Giving

[visionary]

Voluntary Giving

The LORD said to Moses, "Speak to the people of Israel, that they take for me a contribution. From every man whose heart moves him you shall receive the contribution for me." (Shemot / Exodus 25:1,2; ESV)

Through Moses God initiated a national building project. By voluntary contributions materials were to be collected for the building of the mishkan (English: tabernacle). The mishkan was a large tent-like structure where the sacrifices were performed. It was to be the focal point for the entire nation and the place where, in some sense, God's presence was to reside.

Giving to this project was absolutely voluntary. This is in contrast to the great many obligations God laid upon the Israelites. We are not told why contributing to the mishkan was not compulsory, it just wasn't. What we do know is that this project was so successful, Moses had to tell the people to stop giving (See Shemot / Exodus 36:6).

It is a wonderful thing when God initiates something and his people respond so positively. I don't know what would have happened if the people would not have contributed as they did. Would Moses have given additional appeals? Would God, who originally called for voluntary contributions, oblige the people after all?

I tend to think that since God had determined that this project was to be funded voluntarily that he knew the risk and would not change course. Now, being God he knew how the people would respond, but that brings up the issue of God's foreknowledge, which I don't want to discuss at the moment.
What I do want to discuss is our need to know the difference between obligatory and voluntary giving. These two kinds of giving exist throughout the entire Bible. There are some things to which God obliges us and other things to which he invites us to be involved without obligation.

Caring for our families is obligatory (Matthew 15:1-6; 1 Timothy 5:8). Providing for our leaders both governmental and congregational is part of our God-given duty (Romans 13;6,7; 1 Timothy 5:17). But not all giving is obligatory. While the Bible encourages us to be generous toward those in need, it is wrong to oblige people or attempt to manipulate them in order to extract funds from them (1 Corinthians 9:7). If God's own building project was funded by voluntary contributions, how much more should our projects be?

I wish more congregations would be upfront with their real needs, especially when it comes to the welfare of those who legitimately serve its members. Active congregational members should be adequately informed about the needs of those who serve them and encouraged to do their duty as members to help meet their needs. But when congregational leadership have visions (perhaps from God) to attempt major projects, whether it be for buildings or other things, we would do well to follow God's example: lay out the vision before the people and let those give whose hearts move them in this way. If God hasn't obligated the people to give, who are we to so burden them? God loves a cheerful giver. Those who don't want to give should not give.

Don't get me wrong. As I have already mentioned, in situations when we are truly obliged to give, we must give. I also understand that people need to be taught the value of generosity. But that is not the same as extracting funds from unwilling hearts.

If you are on the receiving end of endless appeals for funds, I suggest you seek to discern if it is really God who is calling you to give. If it is, then you would do well to be generous. Otherwise don't be pressured.

 

[Bananna]

very good

 

[debi b]

I find it ironic that ones who say "the Law" is done away with, bring forward one concept out of context from "the Law" and manipulate people with it. You know what I am talking about - the tithe

 

[Tishri1]

great post vis

Pray for me when you think of me as I would love to give more but I need to make a living first.....I havent needed to so much in the past but the economy being what it is I need to now...The Good News is I also get to give more

 

[Wainbow]

Visionary, I think I may be your biggest fan for what you say. But I think what God presents us are often more like ropes than balls. While a ball might define a single point in space, a rope defines a continuum between two points in space. What I am trying to say is what Soloman said, but in different terms. There is a time and a purpose for everything under heaven. Another continuum that you can draw between two points in the bible is the start contrast of the edit that we must not kill in the ten commandments and the fact that God counted it to Phinehas forever as Righteous for killing a Jew and a girl from a wrong clan. As Christians nowadays we become fixated on never killing anyone for any reasong to bring about God's desires in our society -- though it is common place for young people who would not harm a fly to join the military to kill and destroy anyone and everyone -- for any reason -- just because they are paid well enough as mercinaries to fight any kind of war without ever understanding any of the issues involved. Please see this from God's perspective and not just assume as very many do that it must be God's will if the Military says its right -- until we hear again and again all the whoppers they have been telling us all along. The point is that we are always willing to do the bidding of crazy people who would throw us into Iraq when it only benefits the affluent whose stocks go up and whose children always find better jobs than being mercenaries over there.

But I have greatly digressed in case you didn't notice. Let me give you another example of the rope idea in the bible: One scripture says that "in the multitude of counselors there is safety". Yet there is also a large passage in the bible about how Macaiah saw God commission a Spirit to go forth and tell 400 prophets of God that they should tell the kings of Israel and Judah that they should go to battle and they would be victorioius. Actually, it was a lying Spirit that God had sent forth to lie to his prophets. And they obviously were His prophets because they clamed to be and they heard and responded to the words they heard faithfully.
So on one end of the rope we have the scripture that says in no uncertain terms that there is safety in the multitude of counselors, and yet here is a scripture where there was really death and destruction in the multitude of counselors.

Lastly, this same case points out another rope as well: One scripture says that God cannot lie. Simple minded people take that to mean that he lacks this ability that all of the rest of us are only too adept at. The fact is that if God were to say that a green tree is purple it would not be a lie because most likely the tree would no longer be green but purple. But even if God were so incapable as not being able to lie. We see from the scriptures that I just referenced that he could still send forth a lying spirit -- even to the very prophets of God and all of them would believe what God wanted them to hear from the lying spirit -- except perhaps for an exceeding few who like Micaiah had come to know God so well that they were not fooled even when God chose to fool all prophets. Like Noah, they knew to stand when all others had become so self-righteous rather than God-righteous that God chose to clean the world of them.

Then He gave a rainbow and said that He would never again destroy all of the earth by water. But this was a double edged promise. It would have been far better to hear that He would never destroy at all. The way God said it it is clear that God intends to destroy all the earth again -- and likely by fire. The bible says that two/thirds of the trees will be burned up. Moreover, God said that he wishes that we either be hot (and follow the messiah) or cold (and follow satan) but not lukeware. If we are lukewarm it says that he will vomit us out of his mouth but not to any destination. This implies to become non-existant. Because even in hell there is the great possibility that God's omnipotent love, compassiion, and forgiveness will entually over come God's omnipotent rage and fury and allow Satan himself to do a Nineveh.

Moreover, hell exists outside of time. So what does it mean then to spend an eternity where time does not exist? Could it be that this hell thing is really a lot of smoke and mirrors to scare us half to death so that "the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom"? Is it possible the hell we fear may not be real? For example, most people believe that Satan goes around opposing God. But the bible never says that Satan opposes God at all. In fact, in all situations in the bible he is always very careful to do exactly what God the Father says -- unlike us. And so many of us are lukewarm that according to the bible it would please God more if we were Satanic.

I think this is because the basic game plan of God is to pit the consumate protagonist, the Messiah, against the consumate antagonist, Satan. And in the end what really matters most is not whether you end up on Messiah's side or Satan's side, but that you do not simply choose to remain indifferent, unconcerned, or just fat dump and complacent just milling around in the middle -- being all rapped up in your game or games but not God's.

Let me clarify. Ending up on the Messiah's side would obvioiusly be better than ending up on Satan's side. But even those who end up on Satan's side do so because they excercise faith -- negative faith in this case -- but still they excercise faith in one of it's forms -- and all faith ultimately comes from God -- even negative faith. Let's face it God is the creator of all that exists. There is no reason to believe that Satan can or did create anything ever. So if negative faith does exist -- like the faith to believe that you will over come the odds designed to be against you as you gamble -- then the negative faith comes from God. Because let's be honest if God ever really wanted to simply Get rid of Satan he could simply have clicked his fingers long ago. The point is that when God made Satan, with his foreknowledge he knew exactly what Satan was going to do ahead of time and when. But He went ahead and made him anyway -- which is another way of saying that he made satan to assume his role and act as he has. Simply said, God made satan knowing that he would eventually drag away all those that are indifferent also (my supposition).

In other words, not everything in the bible should have nearly the same significance that we choose to place on it. The same was true when the Messiah came the first time. People had become so consumed with their pet interpretations of how He should come that they missed His coming altogether. Now the same could not be more true. How many of us can really say that they are more dedicated to following what their bibles say rather than what their pastors say or the people in your church preach -- which might sound wonderful but are really nothing more than what men like to tell each other -- but which are nothing more than men's traditions.

 

[Wainbow]

Visionary, I think I may be your biggest fan for what you say. But I think what God presents us are often more like ropes than balls. While a ball might define a single point in space, a rope defines a continuum between two points in space. What I am trying to say is what Soloman said, but in different terms. There is a time and a purpose for everything under heaven. Another continuum that you can draw between two points in the bible is the start contrast of the edit that we must not kill in the ten commandments and the fact that God counted it to Phinehas forever as Righteous for killing a Jew and a girl from a wrong clan. As Christians nowadays we become fixated on never killing anyone for any reasong to bring about God's desires in our society -- though it is common place for young people who would not harm a fly to join the military to kill and destroy anyone and everyone -- for any reason -- just because they are paid well enough as mercinaries to fight any kind of war without ever understanding any of the issues involved. Please see this from God's perspective and not just assume as very many do that it must be God's will if the Military says its right -- until we hear again and again all the whoppers they have been telling us all along. The point is that we are always willing to do the bidding of crazy people who would throw us into Iraq when it only benefits the affluent whose stocks go up and whose children always find better jobs than being mercenaries over there.

But I have greatly digressed in case you didn't notice. Let me give you another example of the rope idea in the bible: One scripture says that "in the multitude of counselors there is safety". Yet there is also a large passage in the bible about how Macaiah saw God commission a Spirit to go forth and tell 400 prophets of God that they should tell the kings of Israel and Judah that they should go to battle and they would be victorioius. Actually, it was a lying Spirit that God had sent forth to lie to his prophets. And they obviously were His prophets because they clamed to be and they heard and responded to the words they heard faithfully.
So on one end of the rope we have the scripture that says in no uncertain terms that there is safety in the multitude of counselors, and yet here is a scripture where there was really death and destruction in the multitude of counselors.

Lastly, this same case points out another rope as well: One scripture says that God cannot lie. Simple minded people take that to mean that he lacks this ability that all of the rest of us are only too adept at. The fact is that if God were to say that a green tree is purple it would not be a lie because most likely the tree would no longer be green but purple. But even if God were so incapable as not being able to lie. We see from the scriptures that I just referenced that he could still send forth a lying spirit -- even to the very prophets of God and all of them would believe what God wanted them to hear from the lying spirit -- except perhaps for an exceeding few who like Micaiah had come to know God so well that they were not fooled even when God chose to fool all prophets. Like Noah, they knew to stand when all others had become so self-righteous rather than God-righteous that God chose to clean the world of them.

Then He gave a rainbow and said that He would never again destroy all of the earth by water. But this was a double edged promise. It would have been far better to hear that He would never destroy at all. The way God said it it is clear that God intends to destroy all the earth again -- and likely by fire. The bible says that two/thirds of the trees will be burned up. Moreover, God said that he wishes that we either be hot (and follow the messiah) or cold (and follow satan) but not lukeware. If we are lukewarm it says that he will vomit us out of his mouth but not to any destination. This implies to become non-existant. Because even in hell there is the great possibility that God's omnipotent love, compassiion, and forgiveness will entually over come God's omnipotent rage and fury and allow Satan himself to do a Nineveh.

Moreover, hell exists outside of time. So what does it mean then to spend an eternity where time does not exist? Could it be that this hell thing is really a lot of smoke and mirrors to scare us half to death so that "the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom"? Is it possible the hell we fear may not be real? For example, most people believe that Satan goes around opposing God. But the bible never says that Satan opposes God at all. In fact, in all situations in the bible he is always very careful to do exactly what God the Father says -- unlike us. And so many of us are lukewarm that according to the bible it would please God more if we were Satanic.

I think this is because the basic game plan of God is to pit the consumate protagonist, the Messiah, against the consumate antagonist, Satan. And in the end what really matters most is not whether you end up on Messiah's side or Satan's side, but that you do not simply choose to remain indifferent, unconcerned, or just fat dump and complacent just milling around in the middle -- being all rapped up in your game or games but not God's.

Let me clarify. Ending up on the Messiah's side would obvioiusly be better than ending up on Satan's side. But even those who end up on Satan's side do so because they excercise faith -- negative faith in this case -- but still they excercise faith in one of it's forms -- and all faith ultimately comes from God -- even negative faith. Let's face it God is the creator of all that exists. There is no reason to believe that Satan can or did create anything ever. So if negative faith does exist -- like the faith to believe that you will over come the odds designed to be against you as you gamble -- then the negative faith comes from God. Because let's be honest if God ever really wanted to simply Get rid of Satan he could simply have clicked his fingers long ago. The point is that when God made Satan, with his foreknowledge he knew exactly what Satan was going to do ahead of time and when. But He went ahead and made him anyway -- which is another way of saying that he made satan to assume his role and act as he has. Simply said, God made satan knowing that he would eventually drag away all those that are indifferent also (my supposition).

In other words, not everything in the bible should have nearly the same significance that we choose to place on it. The same was true when the Messiah came the first time. People had become so consumed with their pet interpretations of how He should come that they missed His coming altogether. Now the same could not be more true. How many of us can really say that they are more dedicated to following what their bibles say rather than what their pastors say or the people in your church preach -- which might sound wonderful but are really nothing more than what men like to tell each other -- but which are nothing more than men's traditions.

 

[visionary]

And with the heart for God, people are moved to give in obedience to that calling.