Not necessarily, if we're understanding this as a literal thing. The metaphorical interpretation is much interesting and useful, IMO.
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I am sure you are not that ignorant of Christian theology. As an atheist would be only too happy to point out, without the Fall of Man the whole of Christian theology falls apart.
Not necessarily, if we're understanding this as a literal thing. The metaphorical interpretation is much interesting and useful, IMO.
What's your opinion on this?
Even though I am a Calvinist, my opinion would be much the same as that of the Catholic Church (or Mr Warfield).
I don't know which universe you live in, but I have never once heard a pastor or priest say that Lucifer referred to Satan. Apart from anything else, it would be perfectly obvious to anybody who could read that it didn't. And, believe it or not, you are not the only literate person in the universe
I am sure you are not that ignorant of Christian theology. As an atheist would be only too happy to point out, without the Fall of Man the whole of Christian theology falls apart.
I'm not saying Lucifer is Satan, I'm saying Lucifer the fallen angel is an invention of Jerome and nothing more.
The only "crime" Jerome was guilty of was to translate a Hebrew phrase, with a Latin word which meant more or less the same thing. The rest is all in your febrile imagination.
I imagined up an entirely new evil being and named him for the minds of men and created the resulting tons of story dogma wrapped around such an error of translation?
It is not in the interest of the Church to promote the power and existence of Evil so that the Church might appear more righteous in fighting it?
Is that not the whole point of "hellfire and brimstone" and "demon's just waiting to jump into meditating minds" sermons? The assertion of the power of Satan to cause fear and greater need for the church? Just how passionately did Jerome believe in the power of the Devil?
Lucifer is a perfectly good Latin word, which is a perfectly good translation of a perfectly good Hebrew phrase.
Furthermore, the words Σατανας and διαβολος are scattered throughout the New Testament. Nobody needed to make them up.
So now you are going to rewrite the entire Bible to dispense with the notion of evil.
Apart from being a connoisseur of crackpot science, you are also a conspiracy theorist par excellence.
Isaiah 45:7 "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil (calamity): I the LORD do all these things."
The purpose of the Church has become for the existence of the Church and it has throughout history
You assert that the dogma of Lucifer the fallen angel is not a part of mainstream Christianity? Because that would be news to me.
And yes, I should specify the establishment and not the bell curve of it's adherents.
Perhaps what you mistake as my "big head" is a passion for Truth and zeal against lies that chain mankind in ignorance and fear. Especially by those who would pose as an authority between man and God.
I'm not saying Lucifer is Satan, I'm saying Lucifer the fallen angel is an invention of Jerome and nothing more.
So now that reference refers back to the falls of Man when it is specifically referenced to Venus, the "rising star that is cast down and does not take his place among the rest of the stars."
King Neb was a good and noble King in the beginning. A light among men. Then he became corrupt and fell. Like the motions of Venus that "started" all fallen angel mythos.
And besides that root of the meaning "breaker of the dawn" was the morning crier. So a true translation would read "Wail (weep, howl, cry) oh sun of the morning."
We could instead talk about the error that Satan is a rebel angel, doing as he wills out of God's hands....*popcorn*
Telephone games in verse.
What do you mean by telephone games?
And when I started interpreting the OT prophets as referring to historical events, this really opened the Bible up to me and a profoundly detailed and interesting document. It was also amazing to me how many verses I and other people in my church and Christendom used verses in ways that weren't meant to be used at all, typically for the sake of overglorifying Christ, almost to the point of theological compulsion.
The telephone game is where a story is told in a circle and it has completely changed by the time it gets back to the original speaker.
It is the nature of change in stories through time by incremental creep of details. My earlier sentence should read "telephone game in reverse"
The stories we have now are like so many leaves that obscure the divisions and branches through time, and also hides the single trunk it all comes from. Looking backwards is through a glass darkly
Even more hidden are the roots where the tree came from beneath the surface appearance of things.
The seed it all started as is nowhere to be found.
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