Friends say student killed by officer was gentle; police say he struck officer

[Billnew]

Friends: Student killed by officer was gentle; police: he hit officer - CNN.com

There is no dashboard video of the shooting available, but a microphone recorded sound from the altercation Friday.
It reveals the campus officer from the University of the Incarnate Word in Alamo Heights giving multiple warnings to the student before firing six shots at him.
Five of them struck him. He was later pronounced dead on the scene, Pruitt said Monday.

Sad.
He went drinking and then decided to fight the policeman.

Police errors:
1.He gave wrong street address, delaying backup. (they struggled 6 minutes, plenty of time for back up to arrive if they knew where it was.)
2.He allowed his baton to be taken from him.
3.He got the baton away from the drunk student, but still could not get the student under control.

Some might say 6 shots was excessive, but when you are in a life or death fight, you shoot until the threat is removed. If the student did not stop after being shot, then the threat remained.

The cop needs instructions on knowing where he is and be able to relay the information correctly.
He should have checked on back-up when the individual did not comply,(the cop admitted the student was taller and heavier then he) and not fully engaged the student without assistance. There must be no lone wolf gun slinger mentality in police work. You don't go one on one, if you don't have too.

Those evil tasers might have changed the outcome of this incident, but they have gotten such a bad rep, from abuse and misuse that I bet many places don't use them for fear of liability.

2-3 zaps by a taser might risk the life of the suspect, but 6 shots from a pistol are alot more likely to cause permanent bodily harm to the suspect and people around the suspect. (remember only 5 out of 6 hit, one missed.)

 

[Paradoxum]

Sounds to me like the cop murdered him. I don't believe the cops life was in danger. Police in the UK don't have guns but they don't get killed by drunk people. American cops seem just too trigger happy... otherwise known as murderous.

If you are going to handcuff someone then you have to have the force to back that up. If you can't back up an arrest with force then don't be surprised if someone resists an arrest they think is wrong.

 

[Gailerina]

Anyone a cop shots at was a nice and wonderful person who everyone...even the criminal who was shooting at police or running from them (sorry....I'm from an inner city where I get tired of hearing police are horrible for killing a person just because the career criminal wanted on murder charges ran from them).

For this case.....I wish there was a dashboard camera, because it can help. It's easy to say the cop should have handcuffed him, but I have seen videos where you are asking for something impossible. Drunk people rarely feel pain and will do anything to get away from a cop. Now....6 shots make no sense though, which is why a dashboard camera might be helpful to see if they were struggling for the gun.

In the end, should the kid had died? Of course not! But drunk people do stupid things all the time and end up dying because of it.

 

[Paradoxum]

Anyone a cop shots at was a nice and wonderful person who everyone...even the criminal who was shooting at police or running from them (sorry....I'm from an inner city where I get tired of hearing police are horrible for killing a person just because the career criminal wanted on murder charges ran from them).

I'm not sure it's ok to kill someone just because they are running away.

For this case.....I wish there was a dashboard camera, because it can help. It's easy to say the cop should have handcuffed him, but I have seen videos where you are asking for something impossible. Drunk people rarely feel pain and will do anything to get away from a cop. Now....6 shots make no sense though, which is why a dashboard camera might be helpful to see if they were struggling for the gun.

The cop could have stopped trying to arrest him. The cop is the one who is sober and meant to have training... just let the guy go in his house or stand outside until backup arrives.

In the end, should the kid had died? Of course not! But drunk people do stupid things all the time and end up dying because of it.

The guy didn't fall off a roof, he resisted being arrested and getting hit by a big stick. He might be wrong for doing that, but he didn't endanger his life, the cop did. If the cop didn't have a gun, or use it, I bet everyone would be pretty much okay now.

 

[Purge187]

I heard on the news yesterday that the dashcam fell off because the temperature had caused it to come unglued. Right.

I posted a video here a few weeks ago of a couple of women being given body cavity searches out in public while one of their husbands looked on helplessly in the back of the police cruiser. The policewoman didn't bother changing gloves.

 

[Paradoxum]

^ Because penetrating someone's body without consent is much better than drugs which can be taken with consent.

 

[TerranceL]

This is a local story for me, heard this story on the news yesterday.

UIW officer under investigation had 9 police jobs with 8 agencies in 7-year span | kens5.com San Antonio

ALAMO HEIGHTS -- Records obtained by KENS 5 Tuesday from the Texas Commission on Law Enforcement shows University of the Incarnate Word police officer Chris Carter had nine law enforcement jobs with eight different agencies from September 2004 to May 2011.
Carter shot and killed UIW senior Cameron Redus following a traffic stop outside the student's apartment north of campus early Friday morning.
Redus was unarmed, but according to investigators with the Alamo Heights Police Department, he grabbed Carter's baton and used it to strike the officer in the head and arm.
Prior to being hired by UIW, records indicate Carter did not stay at any of the previous departments longer than 18 months.

 

[Robban]

I'm not sure it's ok to kill someone just because they are running away.



The cop could have stopped trying to arrest him. The cop is the one who is sober and meant to have training... just let the guy go in his house or stand outside until backup arrives.



The guy didn't fall off a roof, he resisted being arrested and getting hit by a big stick. He might be wrong for doing that, but he didn't endanger his life, the cop did. If the cop didn't have a gun, or use it, I bet everyone would be pretty much okay now.

Is drunken driving taken so lightly in the UK?

If he had not been stopped and he had crashed the car, and was killed?
How many people was he able to kill while driving the car drunk?
If he had collided with another car, killing a whole family?
Sometimes I think that the job of a police is more like a garbage collector.
But I don,t live in the US, but I would Think if they are issued handguns, they are meant to be used.
Otherwise, why not give waterpistols.

 

[Billnew]

This is a local story for me, heard this story on the news yesterday.

UIW officer under investigation had 9 police jobs with 8 agencies in 7-year span | kens5.com San Antonio

That does not bode well for the police force or the people that pay them.

The sound is still in evidence, so I must assume the camera was not properly mounted.
Otherwise someone would have to dub the recording over a recording of whatever the camera was pointing at. That would also be several felonies in doing so.

It seems the words match the story. Even a idiot cop can be involved in a justifiable shooting.

Handcuffing:
I am 5'5", in the military I weighed 115-120lbs, 6 c-workers decided they were bored and would handcuff me. Including a 6'9" individual that struggled to meet weigh requirements(he was tall and large). They grabbed me, I got hold of the handcuffs, they spent ten minutes trying to get me cuffed and never did. Granted they couldn't beat on me, or body slam me, or chance breaking a bone. But handcuffing someone that doesn't want to be cuffed, is tougher then you think.

As with any civilian, I believe he is innocent until proven guilty.

With his record, I think the mix up about where he was is grounds for termination, if he has been there long enough to know.

 

[Vanilla Scripture]

I heard on the news yesterday that the dashcam fell off because the temperature had caused it to come unglued. Right.

Agreed. What a bit of chaos that would cause if the police dashcam dislocated from its position every winter due to glue failure.

I posted a video here a few weeks ago of a couple of women being given body cavity searches out in public while one of their husbands looked on helplessly in the back of the police cruiser. The policewoman didn't bother changing gloves.

I saw the news report about this and watched the video in that thread. Vaginal and anal searches of two women and wearing the same pair of gloves. Sickening.
Not many women are able to say they caught their rapist on camera. But these two young ladies could. And it was a police officer that was the rapist!

As for the OP article, I think we're going to be reading more and more about cops using lethal force unnecessarily. But they'll blame the victim and rarely be prosecuted for murder by cop.

It's getting more and more dangerous for citizens to encounter police now days. And especially so in those states wherein it has become illegal for civilians to film police. Some states make it a felony.

But those police can film citizens. Those are the states wherein I'll bet if we checked the news reports we hear about police abuses occurring with greater frequency.
Because if you as a civilian capture their offense you become the defendant and the evidence of the officers offense is thrown out because it was obtained illegally.

Great scheme for what has been called the phantom police state that is gradually gaining authority in America.

 

[keith99]

This is a local story for me, heard this story on the news yesterday.

UIW officer under investigation had 9 police jobs with 8 agencies in 7-year span | kens5.com San Antonio

After reading it I'd say this isn't half as bad as it initially sounded. One huge thing is he had 2 stints with the same department. Problem employees do not get rehired. Budget cut victims do. Other thing is the statement that he had no disciplinary issues at any of the departments. (caveat on that is often people are allowed to resign so long as they go quietly, so digging could uncover stuff).

I'm no lightweight, but he looks grossly fat to me. Perhaps he is one of the unlucky people who puts on fat in the face and neck, but if not he is not physically fit enough to be a patrol officer.

 

[Paradoxum]

Is drunken driving taken so lightly in the UK?

I didn't say it wasn't bad, I'm saying cops shouldn't murder people. Is murder okay where you are from?

If he had not been stopped and he had crashed the car, and was killed?
How many people was he able to kill while driving the car drunk?
If he had collided with another car, killing a whole family?

Hadn't he already stopped outside his house, unless I am remembering incorrectly?

Sometimes I think that the job of a police is more like a garbage collector.

Nice.

But I don,t live in the US, but I would Think if they are issued handguns, they are meant to be used.
Otherwise, why not give waterpistols.

I'd think it would be to stop other dangerous people with guns.

I don't really care if the US told their cops to kill anyone they didn't like the look of; just because you are told something is okay doesn't make it so. Guns shouldn't only be used in extreme situations.

It sounds to me like you are advocating that cops should use guns whenever they feel like. That's just murder.

 

[Robban]

I didn't say it wasn't bad, I'm saying cops shouldn't murder people. Is murder okay where you are from?



Hadn't he already stopped outside his house, unless I am remembering incorrectly?



Nice.



I'd think it would be to stop other dangerous people with guns.

I don't really care if the US told their cops to kill anyone they didn't like the look of; just because you are told something is okay doesn't make it so. Guns shouldn't only be used in extreme situations.

It sounds to me like you are advocating that cops should use guns whenever they feel like. That's just murder.

Based on a brief newssnip, you have judged the policeofficer as a murderer.
Maybe you have not seen so much yet,
Many times police are abused,
It would be a utopia, a society with no need for police.
But as it is today, we have police, and yes many times they can be likened to garbage collectors.
If you were a bank clerk for example, and the attitude of the customers was contempt, they came into the bank and sprouted tons of garbage over you, would you consider yourself a bankclerk or a garbage collector?
Police, Believe it or not, are humans with families, they are doing a job,
They also have a right to protect themselves.
Better to see police as friends rather than enemies.
What have I more to say in response,
nothing.

 

[Paradoxum]

Based on a brief newssnip, you have judged the policeofficer as a murderer.
Maybe you have not seen so much yet,

Yup, but maybe I'm wrong.

Many times police are abused,
It would be a utopia, a society with no need for police.
But as it is today, we have police, and yes many times they can be likened to garbage collectors.
If you were a bank clerk for example, and the attitude of the customers was contempt, they came into the bank and sprouted tons of garbage over you, would you consider yourself a bankclerk or a garbage collector?

A bankclerk. When you become a police officer you know you are going to be dealing with criminals and potential criminals that you have to lock up... which they wont like.

Police, Believe it or not, are humans with families, they are doing a job,
They also have a right to protect themselves.
Better to see police as friends rather than enemies.
What have I more to say in response,
nothing.

I don't disagree. I'm not against police. I like my police... they don't go round with guns shooting people. Many US police are probably great too. Just because I'm against police being trigger happy doesn't mean I'm against the police.

 

[Robban]

Yup, but maybe I'm wrong.



A bankclerk. When you become a police officer you know you are going to be dealing with criminals and potential criminals that you have to lock up... which they wont like.



I don't disagree. I'm not against police. I like my police... they don't go round with guns shooting people. Many US police are probably great too. Just because I'm against police being trigger happy doesn't mean I'm against the police.

"Bobby"?

Times change, there is a diffrent category of criminals today, driven by drug use.

 

[Paradoxum]

"Bobby"?

Times change, there is a diffrent category of criminals today, driven by drug use.

Bobby?

Decriminalise and legalise drugs, then treat addiction as a health problem.

 

[Robban]

Bobby?

Decriminalise and legalise drugs, then treat addiction as a health problem.

Have you truly never heard "Bobby" before?
It comes from Robert Peel.

Not pc 49 either then?

How about Dan Dare on Luxenburg?

 

[Robban]

Bobby?

Decriminalise and legalise drugs, then treat addiction as a health problem.

"Bobby" is a nickname for a footpatrol
London policeman.
from some years ago.

 

[Robban]

PC49,
pretty scary stuff.

A Case for PC 49 1951 classic movie - YouTube

 

[Paradoxum]

Have you truly never heard "Bobby" before?
It comes from Robert Peel.

Not pc 49 either then?

How about Dan Dare on Luxenburg?

"Bobby" is a nickname for a footpatrol
London policeman.
from some years ago.

I know 'Bobby' is a name for the police... I just didn't know why you said it.

I haven't heard of the other things. Well I know of the country Luxembourg