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Struggles by Non-Christians
Gospel of John + Clash of religions
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<blockquote data-quote="AvgJoe" data-source="post: 70140554" data-attributes="member: 99910"><p>What verses are you seeing that you think disprove that Jesus is God? Is it the verses that call Jesus the Son of Man? Because Jesus is both, both God and man.</p><p></p><p>Jesus is <em>the Son of God</em>, then He must be God. In the first chapter of Genesis, we are taught that every living thing reproduces after its own <strong>kind</strong>. </p><p></p><p>Who was Jesus' Father? The Holy Spirit (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/1:18/" target="_blank"><span style="color: #000000">Matthew 1:18</span></a>, 20; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/luke/1:35/" target="_blank"><span style="color: #000000">Luke 1:35</span></a>). Who is the Holy Spirit? He is God (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/acts-of-the-apostles/5:3-4/" target="_blank"><span style="color: #000000">Acts 5:3-4</span></a>).</p><p></p><p>Just as my father was a man, I am man. Jesus' father was God, so Jesus is God. Jesus is <em>the Son of God, </em>because He is God. </p><p></p><p>In the same manner, Jesus' mother was a woman, so Jesus is a man. Jesus is <em>the Son of Man, </em>because He is a man.</p><p></p><p>Birthed by both God and mankind, Jesus is both God and man. </p><p></p><p>A kind begets like kind.</p><p></p><p><strong></strong></p><p><strong></strong></p><p>Because, unlike the three Synoptic Gospels, John’s purpose is not to present a chronological narrative of the life of Christ but to display His deity. The author cites the purpose of the gospel of John as follows: “But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name” (John 20:31). John sought to strengthen the faith of second-generation believers and bring about faith in others, but he also sought to correct a false teaching that was spreading in the first century. John emphasized Jesus Christ as “the Son of God,” fully God and fully man, contrary to a false doctrine that taught the “Christ-spirit” came upon the human Jesus at His baptism and left Him at the crucifixion.</p><p></p><p> </p><p></p><p>1) Jesus received worship (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/2:2/" target="_blank">Matthew 2:2</a>, 14:33, 28:9). Jesus said to worship God only, yet He receives worship and never told those who were worshiping Him to stop, thus, claiming to be God.</p><p></p><p>2) Following are some of the New Testament themes that are found in the Old Testament, many of which attests to Jesus' divinity.</p><p></p><p><strong>Ascension of Jesus to the right hand of God</strong></p><p>Found in the OT (Psalm 110:1)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/26:64/" target="_blank">Matthew 26:64</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/acts-of-the-apostles/7:55-60/" target="_blank">Acts 7:55-60</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/ephesians/1:20/" target="_blank">Ephesians 1:20</a>)</p><p></p><p><strong>Atonement by blood</strong></p><p>Found in the OT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/leviticus/17:11/" target="_blank">Leviticus 17:11</a>)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/9:22/" target="_blank">Hebrews 9:22</a>)</p><p></p><p><strong>Begotten Son, Jesus is</strong></p><p>Found in OT (Psalm 2:7)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/acts-of-the-apostles/13:33/" target="_blank">Acts 13:33</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/1:5/" target="_blank">Hebrews 1:5</a>)</p><p></p><p><strong>Crucifixion</strong></p><p>Found in OT (Psalm 22:11-18; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/zechariah/12:10/" target="_blank">Zechariah 12:10</a>)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/luke/22:33-38/" target="_blank">Luke 22:33-38</a>)</p><p></p><p><strong>Eternal Son</strong></p><p>Found in OT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/micah/5:1-2/" target="_blank">Micah 5:1-2</a>; Psalm 2:7)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/1:5/" target="_blank">Hebrews 1:5</a>, 5:5)</p><p></p><p><strong>God among His people</strong></p><p>Found in OT ( <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/isaiah/9:6/" target="_blank">Isaiah 9:6</a>)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/john/1:1/" target="_blank">John 1:1</a>, 14; 20:28; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/colossians/2:9/" target="_blank">Colossians 2:9</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/3:3/" target="_blank">Matthew 3:3</a>)</p><p></p><p><strong>Incarnation of God</strong></p><p>Found in OT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/exodus/3:14/" target="_blank">Exodus 3:14</a>; Psalm 45:6; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/isaiah/9:6/" target="_blank">Isaiah 9:6</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/zechariah/12:10/" target="_blank">Zechariah 12:10</a>)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/john/8:58/" target="_blank">John 8:58</a>; 1:1, 14; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/1:8/" target="_blank">Hebrews 1:8</a>, <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/colossians/2:9/" target="_blank">Colossians 2:9</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/1:1-3/" target="_blank">Hebrews 1:1-3</a>)</p><p></p><p><strong>Only Begotten Son</strong></p><p>Found in OT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/genesis/22:2/" target="_blank">Genesis 22:2</a>)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/john/3:16/" target="_blank">John 3:16</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/11:7/" target="_blank">Hebrews 11:7</a>)</p><p></p><p><strong>Resurrection of Christ</strong></p><p>Found in OT (Psalm 16:9-10; 49:15; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/isaiah/26:19/" target="_blank">Isaiah 26:19</a>)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/john/2:19-21/" target="_blank">John 2:19-21</a>)</p><p></p><p><strong>Return of Christ</strong></p><p>Found in OT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/zechariah/14:1-5/" target="_blank">Zechariah 14:1-5</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/micah/1:3-4/" target="_blank">Micah 1:3-4</a>)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/16:27-28/" target="_blank">Matthew 16:27-28</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/acts-of-the-apostles/1:11/" target="_blank">Acts 1:11</a>, 3:20)</p><p></p><p><strong>Sin offering</strong></p><p>Found in OT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/exodus/30:10/" target="_blank">Exodus 30:10</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/leviticus/4:3/" target="_blank">Leviticus 4:3</a>)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/romans/8:3/" target="_blank">Romans 8:3</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/10:18/" target="_blank">Hebrews 10:18</a>, 13:11)</p><p></p><p><strong>Son of God</strong></p><p>Found in OT (Psalm 2:7)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/john/5:18/" target="_blank">John 5:18</a>)</p><p></p><p><strong>Substitutionary Atonement</strong></p><p>Found in OT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/isaiah/53:6-12/" target="_blank">Isaiah 53:6-12</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/leviticus/6:4-10/" target="_blank">Leviticus 6:4-10</a>,21)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/20:28/" target="_blank">Matthew 20:28</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/1-peter/2:24/" target="_blank">1 Peter 2:24</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/2-corinthians/5:21/" target="_blank">2 Corinthians 5:21</a>; <a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/1-peter/3:18/" target="_blank">1 Peter 3:18</a>)</p><p></p><p><strong>Virgin Birth</strong></p><p>Found in OT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/isaiah/7:14/" target="_blank">Isaiah 7:14</a>)</p><p>Fulfilled in NT (<a href="http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/1:25/" target="_blank">Matthew 1:25</a>)</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Jesus Himself was the fulfillment of the Law. To fulfill the law is to never break it, not even one little time. Never tell a lie, never covet your neighbor's stuff, never put anything before God, never steal anything, etc. Yes, Jesus being fully God and fully man is the only person capable of fulfilling/never breaking the law.</p><p></p><p>To break the Law is sin and the wages of sin is death. That is eternal separation from God for breaking the law, just once, and we all break the law everyday. Sin must be judged and what is the judgement? Death. We are eternally lost in our sin. We deserve death.</p><p></p><p>What are we to do? There is no way for us to save ourselves because we have already sinned and the wages of sin is death. Jesus lived a sinless life. He never broke the law even once. His sinless life and the fact that He was fully man qualified Him to be the atoning sacrifice for all mankind. In other words, since He never broke the law, He could die in my place and pay the wages for <strong>my</strong> sin. He takes my sin and gives me His righteousness so that I am made right with God. My sin has been judged and the price for it has been paid. Someone will pay for <strong>your</strong> sin too. Either you or Jesus. Only through Jesus can your sin debt be paid for and you be made right with God. Jesus is the bridge, over the chasm of sin, between God and man.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AvgJoe, post: 70140554, member: 99910"] What verses are you seeing that you think disprove that Jesus is God? Is it the verses that call Jesus the Son of Man? Because Jesus is both, both God and man. Jesus is [I]the Son of God[/I], then He must be God. In the first chapter of Genesis, we are taught that every living thing reproduces after its own [B]kind[/B]. Who was Jesus' Father? The Holy Spirit ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/1:18/'][COLOR=#000000]Matthew 1:18[/COLOR][/URL], 20; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/luke/1:35/'][COLOR=#000000]Luke 1:35[/COLOR][/URL]). Who is the Holy Spirit? He is God ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/acts-of-the-apostles/5:3-4/'][COLOR=#000000]Acts 5:3-4[/COLOR][/URL]). Just as my father was a man, I am man. Jesus' father was God, so Jesus is God. Jesus is [I]the Son of God, [/I]because He is God. In the same manner, Jesus' mother was a woman, so Jesus is a man. Jesus is [I]the Son of Man, [/I]because He is a man. Birthed by both God and mankind, Jesus is both God and man. A kind begets like kind. [B] [/B] Because, unlike the three Synoptic Gospels, John’s purpose is not to present a chronological narrative of the life of Christ but to display His deity. The author cites the purpose of the gospel of John as follows: “But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name” (John 20:31). John sought to strengthen the faith of second-generation believers and bring about faith in others, but he also sought to correct a false teaching that was spreading in the first century. John emphasized Jesus Christ as “the Son of God,” fully God and fully man, contrary to a false doctrine that taught the “Christ-spirit” came upon the human Jesus at His baptism and left Him at the crucifixion. 1) Jesus received worship ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/2:2/']Matthew 2:2[/URL], 14:33, 28:9). Jesus said to worship God only, yet He receives worship and never told those who were worshiping Him to stop, thus, claiming to be God. 2) Following are some of the New Testament themes that are found in the Old Testament, many of which attests to Jesus' divinity. [B]Ascension of Jesus to the right hand of God[/B] Found in the OT (Psalm 110:1) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/26:64/']Matthew 26:64[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/acts-of-the-apostles/7:55-60/']Acts 7:55-60[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/ephesians/1:20/']Ephesians 1:20[/URL]) [B]Atonement by blood[/B] Found in the OT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/leviticus/17:11/']Leviticus 17:11[/URL]) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/9:22/']Hebrews 9:22[/URL]) [B]Begotten Son, Jesus is[/B] Found in OT (Psalm 2:7) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/acts-of-the-apostles/13:33/']Acts 13:33[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/1:5/']Hebrews 1:5[/URL]) [B]Crucifixion[/B] Found in OT (Psalm 22:11-18; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/zechariah/12:10/']Zechariah 12:10[/URL]) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/luke/22:33-38/']Luke 22:33-38[/URL]) [B]Eternal Son[/B] Found in OT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/micah/5:1-2/']Micah 5:1-2[/URL]; Psalm 2:7) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/1:5/']Hebrews 1:5[/URL], 5:5) [B]God among His people[/B] Found in OT ( [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/isaiah/9:6/']Isaiah 9:6[/URL]) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/john/1:1/']John 1:1[/URL], 14; 20:28; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/colossians/2:9/']Colossians 2:9[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/3:3/']Matthew 3:3[/URL]) [B]Incarnation of God[/B] Found in OT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/exodus/3:14/']Exodus 3:14[/URL]; Psalm 45:6; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/isaiah/9:6/']Isaiah 9:6[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/zechariah/12:10/']Zechariah 12:10[/URL]) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/john/8:58/']John 8:58[/URL]; 1:1, 14; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/1:8/']Hebrews 1:8[/URL], [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/colossians/2:9/']Colossians 2:9[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/1:1-3/']Hebrews 1:1-3[/URL]) [B]Only Begotten Son[/B] Found in OT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/genesis/22:2/']Genesis 22:2[/URL]) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/john/3:16/']John 3:16[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/11:7/']Hebrews 11:7[/URL]) [B]Resurrection of Christ[/B] Found in OT (Psalm 16:9-10; 49:15; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/isaiah/26:19/']Isaiah 26:19[/URL]) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/john/2:19-21/']John 2:19-21[/URL]) [B]Return of Christ[/B] Found in OT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/zechariah/14:1-5/']Zechariah 14:1-5[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/micah/1:3-4/']Micah 1:3-4[/URL]) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/16:27-28/']Matthew 16:27-28[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/acts-of-the-apostles/1:11/']Acts 1:11[/URL], 3:20) [B]Sin offering[/B] Found in OT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/exodus/30:10/']Exodus 30:10[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/leviticus/4:3/']Leviticus 4:3[/URL]) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/romans/8:3/']Romans 8:3[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/hebrews/10:18/']Hebrews 10:18[/URL], 13:11) [B]Son of God[/B] Found in OT (Psalm 2:7) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/john/5:18/']John 5:18[/URL]) [B]Substitutionary Atonement[/B] Found in OT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/isaiah/53:6-12/']Isaiah 53:6-12[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/leviticus/6:4-10/']Leviticus 6:4-10[/URL],21) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/20:28/']Matthew 20:28[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/1-peter/2:24/']1 Peter 2:24[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/2-corinthians/5:21/']2 Corinthians 5:21[/URL]; [URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/1-peter/3:18/']1 Peter 3:18[/URL]) [B]Virgin Birth[/B] Found in OT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/isaiah/7:14/']Isaiah 7:14[/URL]) Fulfilled in NT ([URL='http://www.christianforums.com/bible/matthew/1:25/']Matthew 1:25[/URL]) Jesus Himself was the fulfillment of the Law. To fulfill the law is to never break it, not even one little time. Never tell a lie, never covet your neighbor's stuff, never put anything before God, never steal anything, etc. Yes, Jesus being fully God and fully man is the only person capable of fulfilling/never breaking the law. To break the Law is sin and the wages of sin is death. That is eternal separation from God for breaking the law, just once, and we all break the law everyday. Sin must be judged and what is the judgement? Death. We are eternally lost in our sin. We deserve death. What are we to do? There is no way for us to save ourselves because we have already sinned and the wages of sin is death. Jesus lived a sinless life. He never broke the law even once. His sinless life and the fact that He was fully man qualified Him to be the atoning sacrifice for all mankind. In other words, since He never broke the law, He could die in my place and pay the wages for [B]my[/B] sin. He takes my sin and gives me His righteousness so that I am made right with God. My sin has been judged and the price for it has been paid. Someone will pay for [B]your[/B] sin too. Either you or Jesus. Only through Jesus can your sin debt be paid for and you be made right with God. Jesus is the bridge, over the chasm of sin, between God and man. [/QUOTE]
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