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miknik5

"Let not your heart be troubled"
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No. You know that isn´t true...I already gave you my testimony. I believe because I am a witness to the truth...

The witnesses weren´t just the first hand EYE witnesses sir...they are all those who have heard and received the GOSPEL as it should be heard and received....

And that not from a man...but from GOD...
 
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miknik5

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Iḿ sorry but it is written, unless a grain of wheat die, it abides alone...
 
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miknik5

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And as well it is written, Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.
 
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miknik5

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HE will bring salvation to those who are WAITING and HOPING in HIM...there is a big difference between those who are waiting and hoping in HIM (For it is even written that those who HOPE in HIM purify themselves even as HE is pure) and those who aren´t.
 
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miknik5

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The whole point of Hebrews is that they did not understand their role in the temple.

Since CHRIST died for their sins...they no longer had to offer up sacrifices...CHRIST did that once and for all, and their work was not to continue the rituals which were only the shadow of all the realities found in CHRIST, but to understand that they had a MEDIATOR who entered in for them...and that this should bring the boldness to come before the throne of grace because HE entered in for us...as our forerunner, and we, through the VEIL, which is HIS BODY, can come to the throne because, Clizby, those who believe in HIM are washed and covered...and have the RIGHT GARMENT...

Those who came into the Holy of Holies, had to have on the right vestments...and they could not come up to the altar on ¨steps¨ sir...no man made constructs...lest they be found uncovered.

We always needed the RIGHT GARMENT...and through CHRIST< those who are washed, have the RIGHT GARMENT...

There is so much that you would have to read and pray on before you can come to the understanding that as I have said, the TESTIMONY of JESUS is hidden throughout HIS WORD....from OT to NT...
 
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miknik5

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Please read about the Wedding Garment and follow that up with the WHITE GARMENT of the saints and understand that in the Passover, when the ḧouses¨ were marked by the blood of the lamb, then those ¨houses¨ were passed over by the angel of death...they were protected.

And so are those who are washed by the BLOOD of THE LAMB....
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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Most certainly does .... ie "Big Bang" .... without the "Big Bang" theory how planets, including ours came to be .... had to be a planet for life to evolve on.
No. I agree that the earth needs to exist and life needs to exist for evolution to happen but the theory of evolution does not explain the origins of the universe or the origins of life.

yes ... christians vary in their beliefs .... just as scientists vary in their beliefs.

you can't lump all christians together .... nor can you lump all scientists together.
Very different. Scientists can back up what they believe to be true with evidence that I can evaluate, Christians cannot. Most Christians look to the bible as a basis for their beliefs and are all different. Some don't look to the bible as their standard. Scientists can do independent testing and come up with a consensus of what is most likely true. Christians cannot.

Is repeatable experimentation possible in regard to the universe? No it is not.
The big bang theory makes predictions and has repeatable results.

Evolution writings are believed to be true based on evidence the writings of god are believed to be true based on faith. Very big difference.

again ... the bible is not a science book ... God's concern's is with relationships.
Then why do Christians try to use it as such? I am fine with whatever you want to believe about the bible, but when you use it as a science book then I will evaluate the claims based on scientific principles. If the universe started by a creation act we should be able to detect that through science, so far we have not. However science has not ruled that out, just that we have no evidence for it.

If ... you believe the theory of evolution to be true ... have you personally read and studied every single scientific theory that has been put forth? Of course not ... nor could you.
This is ridiculous. I can believe the theory of evolution to be true based on the evidence provided. I spent 6 months studying the theory and I am convinced by the evidence that it happened. Because I have positive evidence that evolution is true I don't need to entertain every other unsupported hypothesis of life diversity.

I can prove that pi*r^2 = area of a circle with calculus. Because of this I don't need to look at every other proposed formula for the area of a circle to see if it is true.
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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Thanks for writing this. I know you believe this but before I respond to this I have one question.

Why should I believe your interpretation of what the bible says over another Christians interpretation?
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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No. You know that isn´t true...I already gave you my testimony. I believe because I am a witness to the truth...
Your right you did. I believe you had an experience. I am not convinced you had an experience with a god.

The witnesses weren´t just the first hand EYE witnesses sir...they are all those who have heard and received the GOSPEL as it should be heard and received....

And that not from a man...but from GOD...
Ok, can you support this with evidence?
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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Great, can you support this with evidence?
 
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hedrick

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Thanks for writing this. I know you believe this but before I respond to this I have one question.

Why should I believe your interpretation of what the bible says over another Christians interpretation?
Because it agrees with the text, when taking into account the OT references.
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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I am going to ask you the same question I asked hedrick.

Why should I believe your interpretation of what the bible says over another Christians interpretation?
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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I believed this as well. The problem is that you cannot demonstrate that it is true.
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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Because it agrees with the text, when taking into account the OT references.
Another Christian will say the same thing about their different interpretation of the same text. Why should I believe your interpretation over theirs?

Look at the christian only sections of this site. Every doctrine and text is disputed and argued about. How do I know who is correct? Why does god let the confusion continue.
 
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hedrick

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Because it agrees with the text, when taking into account the OT references.
You'll find that traditional interpretation tends to read into the text later ideas. E.g. all statements that Jesus died for us obviously mean that he was punished in our place. There are lots of examples like this. E.g. Paul says several times that our faith is imputed as righteousness. Traditional Protestant interpretation says this means that Christ's righteousness is imputed to us, even though it says no such thing. When you can't imagine that God could forgive us without punishment, that assumption tends to get read into statements about Christ dying for us. And when you think righteousness means moral perfection, rather than being acceptable to God, it's easy to misread references to imputed righteousness.

The problem is that when you try to see what the NT writers were actually saying, you fail to find a number of ideas that Christians consider essential to the faith. In this case it's only some Christians during some periods. In other cases it's more serious. Bt that's what critical scholarship is about. It's about trying to avoid reading our own beliefs into the text.
 
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hedrick

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At a certain point you have to look at the text yourself.
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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Why should I believe this is a correct interpretation? Why do you think God lets the confusion about interpretation continue?
 
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hedrick

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Surely you've been in these kinds of discussions enough to know that I don't think the Bible came directly from God. I think it's humans describing their experiences with him. As such it's not surprising that those experiences should be different, and the ways they are expressed.

I don't actually consider Hebrews to have the kind authority that Evangelicals would. It tells us how one group of early Christians understood Jesus. But it was controversial in the early Church because of its apparent statement that sins can only be forgiven once, and because it was doubtful that it was written by Paul. It was accepted the West in the 4th Cent, under the assumption that Paul wrote it. He surely did not.

Nevertheless, it is useful to understand how early Christians understood Jesus and his death, which is why I spent time looking at what it says.
 
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