Getting it out - The Spanking Thread

[Entertaining_Angels]

Okay, based on the numerous spanking threads I've seen, I gather we all have an opinion and each thread usually boils down to whether spanking is abusive or not (just based on all the arguments...I'm right, you're wrong...nanny nanny boo boo).

Sooooo....let's see if we can just get it all out there. I'd like to set some ground rules for this one (if possible)

1) everybody just posts ONE time to this thread
2) do not direct your post to anybody else in this thread
3) just state at what point you feel spanking blurs into abuse and is no longer just discipline
i.e. when bruises are left or any time the tush is swatted.

Does this make sense? I'm curious if this will work and if we can just post our opinion once and not direct comments at other parents choices.

This can be a sort of 'research' thread for parents looking for info on spanking =)

The Question: When do you believe spanking becomes abuse and, if you choose to share, what do you believe to be non-abusive spanking?

 

[Entertaining_Angels]

Okay, just my opinion, but I think the line between discipline and abuse gets blurred anytime an object is used but I have no problem with parents using their open hand to give a swat or two to the tush.

That about sums up my opinion on the matter.

Anybody else care to share with no further comments from me since my one post is now used up.

 

[TheTruthinFiction]

Okay, based on the numerous spanking threads I've seen, I gather we all have an opinion and each thread usually boils down to whether spanking is abusive or not.

Sooooo....let's see if we can just get it all out there. I'd like to set some ground rules for this one (if possible)

1) everybody just posts ONE time to this thread
2) do not direct your post to anybody else in this thread
3) just state at what point you feel spanking blurs into abuse
i.e. when bruises are left or any time the tush is swatted.

Does this make sense? I'm curious if this will work and if we can just post our opinion once and not direct comments at other parents choices.

This can be a sort of 'research' thread for parents looking for info on spanking =)

The Question: When do you believe spanking becomes abuse and, if you choose to share, what do you believe to be non-abusive spanking?

This is a great idea. Make guidelines before anyone has the chance to hijack the thread. For me, abuse happens with the first strike. A child will make mistakes but spanking them will not teach them anything except that hitting is okay. Spanking is the easy way out in parenting, spank them and they won't do it again mentality. That is until they become a rebellious teenager and suddenly are telling their high school counselor that their parents abused them when they were little. There is a trust between parent and child that is broken when a child is hit, spanked. I don't like the word spanked, it is used to soften the hit to other people's eyes and ears. I'm not being combative, as someone has said, not being rude, not being mean, this is my honest opinion that I have made from years with working with children who have been abused (Boys Club, Big Brother, Big Sister and more recently in a church group of, "troubled teens") I have spoke with the Pastor that we should change that class to, "Absent Parenting" and let the teens go have some fun. If no one argues with me, it will be the first time since I have been on CF that has happened. Thanks for the guidelines.

 

[sara elizabeth]

I believe that spanking is a very effective form of discipline. It becomes abuse if done in anger or done inconsistantly (one time child is spanked and the next time not for the same offence).
If used carefully and consistantly spanking can and will turn out happy well adjusted children. (This is of course taking into consideration that the child is also recieving plenty of love and attention)

 

[Hope_0004]

I don't have kids, but this is very interesting.

(By the way, if anyone cares, I believe that I probably will spank if I have children, but only as a last resort. I really honestly kind of wish I could leave it to my future husband, but that's just the easy way out. )

 

[Andry]

Right from the top, I don't agree at all that it "usually boils down to whether spanking is abusive or not".

Spanking is never abusive. When it becomes abuse, it crosses the threshold from spanking to beating. So that's no longer spanking. And beating is abuse.

Do you need to spank you kids? If you do, spank. If you don't, don't spank.

The question becomes, when do you need to spank your kids. That's the tricky part that many parts haven't got a good handle on. Taking a purely objective perspective, if spanking becomes necessary, some parents spank way too soon, some parents spank way too late (or not at all).

Done correctly, it's not abuse.

Done incorrectly, it's no longer spanking, ergo, it's beating, and that's abuse.

 

[Carri20]

The Question: When do you believe spanking becomes abuse and, if you choose to share, what do you believe to be non-abusive spanking?

SPANKING: Light swat on the behind with open hand, intended to sting but not injure, often used to get the child's attention when nothing else works, or as a pre-determined and forewarned punishment of unacceptable behavior.

ABUSE: Severe swat on the behind or other bodily area with hand or other object, usually intended to "get back at" the child for any inconvenieces his/her behavior has caused the parent, often occuring on a whim and causing pain that lasts longer than a few minutes.

 

[Jengi]

I think spanking can be an effective punishment when it is needed. Some children will respond well to other punishments (time outs, removal of prividledges, etc.) and for some children spanking is the most effective punishment. I think it needs to be reserved for a major consequence and always done with a warning and a chance for the behavior to be corrected. I don't know if we will use spanking with our daughter or not. If it is nessacery, we will. I think that above all, what ever discipline a parent choses to use, it should not only correct the undesirable behavior but also include instruction in the proper behavior.

When it crosses a line into abuse in my opinion, is when the spanking is given as an emotional response by the parent. I think a calm explaination as to why they are being spanked followed by a swat on the bottom is apropriate when it fits the consequence. I also think it can be abuse when the parent uses it as the only discipline method when another discipline method would be just as effective or more suited to the misbehavior.

 

[ShannonMcCatholic]

I do not spank- becaue there is no way I could not be angry and spank my kids. The idea of methodically hitting my children devoid of anger truly mystifies me...

I believe the whole spare the rod, spoil the child verse to be sorely mis understod-- as a shepherd doesn't use his rod to whap his sheep, but gently guide them back into the fold. Thus I believe it to mean I must constantly be vigilant to guide my children back to virtuous living.

My four kids are all really well behaved, and can interact well with adults and other children. I am often complimented on how enjoyable they are from people at church, teachers, other kids, babysitters, etc.

The greatest lesson we are all trying to help each other learn- we have made our family motto: Others First! We all try to remeber always to put others needs, desires and wants above our own - both parents and children - and that goes a long way to helping us have children with willing spirits.

There is a gret Christian who was named Don Bosco-- he believed and lived out the idea that in order to get children to obey, the best way was to make them love you, through loving and playing with them. That once you have a young person's heart they will do whatever it is you ask of them, whereas if they merely fear you, they will only not do what they are afraid of getting caught doing.

 

[LegacyOfLove]

I am not sure that I can call spanking with an object abuse. I was spanked with "objects" as a child: flyswatter, belt (once), as well as an open hand (non-object there).

I still believe that spanking is okay. I also believe that there are many effective ways to discipline one's children and that spanking isn't the answer to everything. In fact, it isn't the answer a lot of times. But, in some cases, the immediate consequences of receiving a spanking can bring instant results too.

Every child has a specific type of discipline that works best for them. Yes, I got spanked a few times as a child, but for the most part, a stern look from my parents or being yelled at got my attention a lot quicker.

Having four children of my own, I have seen the benefits of discovering what works best for each of them. Especially true as they get older and their "value-system" begins to shift! Grounding as well as removing privledges works extremely well for my teens and pre-teen. My nine-year-old...if you just look at him with an upset-expression on your face or raise your voice, it will stop him in his tracks and he'll then do what he is supposed to.

Abuse? I'd say when you are taking out your anger and frustration on your child, that is abuse. It doesn't matter if it's just yelling at them or if you've smacked them. "Discipline" isn't an excuse to take out a parent's anger on their child!

While some will say that all spanking is abuse; you'll have others who say spanking is the only reliable form of discipline. I just don't agree with either of those perspectives. I've seen parents who spank for every little thing their child does wrong and the kids get back up and 5 minutes later goes back and does it all over again. I've seen parents who refuse to spank their children and also...5 minutes later are back to the same behavior that got them into trouble in the first place.

Know your child. Know what works best for them. Then use that method of discipline in a way that shows your child love, guidance and direction.

~~Just my thoughts~~

 

[lucypevensie]

I don't think proper spanking is abuse. Keep in mind that children can experience abuse in many different forms, not just by being smacked and hit. I've observed parents in the store abusing their children verbally in horrendous ways -- "Shut up you stupid brat! I'm so sick of you!"

Sure, a lot of times a normal parent spanks with anger and frustration. I don't think that's the ideal way to spank but it's not necessarliy abuse unless it becomes a habit or if it's happing a lot. Ideally it should always be calm and with the intent to change the child's heart attitude for his own good. When any punishment (not just spanking) becomes an anger outlet for the parent then I think it's truly abuse.

This is just a short answer and it's not real comprehensive. But that's my opinionin in a nutshell.

 

[forgivenmuch]

i agree with blue impulse totally,if you spend time with your child and understand what they are going thru you would know that they are learning or wanting attention. spanking never does any good when you do it alot. i know that timeouts and talking and taking things away from a child works better than spankings. your children want to please you and wants praise when they do. no child is perfect and when you have to spank when they make a mistake they will get to thinking what is the use of trying?
there must be limits to spanking, if you ever do it i would suggest it be in a life threatning situation. children are going to make mistakes and you need to encourage your children to do better instead of spanking when they do wrong.

 

[LovesOfMyLife]

I do not spank- becaue there is no way I could not be angry and spank my kids. The idea of methodically hitting my children devoid of anger truly mystifies me...

I believe the whole spare the rod, spoil the child verse to be sorely mis understod-- as a shepherd doesn't use his rod to whap his sheep, but gently guide them back into the fold. Thus I believe it to mean I must constantly be vigilant to guide my children back to virtuous living.

Ditto Shannon and Truthinfiction. And that is my .02 on this thread

 

[Katydid]

no child is perfect and when you have to spank when they make a mistake they will get to thinking what is the use of trying?

I think this is a key statement. We don't spank for mistakes, EVER. If my son drops something accidentally, they don't get spanked. My oldest accidentally bloodied my middle son's nose, they were rough housing and he elbowed him on accident. He asked why he didn't get a swat, and I explained, mistakes are not willful disobedience, they are just mistakes.


As far as when spanking becomes abuse, well, that kinda depends....

1. If it causes major physical harm

2. If it is accompanied by emotional abuse

3. If it is used to correct uncorrectable behavior (accidents, typical child like behavior etc.)

4. If it is used as a constant and continuous threat causing the children to live in fear.


I think that would be about how I see it.

 

[Andy Broadley]

I just replied in a similer way on another thread about this and my position remains the same. If you use violence towards a child, and no matter what name you dress it up in, it is still violence, then that is child abuse.

 

[murron]

I'm a spanking mom. Spanking is not abuse, abuse is beating. I think the hype about spanking being abuse is a result of having to be too politically correct. Put this in perspective; as Christians we've probably all heard the passage on Abraham and Isaac. Did any of us ever stop and think "Wow, Abraham was abusing Isaac" or did we think "Wow, what tremendous faith Abraham had to be willing to take his only child to sacrifice him to God". If we look at that event through our modern politically correct glasses, we'd all be ready to lock Abraham away forever.

That said, spanking is not something doled out for the slightest infractions either. It is reserved for only the most serious of problems - such as doing something potentially injurious. I'd rather have the bottom sting for a while as a reminder of what not to do, than see my child in a full body cast in ICU because he ran out in the street.

I don't spank my older two children any longer because they are capable of reasoning and it is more effective to reason out the punishment with them than it is to spank them. The youngest (he's 4) is really starting to grasp the reasoning issue and spanking rarely happens anymore. Spanking by itself does no good; it must be explained rationally, imo. From the time my children could speak, I began explaining cause and effect, action and consequence. Then I progressed to asking them to explain what they did and what the consequence is. Thus, they learned and were able to modify their behaviors. The 4 year old can now identify when he was told not to do something that he ignored instructions on. He accepts the responsibility of not obeying and understands why that is not allowed. Spanking will soon be a complete thing of the past in our home (as this is the last child, God willing, I am ever going to have).

In a nut shell, spanking can serve a purpose when done correctly and used exactly as it should be; a tool for correction and redirection in conjunction with teaching. I don't believe it is as effective as reasoning, but you have to get to the age of reason in order to dispense with spanking.