...then we stand the gospel on its head with comments like "God wants me to be happy" ,
Sure He does....but no where in scripture does God tell us to put our comfort ABOVE that of others....including in marriage...period...its not there. And where kids are involved???? He in NO WAY puts YOUR comfort above the children.

Sorry...my opinion is pretty unpopular.

 

[dayknee]

I don't think your opinion is unpopular. I do think divorce happens way too often, especially among Christians. Heck, the divorce rate among Christians is pretty high..almost as high as the secular world.

The only thing I would ever caution anyone about as far as your statements go, is that we obviously cannot see the other side of every story. We can only go on what the OP is saying in their relationship.
And give advise or councel based on that. I think we can all sense if somehting is not adding up and then can ask for more information before posting.

I do understand why you type out what you did as I really feel it is always and totaly up to God. But...the sin in the world and the lack of repentence of a spouse or just the unwillngness to work on the marriage sometimes requires us to seperate or seperate permanently. I in no way say this is something that the Lord would like us to do, but I also believe that there is a level of understanding from our Savior, for us. Especially in situations where there is an unrepenting spouse or a spouse that simply wont change..A person can not and should not be forced to live in that manner. It isnt that the person feels they deserve to be "happy", becuase no wehre in the bible does God say that to us. Be we each deserve to live a life that is as free from sin as possible..We are commanded to confront sin and move away from it as well. I do not think it's biblical to put ourselves in a situtation that invloves sin..Granted some sin is worse than others.but with my husband..his embezzling and his doing things illegaly within our company caused me to have to split bank accounts..now he is angry about this and thinks I am wrong..but I wont put my life or my kids lives in jeporday or face jail becuase of his sin. I also am seperated for the last year due to his inappropriate content addiction that he refuses and has refused, in the past to take responsibility for this..The last straw was when I caught him AGAIN viewing inappropriate content and then finding out he was role playing with other women..It saddens me because his thoughts are much different than mine as far as whats acceptable and what isnt.
I will be filing for divorce..
The last year has been pure hell and I can't take the abuse of my emotions nor the manipulation of him pretending that things are not as bad as they seem..my children have been affected by this and I will not allow it in my home..I have a 16 year old daughter and an impressionable 11 year old son whom I chose to raise without all of that crap..
anyways..sorry for bieng long winded.

 

[TexasSky]

I do want to second the recommendations that you tell others, outside the church, about it.

When my husband and I went through some things, at one point, he confessed to seeing people who were not there, and to "hating" our son, to a church counselor. Later, when it came to legalities, I feared a custody fight, and contacted that church counselor. It put him in a tough place. He begged me not to make him testify in court, as he felt it would break his ministerial oaths.

As it turned out, I didn't need his testimony. During a moment of sanity, my spouse signed the custody papers, uncontested.

 

[JohnDB]

Sorry this got left out


Matthew 5:32
But I tell you that anyone wo divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adultree, and anyone who marries the divorces woman commits adultery

Ok...cause no one else has adressed it...
The word "Adultery" is a reference to somthing other than what you think it means...

The book of Matthew was written to Jews..and Jesus was speaking to Pharisees...learned men of the Bible...all the while speaking in prose.

The reference is one to the Prophets...and to something another two current rabbis wee arguing about...both of them on polar opposites as far as what constituted marriage.

Jesus was referring to behavior that is unbecoming a Christian...Jesus leaned toward the conservative side of what was grounds for divorce. but he was also saying that if a husband Apostacizes then fine...

And Paul says that if an unbeliever and a believer wish to separate then fine...

Divorce for women during biblical times was dificult for women to obtain...and they were never guilty of Adultery...adulterous women were stoned to death. They invited Jesus to help them stone one...Men would instead kick them out of the house and not give them clothes or food while marrying another woman...the "put away wives would then be forced to find another husband or become prostitutes to the Greek/Roman citizens.

In the matthew passage as well there was a command about not marrying one of these "Put away" wives...not the commonly held belief of marrying a divorced woman. Marrying a divorced woman is perfectly fine...so long as she is truly dovorced...Just know...that once you are divorced the chances of ever getting back what was lost is going to take a true miracle...and divorce rates amongst divorcees is soaringly high...

Can't advise you what to do...
Yes, his behavior is appalling from what you describe...but...it takes two to tango. I would highly reccomend that you take every course of action to avoid a divorce...make him realize that play time is over...if he is in any way not wanting to be alone he needs to come with you to a marriage councilor...

 

[HuntingMan]

Despite how it may "feel" there is just never a situation, truly NEVER, where God speaks to you and tells you to divorce your spouse.

So you believe that God doesnt 'speak' thru His own word then ?
His word says 'except for fornication' so apparently in that sort of case even HE could be 'speaking' that divorce is within His will.
have you studied this matter out as far as going back to Exodus 21 and seeing a tad bit more of the whole picture.

There is also zero basis for this concept of praying to God for a "release" from your vows.

Actually, given the details of Numbers 30, Id say this is a pretty good 'concept' entirely.
Again, have you READ Numbers 30 to see any more of the whole picture about vows and oaths ?

I do not judge those who divorce...I have done it as well in my long ago past...before I met my Savior.

And that Savior has Himself given exception showing that there ARE conditions that are UNacceptable within His covenant of marriage.

But it grieves me to see the scriptures so toeed aside as Ive read here. That the "real sin" is hard hearts and therefore as it stands with divorce anything goes...or that you can pray to be released, or worse, how your bad marriage can be SO dishonoring to God that it is actually God honoring to end it........poppycock.

So you believe that if a husband wants to have a three way sex fest with his young wife....INSISTING that she partake of it, that somehow that can be 'honoring' God to remain in it ? Poppycock..

And please dont give me any lines about exaggerating.
I deal with marriages every single day and I can name off a few cases of this sort of thing. Its not as uncommon as some want to believe.
One item that comes to mind very quickly is a man who wanted to 'trade' her to two homosexual men for an hour to do with as they wanted for a 12 pack of beer.

There is very little chance of you convincing many here, especially me, that it would 'honor' God to remain in that perverse 'marriage' or that God would be DIShonored by its being ended.

All marriages are acts of obedience

Oh...?
...really ?
So when I was about to marry my first wife and God literally spoke to me in an audible voice and told me not to marry her and even detailed out EXACTLY what she was going to do so that I woudnt marry her....and I married her anyway against what He said to me....that was an 'act of obedience' ?

I think you need to think things thru before making claims, quite frankly.

...and worthy to be worked and saved.

Apparently not or there would be no exception given by Christ.

Its very strange that the gospel of Jesus Christ is all about sacrifice...putting the needs of others BEFORE ourselves....knowing we will have trials and counting those as tests of and strengtheners of our faith, and taking joy in them EXCEPT in the divorce arena...then we stand the gospel on its head with comments like "God wants me to be happy" ,
Sure He does....but no where in scripture does God tell us to put our comfort ABOVE that of others....including in marriage...period...its not there. And where kids are involved???? He in NO WAY puts YOUR comfort above the children.

PUH-lease.
This isnt about MY needs ABOVE others needs.
In MANY cases it is about broken marital vows and life threatening situations and abandonment.
Im not sure what bible you are reading but I see all thru mine starting way back in Exodus 21 where God does show that HIS rules for marriage and how a spouse is to treat the other present that marriage IS to be something that is at least tolerable.

Sorry...my opinion is pretty unpopular.

Unpopular should be the least of your concerns.
Outright erroneous is where you need to focus your attention.

 

[ShainaBrina]

Ok...cause no one else has adressed it...
The word "Adultery" is a reference to somthing other than what you think it means...

The book of Matthew was written to Jews..and Jesus was speaking to Pharisees...learned men of the Bible...all the while speaking in prose.

The reference is one to the Prophets...and to something another two current rabbis wee arguing about...both of them on polar opposites as far as what constituted marriage.

Jesus was referring to behavior that is unbecoming a Christian...Jesus leaned toward the conservative side of what was grounds for divorce. but he was also saying that if a husband Apostacizes then fine...

And Paul says that if an unbeliever and a believer wish to separate then fine...

Divorce for women during biblical times was dificult for women to obtain...and they were never guilty of Adultery...adulterous women were stoned to death. They invited Jesus to help them stone one...Men would instead kick them out of the house and not give them clothes or food while marrying another woman...the "put away wives would then be forced to find another husband or become prostitutes to the Greek/Roman citizens.

In the matthew passage as well there was a command about not marrying one of these "Put away" wives...not the commonly held belief of marrying a divorced woman. Marrying a divorced woman is perfectly fine...so long as she is truly dovorced...Just know...that once you are divorced the chances of ever getting back what was lost is going to take a true miracle...and divorce rates amongst divorcees is soaringly high...

Can't advise you what to do...
Yes, his behavior is appalling from what you describe...but...it takes two to tango. I would highly reccomend that you take every course of action to avoid a divorce...make him realize that play time is over...if he is in any way not wanting to be alone he needs to come with you to a marriage councilor...

It may take two to tango... but only one to stomp a jig!

I agree with the put away thing.

 

[ShainaBrina]

Numbers 30 was interesting.

So let's say for example that the husband says to the wife that he is sorry he married her... or that he hates her etc. does that mean he is braking his vow? Does it mean that he is over ruling her vow to him?

Oh questions...questions... questions

 

[dayknee]

Numbers 30 was interesting.

So let's say for example that the husband says to the wife that he is sorry he married her... or that he hates her etc. does that mean he is braking his vow? Does it mean that he is over ruling her vow to him?

Oh questions...questions... questions

I just want to insert something real quick.

What has helped me is that I really had to read about what marriage is..What it means to God..
I have to just really put it into the context of how Christ is with his bride (the church)
Did Christ ever hit, lie, cheat, or abuse the church ( his bride)?
I know marriages are not perfect by any means and they require work. But my example is set by Christ and his bride..he loved his bride never cheated or abused or lied to his bride.
We really need to see what a marriage is according to Christ and we shoudl strive to reach that goal
I believe anything outside of that, really, is just not a marriage.
My hsuband left our marriage. did he physically get up and walk out? no
I made him leave
I made him leave becuaes he left the marriage along time ago with his inappropriate content addiciton and his lying and his controlling. This isnt a marriage.
I look at it as I am the usher and he wasnt being quiet in the theatre so I escorted him out.
You cant blame the usher becuase you were talking thru a movie can you?
idk..prolly a silly analogy but
just saying
look at what a marriage is. then decide if thats somehting you have and if its something you are both willing to work on to get it?