Giants Magog and the Great Wall of China

[Lulav]

I never heard of this before but found it intriguing, anyone else?

Gog and Magog behind Alexander's Great Wall (of China)

Parashah Noach lists the grandsons of Noach

This is the account of Shem, Ham and Japheth, Noah’s sons, who themselves had sons after the flood.

It is interesting that the list above, Shem, Ham, Japheth are not the order that follows, Japheth son's come first, then Ham, then Shem, but for this we are concentrating on Japheth.

The sons of Japheth: Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshek and Tiras.

In Ezekiel 38:2 we read “Son of man, set your face against Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshek and Tubal; prophesy against him ........................

So from this we see that Gog is the leader, the 'chief prince' of Magog, the land named after the son of Japheth.

In

• Revelation 20:8
  8 and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—and to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore.

Here we see that now there are nations called Gog and Magog that are as numerous as the Children of Abraham

• Genesis 22:17
  17 I will surely bless you and make your descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and as the sand on the seashore. Your descendants will take possession of the cities of their enemies,
  

Now is there some amalgamation between any of Abraham's descendants and Magog's?

 

[Hoshiyya]

In Arabic, the wall is referred to as Hayt al Majooj, due to Magog (and the Arabic equivalent Majooj) being used to refer to Mongolia. This is similar to how Ashkenaz is taken as a name for Germany and Tzarfat as a name for France, even though we don't really know what these words originally referred to. The wall of China was built over many generations to protect China from Mongol invasions.

Whether Magog/Majooj corresponds to Mongolia is impossible to verify.

"Now is there some amalgamation between any of Abraham's descendants and Magog's?"

Since the Bible doesn't specify that, it is impossible to answer. But it is interesting (relative to that prophecy) that China has the largest population of any nation.

Gog is established as the name of a person in Ezekiel, and is nowhere used as the name of a nation. Gog-u-Magog is a gematria totalling 70, and just means the 70 nations. It is like saying Pharaoh-and-Egypt, it just means "the world."

 

[Armoured]

Alexander's great wall?

 

[Hoshiyya]

Alexander's great wall?

According to medieval folklore, Alexander built that wall.
According to the Chinese, they built the wall.

The wall of China has absolutely no Hellenic features to its architecture.

 

[Hoshiyya]

The earliest accounts of Alexander building a "great wall of iron" place this wall in the Caucasus, not in China. This was built as a defense against "Scythians", not Mongols.

 

[Armoured]

According to medieval folklore, Alexander built that wall.
According to the Chinese, they built the wall.

The wall of China has absolutely no Hellenic features to its architecture.

Which mediaeval folklore? During the Middle Ages, I can't off hand think of a single culture that knew about both Alexander and the Great Wall to be able to have such a belief.

 

[Hoshiyya]

Which mediaeval folklore? During the Middle Ages, I can't off hand think of a single culture that knew about both Alexander and the Great Wall to be able to have such a belief.

The tradition that Alexander built a wall dates back to before Christ. The specific identification of this wall as the Chinese wall apparently began in Islamic culture and entered Christian cultures.

China and the story of Alexander were of course known in Europe. Both subjects were of course viewed through the mythological / folkloric lens, however.

The Roman empire actually had embassies in China in the 3rd and 4th centuries, and Jesuits and others visited China in the 13th century. Silkworm eggs were stolen from Chinese Silk Road merchants by Byzantines in the 5th century, spreading silk production in Europe.

 

[Annmarkerls]

I wanted to add that the methods of how historians date events and archeological materials are not always accurate and the date can differ from a few years to millions of years in some cases like evolution . In my studies of Ancient Greece and Europe, as well as ancient Persia , China, whole Asia in fact , Africa too , and the exiles of the 12 tribes of Israel, I have this great theory: the Great Wall of china was built by both Alexander the Macedonian and the Chinese who rebelled against Xerxes and Esther : they were fighting the Persians of Xerxes the husband of queen Esther of the bible . And the Chinese were actually themselves Persians just as Xerxes and Esther were, besides the fact that Esther was also Jew. The term Chinese is actually originally xi- nese as xia - people from Per-xia, that is PerSia. And xia is from "scy" as in Scythia because the Persians were originally a branch of the scythians who split from the scythians to settle in the east of Asia from Bactria to the whole area of the east of the Tibetan mountains. Then under Cyrus, the Persians attacked the Elamites in Central Asia , and then with the Medes conquered babylonia , which by the way was originally whole India stretching so far north it was including Iraq territory .

So the wall Alexander built against the scythians may be true; but I believe he also built the wall of china with the Chinese rebels and the prisoners he and the rebels took for themselves . We know that Alexander destroyed and twisted a lot of ancient history of the people he conquered, especially Persia and China bring the 3rd Persian headquarter (from my findings) of the archaemenid Persian empire was no exclusion from Alexander's manipulation and distortions and destruction of history: in fact, I believe he called himself the first emperor of china as Hwang di who built the wall of china because he did build it by to overcome Xerxes and his men who had gone to Bactria and Mongolia areas , but he wanted to be worshipped as greater than the leaders he had conquered and so destroyed those who knew the truth and were against him , so that the majority of the people who did not know the truth of what was really going on would obey him , which they did .

 

[Annmarkerls]

I wanted to add that the methods of how historians date events and archeological materials are not always accurate and the date can differ from a few years to millions of years in some cases like evolution . In my studies of Ancient Greece and Europe, as well as ancient Persia , China, whole Asia in fact , Africa too , and the exiles of the 12 tribes of Israel, I have this great theory: the Great Wall of china was built by both Alexander the Macedonian and the Chinese who rebelled against Xerxes and Esther : they were fighting the Persians of Xerxes the husband of queen Esther of the bible . And the Chinese were actually themselves Persians just as Xerxes and Esther were, besides the fact that Esther was also Jew. The term Chinese is actually originally xi- nese as xia - people from Per-xia, that is PerSia. And xia is from "scy" as in Scythia because the Persians were originally a branch of the scythians who split from the scythians to settle in the east of Asia from Bactria to the whole area of the east of the Tibetan mountains. Then under Cyrus, the Persians attacked the Elamites in Central Asia , and then with the Medes conquered babylonia , which by the way was originally whole India stretching so far north it was including Iraq territory .

So the wall Alexander built against the scythians may be true; but I believe he also built the wall of china with the Chinese rebels and the prisoners he and the rebels took for themselves . We know that Alexander destroyed and twisted a lot of ancient history of the people he conquered, especially Persia and China bring the 3rd Persian headquarter (from my findings) of the archaemenid Persian empire was no exclusion from Alexander's manipulation and distortions and destruction of history: in fact, I believe he called himself the first emperor of china as Hwang di who built the wall of china because he did build it by to overcome Xerxes and his men who had gone to Bactria and Mongolia areas , but he wanted to be worshipped as greater than the leaders he had conquered and so destroyed those who knew the truth and were against him , so that the majority of the people who did not know the truth of what was really going on would obey him , which they did .

Also, from the ancient Korean writings, Giants were living among the people like in their story of chi you the king who attacked the yellow emperor of the Chinese (I strongly identify chi you to the little brother of Cyrus the great : Cyrus used to be pronounced as similar to Kai - Hryoos which through time and dialects became chi yoo. When Cyrus became king, his brother fled toward Beijing area and started a rebellion versus Cyrus (chi you) and called himself the new Cyrus (chi you) for his followers .Anyways, he was said to have had giants with him to attack Cyrus. Cyrus won and had to kill his brother in the famous Chinese battle of zoulu . But the chi you being worshipped today in China is not Cyrus 'brother , but Cyrus's own tomb! The so called yellow emperor who made an ancestral worship of chi you was actually Alexander the Macedonian who after conquering all Persia forced ancestral worship . Prior to him, no Persians (even Chinese and while eastern Asians -Persians ) practiced ancestral worship : their religion was mostly and legally zoriastrianism, which was actually originally the teachings of Daniel of the bible !!! In other words, the Old Testament with daniel's own extra writings. Sadly but as revealed by Daniel himself in his writings as Zoroaster and Confucius too by the way, so many sects and false understandings emerged among the people that what was simply Judaism became many false variants of it with new names : Zoroastrianism itself is one, Hinduism (Daniel was in Babylonia which is India ) , Confucianism , and Buddhism.

Concerning the name yellow emperor , In The many Chinese historical accounts remains, Cyrus was called yu the great and the yellow emperor : he was the emperor with the Mandate of Heaven which historically was nothing else but declaring that God had allowed the Jews to go back to Israel land under his ruling. But that similar version of the yellow emperor who defeated chi you can also be the historical fact that Alexander as the yellow emperor defeated chi you who is the title in Eastern Asia Persians for the archaemenid emperors , thus chi you here would refer to Xerxes but there is no battle of zoulu between the two for their battle occurred in Bactria , not China .

 

[JackRT]

Alexander and his army entered northern India via Afghanistan. That was his closest approach to China. That would be almost 2000 miles away. The Persians were a Caucasian people not a Mongolian people.

 

[visionary]

Did Alexander start it all, with a little section of the Great Wall of China? If so, then where is the Persian influence in the architecture? What section can be pointed to as the oldest section? Where is it located and/or does it still exist?

The Great Wall of China is a series of stone and earthen fortifications in, built, rebuilt, and maintained between the 5th century BC and the 16th century to protect the northern borders of the Chinese Empire during the rule of successive dynasties. Several walls, referred to as the Great Wall of China , were built since the 5th century BC. The most famous is the wall built between 220 BC and 200 BC by the first Emperor of China, Qin Shi Huang; little of it remains; it was much farther north than the current wall, which was built during the Ming Dynasty.

 

[visionary]

I always heard of Gog and Magog as representations of China and Russia. Yet, two characters have the names of the descendants from Japheth. Japheth got the north and east.

Does it make more sense why the Wall of China is so tall and massive. It would be a bit of “over-kill” if it was simply meant to keep out armies of 6 foot tall invaders. The more one digs the more interesting it gets in this mystery as to why, who, what, where, when and how.

 

[Yusuphhai]

Emperor Alexander (356-323BC）established a large empire, the most eastern border was Hindu River. He did not know “China” existed. In fact, at that time more than 7 countries were battling in the area of eastern part of Yellow River, they also did not know Hindu existed. They built some walls for their own defense (mainly resisted the Hun to the north of them). Certainly the walls of different country were unconnected. Later Emperor Qin ShiHuang (259-210BC) united “China” and connected the walls. But the most western point of the Great Wall was only in current GanSu Province (in the north middle of Modern China). It was still very far (more than 5 thousand Kilometers) to Hindu River. Later in Han Dynasty (202BC-220AD), when China Empire expanded toward West, Chinese started to know about Middle Asia, and a little about Hindu, Persia, Arabia and the western world.