Good downloadable English translation of Talmud?

[muddleglum]

For a linux machine...

I did have one by a group that had a lovely system of propaganda against Judaism. I ignored the propaganda and downloaded their Talmud to use. The problems? They only put in the parts that they seem to think proved their point and, well, let's just say I didn't trust them too much. My hard disk crashed and my backup hadn't backed them up for some reason, but I wasn't too concerned.

There was another Talmud by a different translator that was for Windows. However, I study on a Linux machine.

I'm guessing that archive.org has copies, but those would be either images, with perhaps OCR from images without any error correction. That makes it rather hard to do any search. Have I missed something because of an OCR error? This is especially depressing in the older books scanned from a library. Do you know what wormholes do to OCR?.

So, is there a good English translation on the Internet that I can download and use off-line?

I would appreciate any help. Thank you!

 

[JeffTheLearner]

I recommend the Babylonian & Jerusalem Talmud (ignore the bloat of fluff in its commentary) <Staff Edit>
Halakhah.com Babylonian Talmud Online in English

...they all are in pdf format.

Also I recommend you download the Google Books app, you can find many works published before the 1970s available free of charge.

Also the Internet Archive is an awsome resource for finding many works indiscriminate of language restrictions ...the link here: https://archive.org/index.php

 

[JeffTheLearner]

Whoops ...didnt know you use a Linux box, yeah, the Internet Archive does not only have PDF copies but they also format all the books on the site into .txt ...though it is obvious it was not done with care, but by machine.

 

[yonah_mishael]

I recommend the Babylonian & Jerusalem Talmud (ignore the bloat of fluff in its commentary) ...but you can also find the more hypocritical rantings of religious self seeking lunatics here too at this link:
Halakhah.com Babylonian Talmud Online in English

...they all are in pdf format.

So, just how much do you hate religious Jews? Just curious...

 

[Aryeh Jay]

I found that learning Hebrew was a lot easier than the Talmud, plus, there is some commentary that does not get translated into English.

 

[Aryeh Jay]

So, just how much do you hate religious Jews? Just curious...

What do you find wrong or offensive with “but you can also find the more hypocritical rantings of religious self seeking lunatics here too” other than the lack of a hyphen?

 

[yonah_mishael]

What do you find wrong or offensive with “but you can also find the more hypocritical rantings of religious self seeking lunatics here too” other than the lack of a hyphen?

LOL

 

[JeffTheLearner]

So, just how much do you hate religious Jews? Just curious...

How is it you equate a loathing of repetitive and over redundant religious practices to a "hate" of "religious jews?" ...an over reactive sense of chariness paired with a constant paranoia are symptoms of schizophrenia.

I disapprove of religious groups adding to torah as much as those who take away from it ...I guess if you were to assign an ethnic pedigree to all such factions in your mind I couldnt possibly have any such racial preferences because I would equally "hate" them all ...again, in YOUR mind.

 

[JeffTheLearner]

Secondly I should add my family fled from Germany because of antisemetic persecution ...do you really think I would hate myself?

 

[yonah_mishael]

Oh, you don't hate Jews - you just hate Judaism and what has come from the Jewish religion. Is that it?

 

[JeffTheLearner]

Oh, you don't hate Jews - you just hate Judaism and what has come from the Jewish religion. Is that it?

You are goating me, and are attemting to find a twist in my words to capitalize on. Sheesh, can I just not agree with some writings without all the extra innuendos directed at my personal character?

The only reflection upon my personal character should be that I hold a critical bias, and preference, all other implications are imaginative.

 

[yonah_mishael]

If you hadn't made the following comment, I wouldn't have found need to confront you about it:

I recommend the Babylonian & Jerusalem Talmud (ignore the bloat of fluff in its commentary) ...but you can also find the more hypocritical rantings of religious self seeking lunatics here too at this link...​

Just after this comment, you gave a link to the Babylonian Talmud in English translation. You characterize the foundational documents of Rabbinic Judaism as "bloat of fluff" and "hypocritical rantings of self-seeking lunatics." This is a rude and uncalled-for generalization.

 

[YESLORDIWILL]

.

 

[JeffTheLearner]

If you hadn't made the following comment, I wouldn't have found need to confront you about it:

I recommend the Babylonian & Jerusalem Talmud (ignore the bloat of fluff in its commentary) ...but you can also find the more hypocritical rantings of religious self seeking lunatics here too at this link...​

Just after this comment, you gave a link to the Babylonian Talmud in English translation. You characterize the foundational documents of Rabbinic Judaism as "bloat of fluff" and "hypocritical rantings of self-seeking lunatics." This is a rude and uncalled-for generalization.

It is written by many lunatics ...are you telling me the following quotes are from sane peaceful folk?!?


* &#8220;If a &#8216;goy&#8217; (Gentile) hits a Jew he must be killed.&#8221; (Sanhedrin 58b)

* &#8220;If a Jew finds an object lost by a &#8216;goy&#8217; it does not have to be returned.&#8221; (Baba Mezia 24a)

* &#8220;If a Jew murders a &#8216;goy&#8217; there will be no death penalty.&#8221; (Sanhedrin 57a)

* What a Jew steals from a &#8216;goy&#8217; he may keep.&#8221; (Sanhedrin 57a)

* &#8220;Jews may use subterfuges to circumvent a &#8216;goy.&#8217;&#8221; (Baba Kamma 113a)

* &#8220;All children of the &#8216;goyim&#8217; (Gentiles) are animals.&#8221; (Yebamoth 98a)

* &#8220;Girls born of the &#8216;goyim&#8217; are in a state of &#8216;niddah&#8217; (menstrual uncleanness!) from birth.&#8221; (Abodah Zarah 36b)

* &#8220;The &#8216;goyim&#8217; are not humans. They are beasts.&#8221; (Baba Mezia 114b)

* &#8220;If you eat with a &#8216;goy&#8217; it is the same as eating with a dog.&#8221; (Tosapoth, Jebamoth 94b)

* &#8220;Even the best of the &#8216;goyim&#8217; should all be killed.&#8221; (Soferim 15)

* &#8220;Sexual intercourse between the &#8216;goyim&#8217; is like intercourse between animals.&#8221; (Sanhedrin 74b)

* &#8220;When it comes to a Gentile in peace times, one may harm him indirectly, for instance, by removing a ladder after he had fallen into a crevice.&#8221; (Shulkan Arukh, Yoreh De &#8216;ah, 158, Hebrew Edition only)

* &#8220;&#8216;Yashu&#8217; (Jesus) is in Hell being boiled in hot excrement.&#8221; (Gittin 57a)

* Yashu (Jesus) was sexually immoral and worshipped a brick.&#8221; (Sanhedrin 107b)

* &#8220;Yashu (Jesus) was cut off from the Jewish people for his wickedness and refused to repent.&#8221; (Sotah 47a)

* &#8220;Miriam the hairdresser had sex with many men.&#8221; (Shabbath 104b, Hebrew Edition only)

* &#8220;She who was the descendant of princes and governors (the virgin Mary) played the harlot with carpenters.&#8221; (Sanhedrin 106a)

* &#8220;Christians who reject the Talmud will go to hell and be punished there for all generations.&#8221; (Rosh Hashanah 17a)

....does not seem sane to me, its just an observation of the obvious.

 

[yonah_mishael]

Think about the position in which these people were in. How many goyim do you think struck Jews at the time? This was a way for them to feel that they had power. Why not just let the weak have their ways of getting revenge on the strong?

As per the stories of Jesus in the Talmud, it's clear that the story of Jesus given there is very different from the stories presented in the gospels. Those who wrote the Babylonian Talmudic materials heard a story very different from the gospel being preached in the western part of the Empire.

I would suggest a part of Richard Carrier's On the Historicity of Jesus. I can give you the page numbers when I get home later. He makes a great case regarding the Talmudic mentions of Jesus and how they compare to other traditions of Jesus within the East. If you want, I can type out a portion that I think is relevant.

 

[muddleglum]

Think about the position in which these people were in. How many goyim do you think struck Jews at the time? This was a way for them to feel that they had power. Why not just let the weak have their ways of getting revenge on the strong?

I.e., they were human.

As per the stories of Jesus in the Talmud, it's clear that the story of Jesus given there is very different from the stories presented in the gospels. Those who wrote the Babylonian Talmudic materials heard a story very different from the gospel being preached in the western part of the Empire.

Good point. Thank you!
Another point is that the Talmud isn't written by one person or even one group. It is a mixture. Like, like... um... on this forum. So there is a divergence of opinion.

My original reason for reading the Talmud was to see for myself what the context of many of the negative saying were. Right, I don't trust anyone. It opened my eyes to the divergent thoughts, which earned me a quick kick from myself. My main reason now is to view how the Jews around the time of Jesus thought.

 

[muddleglum]

this link:
Halakhah.com Babylonian Talmud Online in English

Thank you! I'll have to get it sometimes soon after I review wget's man page.

 

[danny ski]

It is written by many lunatics ...are you telling me the following quotes are from sane peaceful folk?!?


* “If a ‘goy’ (Gentile) hits a Jew he must be killed.” (Sanhedrin 58b)

* “If a Jew finds an object lost by a ‘goy’ it does not have to be returned.” (Baba Mezia 24a)

* “If a Jew murders a ‘goy’ there will be no death penalty.” (Sanhedrin 57a)

* What a Jew steals from a ‘goy’ he may keep.” (Sanhedrin 57a)

* “Jews may use subterfuges to circumvent a ‘goy.’” (Baba Kamma 113a)

* “All children of the ‘goyim’ (Gentiles) are animals.” (Yebamoth 98a)

* “Girls born of the ‘goyim’ are in a state of ‘niddah’ (menstrual uncleanness!) from birth.” (Abodah Zarah 36b)

* “The ‘goyim’ are not humans. They are beasts.” (Baba Mezia 114b)

* “If you eat with a ‘goy’ it is the same as eating with a dog.” (Tosapoth, Jebamoth 94b)

* “Even the best of the ‘goyim’ should all be killed.” (Soferim 15)

* “Sexual intercourse between the ‘goyim’ is like intercourse between animals.” (Sanhedrin 74b)

* “When it comes to a Gentile in peace times, one may harm him indirectly, for instance, by removing a ladder after he had fallen into a crevice.” (Shulkan Arukh, Yoreh De ‘ah, 158, Hebrew Edition only)

* “‘Yashu’ (Jesus) is in Hell being boiled in hot excrement.” (Gittin 57a)

* Yashu (Jesus) was sexually immoral and worshipped a brick.” (Sanhedrin 107b)

* “Yashu (Jesus) was cut off from the Jewish people for his wickedness and refused to repent.” (Sotah 47a)

* “Miriam the hairdresser had sex with many men.” (Shabbath 104b, Hebrew Edition only)

* “She who was the descendant of princes and governors (the virgin Mary) played the harlot with carpenters.” (Sanhedrin 106a)

* “Christians who reject the Talmud will go to hell and be punished there for all generations.” (Rosh Hashanah 17a)

....does not seem sane to me, its just an observation of the obvious.

Another Jewish lunatic compared goyim to dogs. You should apply the same amount of understanding and honesty to the opinion contained in the Talmud as to that particular Jew.

 

[Aryeh Jay]

It is written by many lunatics ...are you telling me the following quotes are from sane peaceful folk?!?



* &#8220;Even the best of the &#8216;goyim&#8217; should all be killed.&#8221; (Soferim 15)



....does not seem sane to me, its just an observation of the obvious.

One sentence, taken way out of context.

This one sentence used to discredit the Talmud is from a discussion on Exodus explaining how Pharaoh was able to have horses available to pull chariots after the plagues killed all the Egyptians horses.



Here is the passage being discussed&#8230;

Exodus 14:5-7 "It was told to the king of Egypt that the people had fled; and the heart of Pharaoh and his servants became transformed regarding the people, and they said, 'What is this that we have done that we have sent away Israel from serving us?' He harnessed his chariot and attracted his people with him.] He took six hundred elite chariots [and all the chariots of Egypt, with officers on them all."

And this is the commentary, note that the commentary in full does not support the initial message that Jews are supposed to kill even the best of the Nations.

From whom were the animals that drove the chariots? If you say they were from Egypt, doesn't it say (Exodus 9:6) "and all the livestock of Egypt died [from the fifth plague]"? If you say they were from Pharaoh, doesn't it say (Exodus 9:3) "[Moses said to Pharaoh]: Behold, the hand of G-d is on your livestock that are in the field"? If you say they were from the Jews, doesn't it say (Exodus 10:26) "And our livestock, as well, will go with us- not a hoof will be left"? Rather from whom were they, from the Egyptians who feared G-d [and were not affected by the plagues]. We now see that the livestock of the G-d-fearers that escaped the plague caused great hardship for the Jews [by being used for chariots to pursue them]. From here R. Shimon [ben Yochai] said: Kill [even] the good among the gentiles [Egyptians].

I am not going to refute the rest of these out of context posts because my time is more valuable than correcting all the out of context information from anti-Talmud hate sites.

 

[JeffTheLearner]

I wouldn't go to an antisemetic "hate site" ...but I guess that is your only defence.