Global warming and the end

[n2thelight]

@ Eclispenow

What caused the first Ice age?
What caused the little Ice age?
How did the earth warm back up?

 

[eclipsenow]

So when will you demand Muslims stop oil production? Or the Russians?

And what about the Chinese, who consume coal like its free?

I don't demand that they do: the laws of physics as defined by the Radiative Forcing Equation do. There are tough political realities to confront because of the climate crisis, most of all dealing with people who SEE SCIENCE THROUGH THEIR POLITICAL GRID.

What if I told you I might have certain political preferences as to how the climate crisis was solved, but ultimately didn't care as long as it WAS solved? What if I supported a free marketplace as long as it was powered by clean non-polluting energy? How would a right-wing government do that? Just ban coal within 10 or 15 years, and let the marketplace decide how to provide the power? If that's what it takes to get a groundswell in your country, I'd support it. If, however, utilities refused to prepare for something like that, I'd also support just plain NATIONALISING the power sector and getting state-of-the-art modularised GenIV nuclear reactors churning off the production line. I really don't care: as long as we're not cursing our children and grandchildren.

Are only freedom loving Americans on your hit list? Why only them?

1. I note you have not replied to the substantive scientific issues above,
2. like the FACT that Antarctica has BOTH cooling bits and massive ice-sheets that are warming and sliding into the oceans,
3. the FACT that fossil fuel dust kills 7 million people a year, and WHAT ARE YOU SAYING CHRISTIANS SHOULD DO ABOUT THIS!?,
4. the FACT that preparing for climate change would also make nations energy secure: meaning less vulnerable to oil crisis and oil shocks,
5. like the FACT that preparing for climate change would also clean up cities, reduce health bills, and help save those 7 million lives globally each year!

What is your real agenda?

As well as everything I've said above, I believe in a free energy market not subsidised by the government giving them various kick-backs, and not subsidised by 'externalising' the cost of their pollution into our health systems which ultimately DOUBLES the cost of coal to the consumer. You didn't know that, did you? It does. I can cite sources if you wish.

Unlike you, I'm sick of the government interfering in our energy marketplace! If you believe we currently live in a free energy market, you're sadly deluded. Governments spend $1.4 billion dollars on the fossil fuel energy system every day!

Data Highlights - 24: Governments Spend $1.4 Billion Per Day to Destabilize Climate | EPI


So, as said above, these issues still remain for you to deal with. Stop jumping around and trying to assign some sinister purpose to my writing.

• You obviously need to go back about 5 or 10 pages on this thread and learn how:-
  coal kills 7 million people EVERY YEAR,
• coal kills more people each week when it goes RIGHT than the WHOLE HISTORY of nuclear power going wrong,
• coal oil and gas get billions in government subsidies as an enemy of the free marketplace and practically communist choice of energy source,
• how coal and oil and gas cost nations so much more in their health bill that America as a whole would find it CHEAPER to switch to a mix of GenIV nukes and renewables
• oil is geopolitically linked to national security and weaning off oil fast is an act of patrotism every American should support
• how America has enough spent-nuclear-fuel to burn in GenIV Integral Fast Reactors to run America for 1000 years
• how new reactors WOULD NOT melt down even if a tidal wave knocked out their cooling systems, and how the fuel rods themselves can't melt down because of the laws of physics
• how this is win win win, and climate change is TRUE ANYWAY and only tinfoil hat wearing armchair conspiracy theorists are in enough denial that they can convince themselves they actually know something about this.

​

Then we would be energy secure, wealthy and our enemies would lack the cash to cause WWIII, but that is something you never considered. Right?

Wrong! Fossil fuel addiction like your pathetic oil-addicted transport system are PRECISELY the sort of things that sent us (Britain, Australia where I live, and America) into Iraq looking for fairy-tale WMD's. Why? To guarantee the flow of oil. The WMD's were being wiped out by the weapons inspection program, despite Saddam's recalcitrance. So $2 TRILLION dollars and countless lives were wasted in that war: enough money to replace your coal system and probably half your oil system!

WRONG! Because climate change is likely to destabilize your ability to grow your own food, and result in water-wars and who knows what geopolitical tensions!

WRONG! Because some weird unimagined combination of energy stress and oil geopolitics and climate stress could push the world into WW3, or at least a series of grinding Greater Depressions and Cold Wars where we are always on the brink of pushing the button or going to war.

WRONG! Because you don't get to do the Denialist dance and just change the topic every time I link to real science: you have certain previous anti-science memes to apologise for now that they have been shown to be wrong.

And unlike the Middle East or Russians, we would follow sound policies that diminish harmful effects on the environment so the net damage to the planet by having us supplant the ME and Russians, would be less.

Your 'clean coal' is a myth, and people in America are still dying from various fossil fuel particulates.

“Although it is difficult to assign a cost to these numbers, estimates have suggested a 10% increase in health care costs in countries where coal makes up a significant fraction of the energy mix, like the U.S. and Europe (NAS 2010; Cohen et al., 2005; Pope et al., 2002). These additional health costs begin to rival the total energy costs on an annual basis for the U.S. given that health care costs top $2.6 trillion, and electricity costs only exceed about $400 billion. Another way to describe this human health energy fee is that it costs about 2,000 lives per year to keep the lights on in Beijing but only about 200 lives to keep them on in New York.
Guess that’s just the cost of doing business…”

How Deadly Is Your Kilowatt? We Rank The Killer Energy Sources - Forbes

Yet you aren't advancing that position at all. You would have us stop producing energy, and becoming totally dependent upon Muslims and Russians, and increasing the net damage to the planet.

If you could stop telling me what I'm saying and actually READ what I'm saying, that would at least demonstrate primary school education levels.

Your country invented the solution to global warming decades ago, but unfortunately some nanny-state, ill-advised leftists got in the way. Here it is, built by Argonne Labs. This is the proof of concept: the successful prototype that could run the world for millions of years on today's technology, giving us time to look for fusion or perfect super-cheap-super-batteries that might finally fix the intermittency problem with renewables. (I love renewables, but have been convinced by various climate & energy experts like James Hansen himself — yes, the grandfather of today's climate science — that renewables on their own just won't work!)
Experimental Breeder Reactor II - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So what is your real agenda? Its certainly NOT to save the planet, or the health of Americans.

A critical thinker must consider the possibility you are an enemy of the planet, and of America. Perhaps you hate the freedom inherent in the free market?

You're a naive little right-wing crusader with no information to back your weird little tin-foil hat world, aren't you? See above. I ask you, WHAT FREE ENERGY MARKET? Dude, I'm centralist. Did you know that until last week, Australia had free universal health care? Did you know that? I think it's a more compassionate, even more Christian policy, I really do. Did you know Australia spends about one quarter of America on health, yet we live longer? But why am I talking about health in a climate debate?

Basically because you think I'm a socialist, and want a completely socialised marketplace. I don't. I love Australia just the way it is (well, was until Tony Abbott started to make our country more like yours). Surely being so 'socialist' on education and health, we must have a bigger government and higher tax rate? Sorry. False. Judged on a Unit of GDP / tax, America only has 1% less tax than Australians! That is a rounding error!

So there are areas where I LOVE the free market, but I think health and education are best made free and fair for all, with private optional-extra versions for the wealthy if they wish. If we can't stop the lobbying corruption of the dirtiest industries on our planet killing 7 million people a year, removing mountain tops, chopping down forest, making America vulnerable to oil shocks and eventual peak oil, and having SO MUCH POWER THEY COMMAND HUGE SUBSIDIES FROM GOVERNMENT (completely undermining your charge that I am the Communist here! ); then I say you need to go back to the drawing board and do some basic reading on this subject, because you obviously know nothing about it except embarrassing, inaccurate, Republican sound-byte cliches!

 

[Ronald]

I don't think you understand the situation at all. Please go back and read my exchanges with Biblewriter.

I don't think there is any hope for me, I'm a right wing, Rush, Michael Medved, Fox news adherant nut. Nothing you can say will save me from my views.
Alfred had an excellent argument, I can't say it any better. We are just blind I guess. But hey, thanks for all the following intelligent info:

When denialists quote stuff like this and s[bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] as if climatologists don't know about it, it just confirms the Denialist's complete and utter ignorance of the science they are pretending to critique. It's just embarrassing for them, and there appear to be far, far more Denialists in Australia and America than in any other country on earth. It's sad. I don't know what's happened to our [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] cultures, but 'individual choice' seems to have lead people to believe in 'individual reality'. You just choose not to believe in climate change because you vote Republican? Pathetic.

Oh well, they edited out the core of your thoughts and disposition ... shucks!

 

[Alfred Persson]

nt

 

[eclipsenow]

I don't think there is any hope for me, I'm a right wing, Rush, Michael Medved, Fox news adherant nut. Nothing you can say will save me from my views.
Alfred had an excellent argument, I can't say it any better. We are just blind I guess. But hey, thanks for all the following intelligent info:



Oh well, they edited out the core of your thoughts and disposition ... shucks!

Hi Ronald,
I can't remember the word I was trying to use and apologise if it appears I was trying to swear. I think it was a word begining with s, ending in d, and referring to people who are not too bright: but not a swear word.

 

[eclipsenow]

So when Christ appears in a few years, and asks "with what did you occupy yourself with."

You will reply, "I preached against global warming that would turn the planet into a fire ball in the year 2525, and convinced many in 2014 to install personal methane reclamation units so we don't go the way of the Dinosaurs."

And He replies: "But all the prophecy had me returning well before 2525, and don't you think I might have something to say about the planet becoming a fire ball?"

Where in the Bible did I command preaching against global warming so that people assume I would not appear like a thief in the night, in their lifetime?"

Thanks for answering all the scientific and moral issues I raised, just as I expected you would!

Dude, climatologists don't talk about the planet becoming a fireball. Grow up.

Dude, there's every reason to care for God's creation while we also get on with the gospel mission, which also involves loving our neighbours as ourselves in how we live, whether we crush Africa's agriculture by our emissions, etc etc. I don't see why we can't do both. I could ask here what they are doing in their actual Christian living because they seem to be so busy debating their various futurist prophecies and getting all uptight about when the 'beast' is going to do 'what' in their pre-trib mid-trib post-trib pre-mil post-mil debates that they can hardly seem to have any time left for actually loving people, holding down a job, or being faithful in a dozen other ways! God's given us big brains: we can do both the gospel work given to us and fight poverty and slavery and drugs in our area and preach and encourage each other. It's not one or the other. At least don't be in denial of the basic science (which I note again that you've completely avoided discussing!)

Dude, thanks for showing how you're pro-free market and how much you want to remove nearly half a TRILLION dollars in subsidies to fossil fuel companies per year worldwide. Great comeback on that one! What's your REAL agenda here mate? Are you sure YOU'RE not the Communist?

 

[Alfred Persson]

nt

 

[eclipsenow]

The antichrist will come from the Democrat Party, that is already clear. The Democrats support Christians paying for free abortions, every law against speaking the gospel in public, and are trying to make it illegal to raise your kids as Christians.

If you speak against homosexuality, they will hound your employer till he fires you, or cause others to stop doing business with you till you are bankrupt. That's called persecution, and its the Democrats who are doing it. The same party of global warming.

In fact, consider the NAZI platform Hitler was elected on, its very similar to the Democrat party of free stuff, free health care, free abortions, anti Christ.

So you consistently vote for the budding Antichrist party, which will reveal itself soon, as it legislates even more against Christians.

How will you explain that to Christ on Judgment Day?

"Lord, the Teapublican extremists wanted everyone to be free to follow their own conscience, to choose for themselves whether they would cause global warming, or not!

He wanted everyone free to follow their own conscience, but the Antichrist promised to force everyone save the planet, so that in the year 3510 the planet would be 4 degrees cooler! So I had to vote for him, to save the planet from the extremists, to keep it from bursting in flames!

If I didn't accept his mark, my carbon footprint would have doubled!

I'm an Amil, and laugh at futurist's timetables and prescriptions for the future. The Lord fulfilled all OT prophecies in his gospel acts. Every OT promise finds their 'yes' in Jesus. But of course he will return: I'm not a Full Preterist which is a heresy. But I am Amil. He could return in 5 seconds or 50,000 years, we don't know.

In the meantime, our duty is to live both as if he's returning tonight, but also as if we're going to be here for millions of years. Calvin talked about the duty of a farmer to leave his fields better than he found them for the next generation. Stewardship is important! It's about compassion for our fellow man, which demonstrates that we mean what we say as Christians. 'Love' is not just an abstract thing, but has real, practical consequences. I want climate change to be one of those boring historical things we SOLVED, like lead poisoning or smallpox. It's a social concern.

But what concerns me is that we can't solve it while there are tinfoil hat conspiracy theorists not willing to admit it's a real problem, or understand the real science, or get aquainted with the real threats.

Let alone all the other concerns with it that we can see today, like 7 million deaths worldwide per year, and the government subsidies and health costs fossil fuel bring.

But if your twisted futurist reading of the highly symbolic sermon in Revelation does turn out to be true, can the Lord blame me for voting for something that he has preordained to happen anyway, and according to my best knowledge and Christian compassion for the poor and in alignment with the way many theologians I read, that I voted for because I thought it was the best solution my conscience could allow?

BTW Democrat = more abortions = false myth you've adopted there mate. What happened under Republican governments? Got statistics for that? It sounds like another typical cliche or soundbyte you've unthinkingly splurted out.

 

[Gnarwhal]

I agree with eclipsenow, the God-given mandate to be good stewards of the earth was never lifted, and here in the 21st century humanity is failing miserably at that - Christians just as much as anybody else.

Christ's resurrection isn't just for people, it's restoring the entire cosmos. The least we can do is participate and nurture it to the best of our ability instead of flippantly tossing it aside as if it's a disposable toothbrush. That's a disgraceful treatment of God's creation.

 

[eclipsenow]

I agree with eclipsenow, the God-given mandate to be good stewards of the earth was never lifted, and here in the 21st century humanity is failing miserably at that - Christians just as much as anybody else.

Christ's resurrection isn't just for people, it's restoring the entire cosmos. The least we can do is participate and nurture it to the best of our ability instead of flippantly tossing it aside as if it's a disposable toothbrush. That's a disgraceful treatment of God's creation.

What a breath of fresh air!

Exactly! Jesus death didn't just judge our sin, but in a sense just as his body represents our humanity, it also represents this very creation. His resurrection is not just that of humanity, but the seed of the promise of the new creation that will be revealled when heavenly realities collide into this reality, regenerating the very laws of physics in this universe in ways science cannot at all predict.

But none of this excludes our Christian responsibility to act responsibly and in good conscience based on the (limited) understanding we have so far of the world we live in. At this stage, climate change appears to be one of our greatest challenges. We can only act on the basis of the best information we have to hand: both biblical, and scientific. We must respect the word of scripture and God's general word revealled in His works.

 

[Gnarwhal]

What a breath of fresh air!

Exactly! Jesus death didn't just judge our sin, but in a sense just as his body represents our humanity, it also represents this very creation. His resurrection is not just that of humanity, but the seed of the promise of the new creation that will be revealled when heavenly realities collide into this reality, regenerating the very laws of physics in this universe in ways science cannot at all predict.

But none of this excludes our Christian responsibility to act responsibly and in good conscience based on the (limited) understanding we have so far of the world we live in. At this stage, climate change appears to be one of our greatest challenges. We can only act on the basis of the best information we have to hand: both biblical, and scientific. We must respect the word of scripture and God's general word revealled in His works.

I think the irresponsibility of Christians, at least in the latter half of the twentieth century, comes from the adoption of the Stoic heresy of Universal Conflagration. If you falsely believe that the Earth is going to literally be burned to a crisp like God threw it into the cosmic incinerator then why would you bother making sure that paper cup in your cup holder makes it into the next recycle bin rather than the highway shoulder?

 

[eclipsenow]

I think the irresponsibility of Christians, at least in the latter half of the twentieth century, comes from the adoption of the Stoic heresy of Universal Conflagration. If you falsely believe that the Earth is going to literally be burned to a crisp like God threw it into the cosmic incinerator then why would you bother making sure that paper cup in your cup holder makes it into the next recycle bin rather than the highway shoulder?

Yes, that and the Gnostic idea of the superiority of the 'soul' over this dirty material world, when Jesus embraced this dirty world and back in the beginning God even said it was good! The division of 'soul' and 'body' is a Greek idea, not a biblical one.

 

[Alfred Persson]

nt

 

[Gnarwhal]

I thought so, "symbolic" is euphemism for "fable." You don't believe the scripture at all, hence Gospel truth really doesn't concern you.

Clearly you expect God, if He isn't symbolic, will consider your concern for the planet meriting salvation.

You even suppose Christ will commend your vote for the Antichrist as vote of conscience!

You revealed yourself, I have nothing to say to you that might possibly convince you to repent before its too late.

I perceive your conscience is seared in the bad way.

I bet you would turn in your parents, if you thought it good for the planet. And the absurdity of the premise, would never occur to you.

Just as the impossibility of Co2 being a pollutant, when God Himself created animals and man in symbiosis with plants, to exhale it.

31 Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good. So the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

(Gen 1:31-1 NKJ)

Don't be absurd.

First of all, address the post, not the poster.

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Secondly, "symbolic" is a far cry from "fable". They are in no way even close, saying something from scripture is symbolic, which there are parts of scripture that are undeniably scripture including most of Revelation, parts of Daniel and Matthew 24 for example, does not mean that anybody is taking the Scriptures as fiction.

The gaps in your logic needs to addressed.

 

[eclipsenow]

I thought so, "symbolic" is euphemism for "fable." You don't believe the scripture at all, hence Gospel truth really doesn't concern you.

I thought so: you can't read. Recognising symbolic literature to properly understand what the truth of scripture is actually saying doesn't matter to you: you've already cut your hands off, poked your eyes out, and sold everything for the poor. The trees of the field WERE clapping their hands, there really WAS a house built on the sand, and the kingdom of heaven is a mustard seed. No it is, it really is.

You also belong to the church of the 7 horned, 7 eyed space-lamb, but that's your choice. Always and forever literal: no matter when it isn't! Recognising the bible's many poetic forms, symbolic forms, and metaphorical forms, let alone it's historical forms and others, means nothing to you. Literal is best, hey? Go the 7 horned, 7 eyed space-lamb!

Clearly you expect God, if He isn't symbolic, will consider your concern for the planet meriting salvation.

You even suppose Christ will commend your vote for the Antichrist as vote of conscience!

There isn't one Antichrist: as an Amil, I reckon you could easily be living next door to one! See John for his definition of an Antichrist.

1 John 2
Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour.

'The antichrist' is a symbol of everything we're to fight against; a symbol of the heartbeat of hell.

You revealed yourself, I have nothing to say to you that might possibly convince you to repent before its too late.

I'm sorry, but I'm saved by grace, not whether I jump on board your tinfoil hat brigade and vote Republican! Seriously: are you trying to create a cult? Are you REALLY saying voting Republican saves? I'm geniunely concerned: because all my quips about the tinfoil hat were in jest before. But if you really believe this, I'm worried that you don't understand the gospel itself?

I perceive your conscience is seared in the bad way.

Because living in denial of science is the good way? Being sarcastic and nasty about the death of 7 million people a year is a good thing, let alone accusing me of being a communist when it is your precious fossil fuels that get half a Trillion dollars a year subsidy from governments? MY conscience is seared in the 'bad way'? Wow, what's yours when you cannot admit the basic facts above to yourself? Forget me: you're lying to yourself man!

I bet you would turn in your parents, if you thought it good for the planet. And the absurdity of the premise, would never occur to you.

You're lovely, aren't you? Just because I showed your anti-science, anti-communist presuppositions above to be so foolish!

Just as the impossibility of Co2 being a pollutant, when God Himself created animals and man in symbiosis with plants, to exhale it.

Water isn't a pollutant either: you need it for life itself, and we excrete it. But if I drop you in the ocean you'll drown, and floods kill and hurt crops and cause amazing economic ruin, and guess what? You can even die from water poisoning if you drink too much!

31 Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good. So the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

And then we sinned, and introduced weeds, messed up our world, and now we kill each other, experience droughts and disasters, and generally mess up our world.

 

[John S]

The antichrist will come from the Democrat Party, that is already clear. The Democrats support Christians paying for free abortions, every law against speaking the gospel in public, and are trying to make it illegal to raise your kids as Christians.

If you speak against homosexuality, they will hound your employer till he fires you, or cause others to stop doing business with you till you are bankrupt. That's called persecution, and its the Democrats who are doing it. The same party of global warming.

So you consistently vote for the emergent Antichrist party, which will reveal itself soon, as it legislates even more against Christians.

How will you explain that to Christ on Judgment Day?

"Lord, the Teapublican extremists wanted everyone to be free to follow their own conscience, to choose for themselves whether they would cause global warming, or not!

But the Antichrist promised to force everyone save the planet, so that in the year 3510 the planet would be 4 degrees cooler! So I had to vote for him, to save the planet from the extremists, to keep it from bursting in flames!

If I didn't accept his mark, my carbon footprint would have doubled! Only Fox News, mentioned the advisability of taking a different course of action, some even citing the Bible. Who reads that anymore! And you know how distorted their news is!

Ignorant, bigoted, garbage. If you truly are a Christian, you should be ashamed of yourself.

 

[eclipsenow]

Thanks guys. I think this particular individual is a little ... unwell.

"Just as the impossibility of Co2 being a pollutant, when God Himself created animals and man in symbiosis with plants, to exhale it."
Ha! If it's not a pollutant, try breathing only CO2! Like so many things, it depends. It's about balance. Drink too much water and what happens? But water could NEVER hurt me, it's natural. God made it!
Water intoxication - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Alfred Persson]

I thought so: you can't read. Recognising symbolic literature to properly understand what the truth of scripture is actually saying doesn't matter to you: you've already cut your hands off, poked your eyes out, and sold everything for the poor. The trees of the field WERE clapping their hands, there really WAS a house built on the sand, and the kingdom of heaven is a mustard seed. No it is, it really is.

You also belong to the church of the 7 horned, 7 eyed space-lamb, but that's your choice. Always and forever literal: no matter when it isn't! Recognising the bible's many poetic forms, symbolic forms, and metaphorical forms, let alone it's historical forms and others, means nothing to you. Literal is best, hey? Go the 7 horned, 7 eyed space-lamb!


There isn't one Antichrist: as an Amil, I reckon you could easily be living next door to one! See John for his definition of an Antichrist.

1 John 2
Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour.

'The antichrist' is a symbol of everything we're to fight against; a symbol of the heartbeat of hell.



I'm sorry, but I'm saved by grace, not whether I jump on board your tinfoil hat brigade and vote Republican! Seriously: are you trying to create a cult? Are you REALLY saying voting Republican saves? I'm geniunely concerned: because all my quips about the tinfoil hat were in jest before. But if you really believe this, I'm worried that you don't understand the gospel itself?


Because living in denial of science is the good way? Being sarcastic and nasty about the death of 7 million people a year is a good thing, let alone accusing me of being a communist when it is your precious fossil fuels that get half a Trillion dollars a year subsidy from governments? MY conscience is seared in the 'bad way'? Wow, what's yours when you cannot admit the basic facts above to yourself? Forget me: you're lying to yourself man!


You're lovely, aren't you? Just because I showed your anti-science, anti-communist presuppositions above to be so foolish!


Water isn't a pollutant either: you need it for life itself, and we excrete it. But if I drop you in the ocean you'll drown, and floods kill and hurt crops and cause amazing economic ruin, and guess what? You can even die from water poisoning if you drink too much!



And then we sinned, and introduced weeds, messed up our world, and now we kill each other, experience droughts and disasters, and generally mess up our world.

I apologize for my posts, they were not up to Christian standards at all. Especially my comment about a seared conscience, how could I possible know that from a few words posted here?

Christ's kingdom is not of this world, and clearly I have allowed myself to drift into politics, rather than take up Christ's cross and follow Him.

The defect is mine. And the fault is mine. While I won't accept the premise of global warming, I failed to give your arguments for it the attention they deserve. I apologize for that also.

Enjoy the debate, it will be without me, as I have other things to do in Christ. The first of which was, to apologize to you for my rudeness.

May God grant peace to your house. In Jesus' name, amen.

 

[eclipsenow]

I apologize for my posts, they were not up to Christian standards at all. Especially my comment about a seared conscience, how could I possible know that from a few words posted here?

Christ's kingdom is not of this world, and clearly I have allowed myself to drift into politics, rather than take up Christ's cross and follow Him.

The defect is mine. And the fault is mine. While I won't accept the premise of global warming, I failed to give your arguments for it the attention they deserve. I apologize for that also.

Enjoy the debate, it will be without me, as I have other things to do in Christ. The first of which was, to apologize to you for my rudeness.

May God grant peace to your house. In Jesus' name, amen.

Thanks. If you ever want to debate a Christian view of climate change in these Last Days (2000 years and counting), you'd be welcome back here. I'll try and be less caustic next time as well. It's easy to lose your cool in an online debate: especially late at night. Trust me, I know. Go well.

 

[eclipsenow]

Meanwhile, back in reality...

****
Three new studies have all concluded that the West Antarctic Ice Sheet has begun to collapse. This collapse will impact humanity for generations to come, and the indications are that it is too late to stop it. Satellite measurements compiled by UK researchers have shown that Antarctica is losing 160 billion tonnes of ice per year, mainly through thinning of West Antarctica’s ice sheets.

...researchers at the University of Washington found that one of these, the Thwaites Glacier, is set to collapse over the coming centuries, potentially triggering 3 metres of sea level rise.
The potential collapse of West Antarctica’s ice sheets is not just a problem for Antarctica. It will dramatically change coastlines all over the world....

....The best we can now hope for is that this collapse will be slow and stately, and take centuries to unfold....

However, we have evidence from prehistoric warm periods that this could occur over decades. At this point we don’t know long it will take, but we do know that the climate forcing today is much stronger than at any time in over 50 million years.

https://theconversation.com/we-can-now-only-watch-as-west-antarcticas-ice-sheets-collapse-26957

This NYT article has a great animation that at the end shows the ice levels dropping in shaded red.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/13/s...e-sheet-has-begun-scientists-say.html?hp&_r=1