God is angry

[Beanieboy]

This was inspired by a post about Rob Bell
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7mEazce3D0&feature=related

The blowhorn-like preacher. He preaches against Rob Bell, who they claim that God is not Angry, and that the world is not right with the world.

The man preaches that God loves you, but hates sin, and yet, he claims that God is angry, and not reconciled with God.

You have to do something to get right with God, which is to repent.
Apparently, you can save yourself. You have to do something. You activate salvation.

What is your opinion of this kind of preaching? Do you believe that it is active, or inactive? Is it accurate? Is it the same preaching of Christ?

I find it ironic that the only person that God is not angry with is the man claiming that God is angry at everyone else. And yet, he wants you to believe that God is angry at you, and yet, God is also a God of Love. Does he still sin? Yes, according to the bible, yet he is no longer one of the "wicked." Is he sinless? No. His sins must just not count. (A Christian once told me that once your sins are forgiven, you no longer sin, because you are no longer held to the law. This is a bit of a cop out, because no matter what you do, you no longer see it as a sin, so you have nothing to repent from, while you judge the sins of others.)

Is this an okay way to preach? What do you think of him preaching outside where Rob Bell was speaking?

 

[Meshavrischika]

it's flawed. God is not angry. Salvation is not earned and does not come from an individual.

you still do "sin action" but don't carry the stain... so yes he sins but in a way is is also sinless because it's not held against him... it's complicated. that doesn't mean you do it habitually, but that's a conviction thing and God working in you... so it's not a gimme where you get to be bad.

you can preach whatever you want, but that doesn't make it right. so yes.

and preaching outside the building is rude. so, yes he can, but he's being a jerk.

 

[gengwall]

This was inspired by a post about Rob Bell
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7mEazce3D0&feature=related

The blowhorn-like preacher. He preaches against Rob Bell, who they claim that God is not Angry, and that the world is not right with the world.

The man preaches that God loves you, but hates sin, and yet, he claims that God is angry, and not reconciled with God.

You have to do something to get right with God, which is to repent.
Apparently, you can save yourself. You have to do something. You activate salvation.

What is your opinion of this kind of preaching? Do you believe that it is active, or inactive? Is it accurate? Is it the same preaching of Christ?

I find it ironic that the only person that God is not angry with is the man claiming that God is angry at everyone else. And yet, he wants you to believe that God is angry at you, and yet, God is also a God of Love. Does he still sin? Yes, according to the bible, yet he is no longer one of the "wicked." Is he sinless? No. His sins must just not count. (A Christian once told me that once your sins are forgiven, you no longer sin, because you are no longer held to the law. This is a bit of a cop out, because no matter what you do, you no longer see it as a sin, so you have nothing to repent from, while you judge the sins of others.)

Is this an okay way to preach? What do you think of him preaching outside where Rob Bell was speaking?

Is this the same Rob Bell who wrote Velvet Elvis?

Oh yea - what ElsanRandiMom wrote.

 

[Beanieboy]

One of the logic problems about that is: if you believe in God, you aren't held to the bible (so you read it, but don't have to live by it, because it doesn't count, really.) If you aren't Christian, you don't read it, but are held to it.

It doesn't make much sense.

When I was a child, my mother expected me to act my age. If I was 2, I would act like a two year old, but if I was 5, I was expected not to throw temper tantrums, because I knew better.

This logic suggests that even though you know better, you aren't held to it, but you are held to the law if you don't know better.

Who would you expect to try to live by the bible, the nonchrisitan, or the Christian? And yet, God expects the nonchristian to live by it, and disregards the actions of the Christian?

A second flaw in logic with this kind of preaching is that it preaches fear - love God or else!!!

Would you leave Christianity if I told you that Allah was going to send you to a place were snakes would daily attack and devour you for all eternity? Would you leave it if I used a blow horn?

Would you love someone that gave you the choice between loving them back, or being buried alive? Is that Love?

That's how it is preached. It's preached that a) you have to change to be acceptable to God. God doesn't love you as you are. You have to repent of ALL sin. I can tell you from experience when I was Christian that some people take that to mean that they can never become loved by God, because they can't reach perfection, can't totally stop sinning forever. b) If you can change yourself, then why do you need God? c) Who do you love more: the person that loves you as you are, and encourages you to grow, or the person that is conditional in their love -ie. I will love you if you change? How can one believe that God has unconditional love for us, when we place this condition of love on the "sinner"?

Buddhism teaches that you are already the Buddha, already perfect. When you realize this, you begin to change naturally. You shed a lot of behavior and attitudes, you are at peace, and you tend to feel empathy and love for others.

In contrast, people in the church are taught that they are disgusting piles of filth to God, and their best acts of kindness are filthy rags. They are taught to think of themselves as sinners, and then, are confused why sin is such a struggle.

If someone believes they are beautiful, it raidiates from the inside. They have confidence, and regardless of how they appear, their soul seems to transcend. Someone who believes they are ugly will often degrade themselves, look sad, unconfident, look down, and the observer may come to believe it as well.

It seems that telling oneself how negative you are, how disgusting and worthless you are, is going to lead to negative action.

Do you really believe that prostitutes and drug dealers got where they are because they love themselves so much, or their lack of self love and self worth?

 

[Meshavrischika]

One of the logic problems about that is: if you believe in God, you aren't held to the bible (so you read it, but don't have to live by it, because it doesn't count, really.) If you aren't Christian, you don't read it, but are held to it.

what's "that"... I'm confused. IMO the bible is an accessory to your faith and not essential, but living a Christian life won't contridict it. And the unsaved masses are only held accountable to one idea (accepting Christ) that they're judged on... only Christians have to "follow the rules" persay.

 

[Beanieboy]

This is one of the videos that he has. Unfortunately, it's just a preview, and I'm not sure if you can see the full version at Noona, or if it is a preview to buy it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eau07xkFG2c

 

[Beanieboy]

Here's another reaction. He uses the annoying "if a guy is walking towards a cliff:

4 Doctors:
1st: Doctor scare only tells people they are going to die, and doesn't tell people why.
2nd Doctor Woo tells people on the street that they have frozen custard in the cafeteria, and social meetings.
3rd Doctor Love, tells patients that he loves them, and listens to them, but never examines them, and never tells them that they are terminal, because he does think it's very loving. People walk away sick and not knowing they are going to die.
It's like a blind man walking up to a cliff, without warning them.
4th Dr. Reason: Examines the patient, tells him that they are terminal, and then tells them the cure. Then they want to be healed.

The video copies the bench sitting Rob with clips like Rob's, only his clips are just random clips of students walking around. There is often a bizarre copycat phenomenon (for example, I started a thread called The Tragic Results of Homophobia. A Christian then started a thread called The Tragic Results of Homosexuality. If you go to the straightpride.com, you will see where the site is a copy of gay pride sites.)

Apparently, there are only 4 Doctors in the world, but no one looks at Jesus. I don't think Jesus' message was: If you don't want to burn in hell, you better follow me!

When I see someone ranting about the cliff that I'm about to fall off, they assume that I am blind, but I say, "where? where is this cliff? I can see, and there is no cliff."

Then I am told that I will see it when I am dead. So, they claim to see a cliff, but cannot see it themselves. They simply believe that it is there.

I am Buddhist because I am encouraged to test the truths, and see that they are real. I am encouraged to practice loving kindness, and find that it draws people far more strongly than fear and threats.

What the man doesn't seem to preach is that he is why he is drawn to God and Jesus. It is simply fear, the anger and wrath of God. It isn't about the joy and love that God brings, but his happiness that God isn't going to beat the daylights out of him.

That's a bit like your spouse saying that they are so happy with you becasue they have escaped lonliness. Does that make you feel loved, or more like they are simply avoiding punishment?

It's a curious way to live.