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fornication

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Christownsme

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In most all of the north american dictionaries the word fornication means having sex in an unmarried state. However looking at the context of 1 Cor 6:12-20 and the original Greek or Latin definitions of the word, it only mentions sex of harlotry in nature.

In 1 Cor 7:1-9, Paul says to avoid fornication, or harlotry, a man and a woman should have a wife/husband. It says if they can't contain, it is better to marry than to burn with passion. It doesn't say it is better to marry than to commit fornication. It doesn't say burning with passion and not being able to contain equals fornication. It doesn't say that a couple seeking to get married are committing fornication either in the context of 1 Cor 6 and 7 OR in the definition of fornication in the original language.

My girlfriend and me have a really tough situation with our healthcare situation that getting married may take some laws to change. I am disabled and have very expensive health care needs, and right now Medicare and Medicaid is covering the fees along with my drug coverage. Her income would bump me off that, and I have been advised at this point not to risk getting bumped off Medicaid by getting married because a new supplemental health insurance under the Affordable Care Act would cost too much for our combined income.

The question is "what is fornication, as defined by the original language?" The word fornication was first used in the 14th century. From the Latin "fornicatus," it means having intercourse with a harlot. From the Greek "porneuo", it means harlotry. So why does the church adopt the notion that sex that can't be contained between two committed adults who haven't married yet is considered fornication?

I'd like to believe that God understands our situation. But I can't form God into my idea of what he should be like. That's not right. I want the truth about this matter. I believe He is working to help us find a way to get married. But His timing is different than mine.


If anybody has comments about this, please post here. I have been in much prayer about this.
 
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BryanW92

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I think that it's better to just do what you seek to justify without redefining words to suit your needs. It isn't fair to others to ask them to bless your justification when they really should just bless your union (with or without "officcial" paperwork).

We all understand the mess that health care has become in the United States. Every "fix" just makes it worse and creates more dependency on the government and its rules. No one can afford it anymore and you shouldn't have to choose between dying from lack of health care and being with the woman you love. Government health care is a precursor to the Mark of the Beast since all will need the Mark to obtain the health care they need one day.

But until the actual Mark becomes reality, work within the system as best you can and ask God in front of witnesses to bless your union without the government paperwork that makes it legal in man's eyes. I doubt they had marriage licenses in Paul's day.
 
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Merlin

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hello,
first you need to understand that the dictionary is not the authority on word meanings. it is simply a lexicon of word usage. that means most people use that word in a particular way, not that the word means a particular definition.
fornication actually refers to temple prostitution.

as for the marriage, make the commitment in church before witnesses.
just dont do the government paperwork.
 
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BeautifulLove

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This is a sticky topic that my husband and I have had a difficult time with. We both were Christians and we still had premarital sex. We were married spiritually (in our opinions).

A lot of people are a lot stricter about it. Yes, legal marriage is probably the best way to go about it (then there are no doubts) but it is ultimately your decision and ultimately what feels right with you and God.

For me I had no regrets. However, I would never tell anyone it's okay. I think there are so many translations to how the bible can be interpreted and I'm sure a lot of people would disagree with me but I am very open minded to it all and know my personal relationship with Christ. I don't think he wants us to be having sex with multiple people. If you are spiritually married that is all you need, not government documents. However if you have any doubt she is not the one, I would not even think about it.

I have a lot of conflicting thoughts on the topic. For instance, Adam and Eve had no legal document stating their marriage.

It's really all about your own beliefs and your own relationship with Christ.
 
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jbearnolimits

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You know, I think about the guy who believes sex outside of marriage is wrong (myself being one of them). Lets say you find a way to justify this. Lets even say you are right. Your brother who believes this to be wrong will look at what you say and be confused and may even get the nerve to do so himself. Yet he will not have the faith to believe it is ok (if that were true).

Congratulations...you just caused your brother to sin.

Read Romans 14 and replace the thought of food with this.
 
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Bramwell

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I agree with JesusFollower that sex outside of marriage is wrong, and a sin against God. But I also think Merlin made a good point in questioning exactly how marriage is defined.

Spiritual marriage can be different from having an actual marriage certificate. There are good reasons for a lot of the traditions associated with the 'sacrament' of marriage. Making your wedding vows in the presence of other witnesses, for example, seems like an important aspect of making the marriage official. But would we really argue that it's necessary for secular governments to recognize a marriage before it's valid in God's eyes? I would think not.
 
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KrAZeD

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God understands your situation, and in truth it's justification of your desires, not his. Are you not looking for a technicality of a word to forgo marriage and enjoy one of it's benefits, justifying it for monetary reasons?

Your looking for ways to circumvent possibly losing medical coverage at your current cost, is that not deceit?

Is your girlfriend understanding of your medical condition and it's cost? Is she not helping contribute with finances already? In marriage, and life in general, money is rarely enough. Theirs always a new expenditure that rears it's head at a wrong time.

My main and actual points are these.

If you and her are in agreement that both of you want to become married and are aware of what each other is going to bring to the table, then do it. If theirs issues both of you want addressed and corrected before marriage, then theirs your answer as well.

In either circumstance, TRUST GOD TO PROVIDE ALWAYS. He might not throw 1m$ in your lap, he will however make sure your basic needs are accounted for. You need and must trust in him to provide, take the burden off of your shoulders and ask God to take care of it, only He can.

Now for a scripture reference genesis 29:11-30.

Jacob and Rachel from the first meeting appear to start the "love at first sight" mantra. After a month Jacob decided he wanted Rachel as a wife. While they did not live literally in the same room, they shared a "house"( tents/structure in very close proximity). For 7 years and 1 week Jacob knew her not(remained a virgin-no fornication/sex).

The man worked for 7 years before his first marriage, without fornication. You and I are both men, you know just as well as I do, if God was in allowance of fornication before an actual marriage Jacob would have known her well before that 7 years was up. He declared and intended to marry- it just wasn't OFFICIAL.

In today's culture marriage is that piece of paper, Jacobs days it was a currency exchange-cattle, goats, slaves, gold, silver etc( he lacked all so work was his exchange). Even with intent, their must G a solidification of the marriage transaction becoming final prior to fornication.

And as a previous poster did mention some churches do provide marriages- though their normally not considered legal under state law- thus creating an issue with submitting to authority and having to go through a legal marriage license.
 
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dayhiker

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It looks like you understand how the meaning of the word fornication has changed over the years.
Also when you study what marriage is you we that that meaning has changed over the years as well.

So remember that Jesus gives us two commands to love God and to love people. So keep obeying tho two commands.

In most all of the north american dictionaries the word fornication means having sex in an unmarried state. However looking at the context of 1 Cor 6:12-20 and the original Greek or Latin definitions of the word, it only mentions sex of harlotry in nature.

In 1 Cor 7:1-9, Paul says to avoid fornication, or harlotry, a man and a woman should have a wife/husband. It says if they can't contain, it is better to marry than to burn with passion. It doesn't say it is better to marry than to commit fornication. It doesn't say burning with passion and not being able to contain equals fornication. It doesn't say that a couple seeking to get married are committing fornication either in the context of 1 Cor 6 and 7 OR in the definition of fornication in the original language.

My girlfriend and me have a really tough situation with our healthcare situation that getting married may take some laws to change. I am disabled and have very expensive health care needs, and right now Medicare and Medicaid is covering the fees along with my drug coverage. Her income would bump me off that, and I have been advised at this point not to risk getting bumped off Medicaid by getting married because a new supplemental health insurance under the Affordable Care Act would cost too much for our combined income.

The question is "what is fornication, as defined by the original language?" The word fornication was first used in the 14th century. From the Latin "fornicatus," it means having intercourse with a harlot. From the Greek "porneuo", it means harlotry. So why does the church adopt the notion that sex that can't be contained between two committed adults who haven't married yet is considered fornication?

I'd like to believe that God understands our situation. But I can't form God into my idea of what he should be like. That's not right. I want the truth about this matter. I believe He is working to help us find a way to get married. But His timing is different than mine.


If anybody has comments about this, please post here. I have been in much prayer about this.
 
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BryanW92

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The bible says to submit to authority. If the government doesn't consider it a marriage, I don't think God does either.

Marriage is something created by God. The state does not have God's authority to regulate marriage.

Also, blindly submitting to authority just because it is authority is wrong. The belt buckle on Nazi uniforms said "God is with us" and those people submitted to authority. The current administration of the US says that we should submit to its will or it will create laws with a pen and a cell phone, circumventing the constitutional process.
 
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peterandrewj

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In most all of the north american dictionaries the word fornication means having sex in an unmarried state. However looking at the context of 1 Cor 6:12-20 and the original Greek or Latin definitions of the word, it only mentions sex of harlotry in nature.


I think fornication defined as harlotry is to go a whoring after other gods. And fornication which sins against one's own body is sex outside of marriage.

We're not under the law BUT we can never approve sin. If you are living in the Spirit, it is important that in your heart you make no place for sin, having faith in the blood of Jesus which cleanses you from sin.

Walk in the Spirit and by the Spirit mortify the deeds of the body.

I pray peace to you in this matter, and for peace to lead you to higher ground.
 
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BeautifulLove

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I'd like to add, don't let anyone make you believe you will go to hell. We are still Christians and believe in forgiveness for our sins. Everyone sins.

If I thought I was going to hell anyway why on earth would I still have a strong connection with Jesus and God? Why would I repent and ask for forgiveness when so many people don't believe in God and don't ask for forgiveness.

That is no excuse to sin on purpose, but think about it.

I'd also like to add that this girlfriend needs to at least become a fiancée as soon as possible. I also think it's important to actually eventually marry her if you are serious.

How does she feel about this situation? As a woman, I imagine marriage is important to her and she would really want a marriage with you. My biggest concern is that one idea of marriage is more so created to have a mother and father around when children are present. I do think it's crucial to be legally married at that point for sure.

Whatever you do make sure you put her feelings first and make sure you are comfortable with it with God.
 
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Omena

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Bryan said:
Marriage is something created by God. The state does not have God's authority to regulate marriage.

Also, blindly submitting to authority just because it is authority is wrong. The belt buckle on Nazi uniforms said "God is with us" and those people submitted to authority. The current administration of the US says that we should submit to its will or it will create laws with a pen and a cell phone, circumventing the constitutional process.

I tend to agree. What happens when the government tells you to take the mark of the beast? What happens when the government drafts it's citizens to go kill people in order to "protect its country"? The government is not God, and I'm not saying that you are saying that, JesusFo11ower, but I think it's important to get off that train ASAP.

I think marriage is between a man, a woman, and God. Governments, IMO, don't really need to be involved, although I can see benefits to be legally married. For example, with your marriage status put on paper, it makes it more clear to you and everyone around you that you are married, and it also makes it clear if/when you choose to divorce. Being legally married could also mean that two people from different countries can stay together in one country (through a spouse visa).
 
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Merlin

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The law is written on your heart. If sex before marriage feels and rings wrong, then don't do it. It's not worth burning in hell just to commit adultery.
hello,
it would not be adultery. adultery is having a physical relationship with a women who is married to another man.
while the law is indeed written on our hearts, feelings can be deceptive.
i do not advise that you live by feelings.
 
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now faith

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The bible says to submit to authority. If the government doesn't consider it a marriage, I don't think God does either.

God would never condone aborition.
The Bible does not say commit sin to render unto Cesar what is his.

The state marriage license is no better than a fishing license.
It was created from racists who did not want people of color to mix with whites.
It was formed early in the 20th century.
It was a means to springboard eugenics.
As well by having one you enter into a third party covenant with the state who holds authority
In your marriage.
Legal presidents have been ruled on by the state to allow your Children to not disclose having a abortion..
 
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now faith

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In most all of the north american dictionaries the word fornication means having sex in an unmarried state. However looking at the context of 1 Cor 6:12-20 and the original Greek or Latin definitions of the word, it only mentions sex of harlotry in nature.

In 1 Cor 7:1-9, Paul says to avoid fornication, or harlotry, a man and a woman should have a wife/husband. It says if they can't contain, it is better to marry than to burn with passion. It doesn't say it is better to marry than to commit fornication. It doesn't say burning with passion and not being able to contain equals fornication. It doesn't say that a couple seeking to get married are committing fornication either in the context of 1 Cor 6 and 7 OR in the definition of fornication in the original language.

My girlfriend and me have a really tough situation with our healthcare situation that getting married may take some laws to change. I am disabled and have very expensive health care needs, and right now Medicare and Medicaid is covering the fees along with my drug coverage. Her income would bump me off that, and I have been advised at this point not to risk getting bumped off Medicaid by getting married because a new supplemental health insurance under the Affordable Care Act would cost too much for our combined income.

The question is "what is fornication, as defined by the original language?" The word fornication was first used in the 14th century. From the Latin "fornicatus," it means having intercourse with a harlot. From the Greek "porneuo", it means harlotry. So why does the church adopt the notion that sex that can't be contained between two committed adults who haven't married yet is considered fornication?

I'd like to believe that God understands our situation. But I can't form God into my idea of what he should be like. That's not right. I want the truth about this matter. I believe He is working to help us find a way to get married. But His timing is different than mine.


If anybody has comments about this, please post here. I have been in much prayer about this.

Get a preacher have a ceremony make your vows before God and some witnesses the preacher will pronounce you man and wife.

A marriage license does not have the power of a covenant between God and a man and woman.
Alabama has common law marriage,be not unequally yoked with the ungodly by state decree.

It is a silly thing that causes misery due to the ignorance of legalism

Romans 8 vs 1 will help.
 
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