God's role in creation?

[soul_biscuit]

This poll is intended to survey the positions of people in this forum on the question of God's role in the origin of life, the universe, and everything. I know that there is a great diversity of opinion on this matter among Christians, just as there is among any group of people, and I would like to sample from that pool, if I may.

Because of the spirit in which I post this poll, I'm not going to try to argue my position against anyone here. There are plenty of other places on the forum to do that. If you want to argue your position, though, I'll happily consider what you have to present.

I have chosen not to include an "other" option. I recognize that no one's opinion is likely to match any of the choices I've offered exactly. I hope the reader will choose the option that most closely matches her belief, and explain any deviations from it in a post.

Thanks very much!

 

[AV1611VET]

I voted Option #1.

 

[arunma]

My view on creation is: if you reject Jesus you will go to hell.

Allow me to explain. I find that often times, people debate the issue of creation and evolution as a smokescreen. It's an easy way to debate the merits of Christianity without getting into messy issues like sin and repentance. Non-Christians often seem to believe that if they can disprove the Biblical account of creation, then they can convince themselves that God won't send them to hell for failing to repent and believe in the Gospel. It is not to say that I don't value what the Bible says about creation. I personally believe in the theological and scientific position known as Old Earth Creation. But to an unbeliever, I think that the issue of the eternal state of your soul ought to be of greater importance than the age of the earth or the veracity of evolutionary theory. Believe what you wish about creation, but I'm more interested in what you believe about Jesus Christ.

 

[soul_biscuit]

Allow me to explain. I find that often times, people debate the issue of creation and evolution as a smokescreen. It's an easy way to debate the merits of Christianity without getting into messy issues like sin and repentance. Non-Christians often seem to believe that if they can disprove the Biblical account of creation, then they can convince themselves that God won't send them to hell for failing to repent and believe in the Gospel.

It seems to me that believers often think this of nonbelievers; that they're just casting about for any excuse not to be accountable to God.

Arunma, that is simply not the case.

I accept evolution because all the evidence tells me I should. I reject creation because, not only is it contradicted by the evidence, it is an unfalsifiable and therefore unscientific position. I argue against creationism because I don't want to see science bogged down by untenable ideas. Science saves lives, and it would be insane to hinder it by slapping religious doctrine onto it.

I don't believe in God because I see no evidence that would encourage me to do so. It has nothing to do with wishing carte blanche to sin as much as I want. I, in fact, live a very moral life from almost anyone's viewpoint.

This idea that atheists simply don't want to be accountable to God is a fiction, nothing more.

 

[theVirginian]

The universe, including Earth, are eleventy bazillion years old. Earth as we know it is only 6000+ years old. There is an unknown gap of time between Adam being created and his fall. I don't think it was all that long, but I doubt that was contained in an 8th day.

 

[314159]

I chose option #4, because (amongst other things), carbon-dating and Hubble's research into the expansion of space indicate that the universe cannot possibly be as young as a few millenia old.

 

[Apodictic]

Here is my personal view on creation and the existence of the universe.

Think about dominos. You can set them all up in a certain pattern then gently tip one and the whole thing goes on without further stimulus. This is the analogy I like to use for God's creation. He set everything up, then provided the ignition and boom...here we are. And God knows everything that will happen, because God defined every turn and every pattern the universe will obey.

Science observes the dominos falling and makes note of what can be expected, we call these "Laws" if they are realible and empirical or "Theories/Approximations" if they are unreliable for all cases or yet to be proven through empirical means. So I do not believe Science is in opposition to God. A believer can conduct the same Scientific test and see God's Glory and Hand at play. What we do know about our universe is amazing if you think about it.

 

[Quaero]

Here is my personal view on creation and the existence of the universe.

Think about dominos. You can set them all up in a certain pattern then gently tip one and the whole thing goes on without further stimulus. This is the analogy I like to use for God's creation. He set everything up, then provided the ignition and boom...here we are. And God knows everything that will happen, because God defined every turn and every pattern the universe will obey.

Science observes the dominos falling and makes note of what can be expected, we call these "Laws" if they are realible and empirical or "Theories/Approximations" if they are unreliable for all cases or yet to be proven through empirical means. So I do not believe Science is in opposition to God. A believer can conduct the same Scientific test and see God's Glory and Hand at play. What we do know about our universe is amazing if you think about it.

hehe I like this metaphor, however isn't it a very deist outlook?

Anyway as far as modern science can explain the universe originated ex nihilo. This theory requires an an instigating force. Then we have life on earth which exploded, suddenly, from rocks and water. which again would require an instigating force. Unless evolution can take place in inanimate objects that science still lacks an explanation. So I'm still trying to work this out myself, the rationalization behind creation remains still a matter of faith in the unknown.

 

[70x7]

Numero Uno

 

[314159]

And God knows everything that will happen, because God defined every turn and every pattern the universe will obey.

The type of universe to which you are refering is known as a determenistic universe. In fact, the field of quantum mechanics has effectively shown that our universe is not a determenistic one - subatomic particles do not have a definite position in space until observed, some subatomic processes happen completely at random (i.e. no causation).

What we do know about our universe is amazing if you think about it.

Agreed. What we don't know is more interesting though

 

[GreenMunchkin]

I couldn't vote for any of those options. Sorry, I know it's a pedantic but none of them cover what I believe... I believe God has used evolution within a given species, but speciation is a fallacy.

Also, I think God hand-crafted every single one of us; thought us up, loved us and hand-made us - He doesn't just give us a soul.

 

[soul_biscuit]

Anyway as far as modern science can explain the universe originated ex nihilo. This theory requires an an instigating force.

How do you know that? Physics as we understand it can say nothing on what happened before the Planck time. How do you know that spacetime isn't closed, and that the universe isn't eternal?

Then we have life on earth which exploded, suddenly, from rocks and water. which again would require an instigating force. Unless evolution can take place in inanimate objects that science still lacks an explanation.

In what sense did life "explode suddenly" from rocks and water? (And not rocks, by the way, but complex organic molecules, which would have formed spontaneously in the environment of early Earth.) All that had to happen was the formation of a self-replicating molecule. Once this happened, natural selection would take over. Perhaps it's unlikely, but Earth has been around for billions of years, and it only had to happen once.

o I'm still trying to work this out myself, the rationalization behind creation remains still a matter of faith in the unknown.

No faith is required. Where no evidence exists, the only honest answer remains "I don't know."

 

[jesugino]

The need of creation is to fulfill the attainment of heavenly life after several problems in this world. John 3-16,"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son"

 

[PhilosophicalBluster]

(And not rocks, by the way, but complex organic molecules, which would have formed spontaneously in the environment of early Earth.)

(By the way, soul_biscuit, this is addressing everybody, not just you, I thought it would sort of complement what you said, though)

What was the experiment called that replicated primitive Earth conditions in a controlled environment? I think it was the Miller Urey experiment, right?

Anyway, they replicated primitive Earth conditions and put them in a little assembly and just let it sit. I forget exactly how long, over two decades though. It's still running, and guess what? Not only did it form the building blocks for life (amino acids, proteins, etcetera) but it also formed proto-cells (groups of macromolecules that exhibit some of the standards to be considered 'living' but not all of them). Do you know how insane that is? And lets not forget, this was a >100 year period. In all the time that Earth had to stew that mix together, there is no doubt in my mind that fully living cells can be made.

Option 3 for me, theistic evolution.