Forgiveness

[bsd31]

But how do you know that? plenty of places in scripture show how God will eventually give up on a hard hearted stubborn sinner who will not heed his call.

One litmus test is that if He had given up on you then you wouldn't still be seeking to learn more about Him. I don't mean that you'd just throw up your hands and say "ok I know enough I'll just accept it" but that you'd entirely turn to hating the very idea of God.

We don't love God out of the goodness of our hearts, but we love Him because He enables us to love Him. We don't seek to know Him because we are curious but because He plants a desire to know Him in our hearts. If God had given up on you there'd be no desire on your part to know Him, no love towards Him.

 

[RobertZ]

One litmus test is that if He had given up on you then you wouldn't still be seeking to learn more about Him. I don't mean that you'd just throw up your hands and say "ok I know enough I'll just accept it" but that you'd entirely turn to hating the very idea of God.

We don't love God out of the goodness of our hearts, but we love Him because He enables us to love Him. We don't seek to know Him because we are curious but because He plants a desire to know Him in our hearts. If God had given up on you there'd be no desire on your part to know Him, no love towards Him.

Well I guess when I look back over the past 10yrs of my life it didnt seem like I was hardly ever thinking about God much less seeking him because I was having to much fun indulging in my favorite sin of pornography.

It wasnt until I felt like their was a danger of me being left behind in the rapture that I began to seek after God but it seems like I have been pulling my hair out trying to find him, this has been going on for nearly a year now and im just about to either give up or completely go insane.

I cant get the book of Proverbs out of my head where it speaks of those who will not listen to God and then finally one day in their day of need they will call on him and search for him diligently but will not find him! This is scaring me to death because it seems like its happened to me.

I asked my pastor about this scripture and he said it happens to those who have hardened their hearts. I didnt tell him why I was curious about it but I can tell you that I was very very worried after he confirmed my greatest fear.

 

[leveled]

@RobertZ:

And have you spoken with God about this?

You believe that He is. You believe in His Son, the Lord Jesus. Do you believe that He keeps His word? Do you believe His word?

He has much to say to you, much ... if you would ask.

Have you been asking Him?

.....

The verse you speak of a verse in Proverbs, which I assume is 1:28:

"Then shall they call upon me, but I will not answer; they shall seek me early, but they shall not find me: For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the LORD:" (Pro 1:28-29)

Does this describe you? Do you hate knowledge? Do you not fear the Lord? This hardly describes you, this much I am certain of.

But you seem to be missing verse 33 there, which reads:

"But whoso hearkeneth unto me shall dwell safely, and shall be quiet from fear of evil."
(Pro 1:33)

Now, these verses are not talking about salvation, specifically. They are talking about the fruit of seeking or despising wisdom. Yes, there are applications to be made, but you should not take this verse as meaning that the Lord will not hear you if you call upon Him out of a sincere, humble and contrite heart.

 

[MLEN]

Hi M88,

I once heard a thought that if a person does not want to live for God now on earth, then they would not be very happy living eternally with God in the life after. For they would feel "tied down" - wanting to break all the rules and, not being able to, they would be eternally frustrated.

Either we want to be with God, or not. He does not force us to choose him. But by not choosing to love and serve him we are damning ourselves to a life without him. And an existence without the protection of God will soon end in self destruction anyway.

 

[alexanderjc]

Well I guess when I look back over the past 10yrs of my life it didnt seem like I was hardly ever thinking about God much less seeking him because I was having to much fun indulging in my favorite sin of pornography.

It wasnt until I felt like their was a danger of me being left behind in the rapture that I began to seek after God but it seems like I have been pulling my hair out trying to find him, this has been going on for nearly a year now and im just about to either give up or completely go insane.

I cant get the book of Proverbs out of my head where it speaks of those who will not listen to God and then finally one day in their day of need they will call on him and search for him diligently but will not find him! This is scaring me to death because it seems like its happened to me.

I asked my pastor about this scripture and he said it happens to those who have hardened their hearts. I didnt tell him why I was curious about it but I can tell you that I was very very worried after he confirmed my greatest fear.

Hello Robert,

Your post reminds me of one of the greatest Apostles in the bible. Before Paul became an apostle he was a member of the Great Sanhedrin, the supreme court of ancient Israel. While being a part of this sect Paul became the active leader in the furious persecution and extermination of Christianity.

Paul, the great apostle who founded churches throughout Asia and Europe, whose missionary spirit fills the book of Acts, and who wrote much of the New Testament was initially a fanatic Christian killer.

As he made his journey to persecute christians further, on the road to Damascus a light from heaven shined around him. Saul, Saul, (who was called Paul) why persecutest thou me? And Saul said Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick agains the pricks.

This is where your life was like Pauls. Let me explain

Oxen were used to work the soil. The prick or goad was a necessary devise. The prick was usually a wooden shaft with a pointed spike (prick) at one end. The man working the ox would position the goad in such a way as to exert influence and control over the ox. You see, if the ox refused the command indicated by the farmer, the goad would be used to jab or prick the ox. Sometimes the ox would refuse this incentive by kicking out at the prick. As result, the prick would be driven deeper into the flesh of the rebellious animal. The more the animal rebelled, the more the animal suffered. Hence, the statement to Saul: "It is hard for thee to kick against the pricks." (Saul was rebelling against God.)

God possesses total authority (see Matt. 28: 18). God therefore, has the right to "boss" man. God has given man commandments to be obeyed (IJn. 5:3). However, man may elect to disobey God (Josh. 24: 15). When man disobeys, however, man pays. "The way of transgressors is hard," wrote Solomon (Prov. 13: 20). God/man is analogous to the farmer/ox situation. When we disobey God, we hurt ourselves. When we continue to disobey and rebel, we are like the ox – driving the prick in deeper and deeper, hurting ourselves in rebelling against authority!

What ever God has planned for your life until you give up and give in to Him, the issues that you face will continue.

Paul understood this and his reply while trembling and astonished, was "Lord what wilt thou have me to do?"

Robert God is trying to tell you something, how long are you going to kick against the pricks? Give up and give in like Paul and ask Him "Lord what wilt thou have me to do?"​

 

[RobertZ]

Hello Robert,

Your post reminds me of one of the greatest Apostles in the bible. Before Paul became an apostle he was a member of the Great Sanhedrin, the supreme court of ancient Israel. While being a part of this sect Paul became the active leader in the furious persecution and extermination of Christianity.

Paul, the great apostle who founded churches throughout Asia and Europe, whose missionary spirit fills the book of Acts, and who wrote much of the New Testament was initially a fanatic Christian killer.

As he made his journey to persecute christians further, on the road to Damascus a light from heaven shined around him. Saul, Saul, (who was called Paul) why persecutest thou me? And Saul said Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick agains the pricks.

This is where your life was like Pauls. Let me explain

Oxen were used to work the soil. The prick or goad was a necessary devise. The prick was usually a wooden shaft with a pointed spike (prick) at one end. The man working the ox would position the goad in such a way as to exert influence and control over the ox. You see, if the ox refused the command indicated by the farmer, the goad would be used to jab or prick the ox. Sometimes the ox would refuse this incentive by kicking out at the prick. As result, the prick would be driven deeper into the flesh of the rebellious animal. The more the animal rebelled, the more the animal suffered. Hence, the statement to Saul: "It is hard for thee to kick against the pricks." (Saul was rebelling against God.)

God possesses total authority (see Matt. 28: 18). God therefore, has the right to "boss" man. God has given man commandments to be obeyed (IJn. 5:3). However, man may elect to disobey God (Josh. 24: 15). When man disobeys, however, man pays. "The way of transgressors is hard," wrote Solomon (Prov. 13: 20). God/man is analogous to the farmer/ox situation. When we disobey God, we hurt ourselves. When we continue to disobey and rebel, we are like the ox – driving the prick in deeper and deeper, hurting ourselves in rebelling against authority! ​

What ever God has planned for your life until you give up and give in to Him, the issues that you face will continue.​

Paul understood this and his reply while trembling and astonished, was "Lord what wilt thou have me to do?"​

Robert God is trying to tell you something, how long are you going to kick against the pricks? Give up and give in like Paul and ask Him "Lord what wilt thou have me to do?"​

Thanks alexanderjc, that was very encouraging and I took some time to think about what you said. I know im being difficult but I just dont know what to think anymore, sometimes I think their might be hope but most of the time it seems as if Im completely cut off from God.

I remember the times when I was younger God was dealing with me and trying to get me to believe on Jesus, God dealt with me so many times and I never listened. Its like a light switch went off in my head but it happened to late, a person cant just get saved any time that person wishes to get saved.

God has to be dealing with the person trying to save their soul. I wish I had responded when he was calling me.

 

[Jeffwhosoever]

Robert,

I know Proverbs is part of the Bible, and it counts, but you should focus your energy on the New Testament. You are trying to find all the rules that you think you have broken and are sending you to Hell, when it's simply the Grace of God through Faith in Christ that gets you into Heaven. You are feeling the condemnation of sin upon you, but you can't escape that on your own. It is ONLY when you put your trust in the Lord Jesus Christ that you or me or anyone has a way to get into Heaven, and thanks to Jesus that way is 100% guaranteed!

It's hard to imagine after 829 posts that you are not seeking God. In five minutes a post for writing, and 5 minutes for reading responses, you have spent at least 8,290 minutes of your life looking for the ultimate answer to your question, "Am I saved?" I know lots of athiests and agnostics, and you would never find any of them posting more than one or two posts on this forum. Just look at your own statistics!

 

[alexanderjc]

Thanks alexanderjc, that was very encouraging and I took some time to think about what you said. I know im being difficult but I just dont know what to think anymore, sometimes I think their might be hope but most of the time it seems as if Im completely cut off from God.

I remember the times when I was younger God was dealing with me and trying to get me to believe on Jesus, God dealt with me so many times and I never listened. Its like a light switch went off in my head but it happened to late, a person cant just get saved any time that person wishes to get saved.

God has to be dealing with the person trying to save their soul. I wish I had responded when he was calling me.

My Dear Robert how I wish that I could be with you right now to talk with you and usher you to the presence of the Lord. The voice of the Lord is calling you and He will never stop until you are in the grave and then it will be finished.

He has forgiven you but it seems that you haven't forgiven yourself, and there lies our delimma. Robert your Creator loves you and out of all the billions and trillions of people on this planet He saw fit to prick your heart and allow your mind to be in such a quandry so that you could come to this point. If He didn't love you He wouldn't have considered you in His divine Plan of Salvation. You would be just like a man on an island all alone.

Let this go my son and let God help you. If the church that you belong to has failed to give you the spiritual guidance you need then it is time for you to leave that flock and go where the Power of God dwells. Ministers of the Gospel are called, appointed and annointed by God to reach people of all circumstances and through His wisdom and understanding there should be no failure in what God can do for you.

I guarantee this and have the Word of God as my testimony:

Isaiah 55:7 - 11

Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, (Robert) call ye upon him while he is near: Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon (you)him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon (you).

For my thoughts are not your thoughts (Robert), neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways (Robert), and my thoughts than your thoughts. For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:

So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Finally my brother there is no need for you to try to find reasoning for of this, doing so will only keep you from finding your way home. "Let go and Let God"

With all Brotherly Love in Christ Jesus

James

 

[MLEN]

"God has to be dealing with the person trying to save their soul."

Hi Robert,

God is still dealing with you to save your soul. He has not given up on you, and this is evident by the fact that you are even contemplating your eternal destination. If there were no hope for you, you would not even ponder the thought. But quite to the contrary, for you there is hope.

"I wish I had responded when he was calling me."

God is calling you now. Respond to him now. Accept by faith the free gift of salvation that he is offering you. Then believe by faith that you have it and live as if you do by seeking him out daily in prayer and in reading the Word of God. With these weapons of warfare you shall fortify yourself against the attack of the enemy who would have you think otherwise. You will draw close to God and find that safe haven you are seeking for.

I'll be praying for you.