Frustration in Discussing Meaty Threads?

[Mikhail]

Hi All,
I agree with Charles it is very frustrating when threads are forced to walk on egg shells every time a doctrine or a contraversal name is mentioned such as rood, avi etc.

If we have a Group created that is not under "For Christians Only"
Such as "Torah Observant Beleivers in Yeshua"

What do others think would you use a forum that was without the restriction of this forum?

Something in the manner of Liberal Theology that alows discussion that is not permitted on the other forum sections.
Shalom,
Mikhail ben Gino

 

[Bracy]

I think people need to realize that one's opinion of a particular religious doctrine does not equate to an opinion about the person who holds that doctrine. For instance, Yeshua hated the doctrines of the Pharisees and Nicolaitans, but that doesn't mean He hated the people known as Pharisees and Nicolaitans.

I think too many people have their "sacred cows" and take personal offense when their doctrines are challenged.

 

[Charles YTK]

And it seems also that if we are to use this forum to the purpose of learning from one another then we must be able to discuss at least our own variations of Messianic doctrine and the reasons we believe what we do. Some of our doctrine are the same a Christainity and some are the same as Judaism, for we are that third branch between them that existed in the days of the apostles.

In Judaism as you can see in Talmud, it was OK to disagree and to argue your point but it did not mean that you hated the one you opposed. It is like the story of two rival Rabbis who fought bitterly for years in great debates. And then one day one of them died. His opponent was mourning terribly for weeks. Finally one of his students approached him and inquired. "He was your opponent, why do you feel so bad?" and the Rabbi answers, " Because I have lost my best friend. Who will I debate with now as I did with my good friend who is now gone?"

Because we debate with one another does not mean that we do not respect, honor and love them as brothers.

 

[Bruce101]

I would agree, however, some people cannot deal with such deep dicussions because of human nature, they get insulted. Or take things the way they were not intended. I don't always have to win.
It is good to know when to back out of a discussion. Whether you are right or wrong. (of coarse, you are never wrong, LOL)
Some folks are so cemented to their positions that they will not budge in the face of evidence or common sense.

Bruce

 

[christinepro]

For some reason the truth is like poison for some people and they can't emotionally take it because it proves what they have been practicing all of their lives is not from the GREAT ONE.

 

[Wags]

On the other hand the internet is not the best place for debate, becuase it doesn't really allow for a full discusion no matter what moderation may or may not be in place. It is impossible to hear inflection or to see body language. And the vast majority of communication is based on those two things that aren't available in written format.

 

[Bracy]

On the other hand the internet is not the best place for debate, becuase it doesn't really allow for a full discusion no matter what moderation may or may not be in place. It is impossible to hear inflection or to see body language. And the vast majority of communication is based on those two things that aren't available in written format.

I couldn't disagree more. The internet is perhaps the best place for debate and discussion. It's the reason for its existence: the exchange of information. What better way exists for us to debate and discuss theological beliefs with such a diverse group of people from all parts of the world?

I can't see voice inflection and body language in our scriptures, either, but nevertheless it is the method by which our Elohim has chosen to reveal Himself. If the written word is such a poor method of communication, then I must wonder why He chose this method.

 

[Talmidah]

Hi All,
I agree with Charles it is very frustrating when threads are forced to walk on egg shells every time a doctrine or a contraversal name is mentioned such as rood, avi etc.

If we have a Group created that is not under "For Christians Only"
Such as "Torah Observant Beleivers in Yeshua"

Something in the manner of Liberal Theology that alows discussion that is not permitted on the other forum sections.

Maybe you could use the GA, non-Christian, or Unorthodox Theology sections for that?

 

[stone]

yep, i agree with you guys, i'd say more, but i'm not sure if it would get me in trouble, and the reason why i don't take certain types of questions to other area's for debate is because i will not receive the feedback from the desired audiance.

 

[Vaneeza Malkah]

You could use the GA or Non-Christian forums for that, no?

I think he is trying to say that there should be a section within the site for torah-observant messianics to discuss issues because there are messianics who believe in torah observancy and there are those who don't. Here in houston our congregation is the only torah observant congregation while there are 4 other messianic synagogues/groups.

 

[Talmidah]

I think he is trying to say that there should be a section within the site for torah-observant messianics to discuss issues because there are messianics who believe in torah observancy and there are those who don't. Here in houston our congregation is the only torah observant congregation while there are 4 other messianic synagogues/groups.

Oh, I apologize, I misunderstood. I thought Mikhail meant he would like a forum outside of the Christians Only section, that's why I suggested the other forums.

 

[Vaneeza Malkah]

Oh, I apologize, I misunderstood. I thought Mikhail meant he would like a forum outside of the Christians Only section, that's why I suggested the other forums.

No need to apologize, I could be wrong after all. I think that the rules won't allow a section like that anyway within the christian only section. I believe that messianics is 100% unorthodox since it predates catholocism and orthodox christianity so unorthodox theology would make sense. However when visiting the site, it would be difficult to find such a location. I just assume leave it under messianic judaism. It seems to be a bit of a problem that everytime someone mentions torah observance someone (no one in particular ) gets huffy about it and starts drawing conclusions/name calling.

 

[Bananna]

We should be able to have real debates regardless of whether it is supported view. We learn by being able to defend all sides of the issue, those we believe and those we do not.

Most people think debate is a heated discussion of their own personal interpretations.

If you want some meaty debate, State the theory and pass out the views to those who do not believe them, make them study that view and defend that view. Just like school. Except we can give virtual prizes to the winner.

 

[Vaneeza Malkah]

We should be able to have real debates regardless of whether it is supported view. We learn by being able to defend all sides of the issue, those we believe and those we do not.

Most people think debate is a heated discussion of their own personal interpretations.

If you want some meaty debate, State the theory and pass out the views to those who do not believe them, make them study that view and defend that view. Just like school. Except we can give virtual prizes to the winner.

A good suggestion regaurding debate, There is something to be said about getting together in the name of Adonai to encourage others in an uplifting way not a negative way. I guess we should have our healthy portions of debate and fellowship. Two ears to hear and one mouth to speak (err, type) you could say. Our words act as a double edged sword they can uplift and they can damage, debates can turn into damaging words if not careful.

 

[Sephania]

whitneysyed , don't take this the wrong way but you are wise beyond your years, a gift from Adonai for sure!

 

[Bruce101]

whitneysyed , don't take this the wrong way but you are wise beyond your years, a gift from Adonai for sure!

Ditto here, I was about to make the same comment.

It gives more warm fuzzy feelings when someone young can get in the mix and know what they are talking about.

Bruce

 

[visionary]

I believe that one of the skills we can work on here, or at least have the opportunity, is the gift of speaking the truth in the spirit of Yeshua. If people find fault in what you are saying then, is it because we have not worded it the way Yeshua would have. Often it is not the debatedable subject that needs to be addressed but the relationship of the party to Yeshua. We should do more praying for our brethren asking the Lord what do they need, not what do we want to say. Many a theme is not where they are at. Our focus should not be on the debateable but of Yehsua.

I love discussing meatier matter. I like and am glad for the opportunity we have here to discuss them. I know that I have often wondered why this or that thread got closed when I personally did not see anything offensive. I have had my threads altered, deleted and censored and not understood why. Sometimes I never find out even when I ask.

But my focus is not on what happened but on what next. I can not change what has happened but I sure can do something about what I can do. Where there is a will there is a way, and are we not suppose to be wiley as wolves and innocent as doves?

 

[Charles YTK]

Rule no. "This" and Rule no. "That". Shoot Torah as the Rabbi counts has only 613 and we seem to have more rules and restrictions and black out areas than that. It would be easier for all of us if they would just post a little list of what IS ALLOWED to be discussed here. I know it would not be a very long list or take very long to compile. There aren't that many things that are allowed.

 

[Vaneeza Malkah]

Ditto here, I was about to make the same comment.

It gives more warm fuzzy feelings when someone young can get in the mix and know what they are talking about.

Bruce

I'll just give credit to Adonai for that one.

 

[Bon]

Here in houston our congregation is the only torah observant congregation while there are 4 other messianic synagogues/groups.

Hi whitneysyed,

Off track here for a sec.

What defines a MESSIANIC CONGREGATION if it is NOT Torah observant?

That is how I always describe myself as being different from general christianity when someone asks.

"Keep Shabbat, eat only clean foods, keep the Holy Feasts of YHWH....
...Torah stuff.



Bon