forced sterilization

[skipper]

I want some opinions on a situation I am currently dealing with. Iam a foster parent who adopted 1 of 5 siblings from foster care. After giving up thier rights to 5 children the parents started over again they had a baby girl two years after losing the 5. She had another child in May and it is rummored that she is pregnant again. These children are not in the system yet but it is just a matter of time. When is it time to say enough is enough and you cannot continue to bring children into the world that you are not going to care for.

 

[whitestar]

Hey I agree! Though I will probably be yelled at by other Christians for agreeing...but geesh...the kids are taken due to abuse and neglect? Is it right to allow life that we know will end up suffering? (not talking about abortion either...I am against that). I am not talking about birth control either but the woman having her tubes tied to stop this insanity. I saw a documentary once about a lady hooked on drugs...she also kept having one baby after another cause she couldn't do birth controll...too out of it to remember to take a pill or anything else. All her babies are born addicted and damaged due to the drugs she takes. They tried to get her to at least take an injection to give her birth control for several months but she was complaining she had been 'poked' enough with needles...nevermind what her baby was going to have to endure....geesh...

These kids end up many times with brain damage and other major health problems that they have to live with for life....I thought the judge in that one case had a good idea...you harm the baby inside you are carrying like this...you go to jail. period.

God bless

 

[""]

Hey I agree! Though I will probably be yelled at by other Christians for agreeing...but geesh...the kids are taken due to abuse and neglect?

I'm not sure why a Christian would disagree with you. This couple, and I say couple because it takes two to make babies, sound as if they are very irresponsible. Children aren't toys that you can keep making, after somebody takes your older ones away because you were mistreating them. I would support the idea that he should be sterilized first. If she reaches outside of the marriage and gets pregnant again, then yes, she should also be sterilized. He should be the first one though, simply because it's easier to make him incapable of producing more children, and costs less.

 

[Alarum]

Enough is enough. There has to come a point when you say "doggone it, that's enough." Frankly, we have a responsibility. It's not too hard. We have a responsibility not to kill, not to rape, not to steal, and not to produce children we can't take care of. It's time for her to stop producing kids she doesn't want and can't care for. There are far too many of those in the world.

 

[Lycaenidae]

If you look at the situation from a biological perspective, it's ideal. She gets to pass on her genes, but doesn't have to expend resources to care for the young she already has, so she can just keep producing more and more. Of course she's going to have more children, since we've basically rewarded her by taking her children away. That's not to say I think we should have left the children with her, since she is obviously not a functional human being.

I don't like the idea of forcing a person to get sterilized any more than I like the idea of outlawing abortion. What I do think we can do is offer people the option of a free sterilization, or pay them to get sterilized.

 

[snowydc2003]

I wouldn't force her to be sterilized as that is barbaric and a serious detriment to human rights, however i would insist that she get psychiatric help as there is obviously an underlying reason for her need to procreate.

This woman needs our help and not our judgement.

 

[whitestar]

I'm not sure why a Christian would disagree with you. This couple, and I say couple because it takes two to make babies, sound as if they are very irresponsible. Children aren't toys that you can keep making, after somebody takes your older ones away because you were mistreating them. I would support the idea that he should be sterilized first. If she reaches outside of the marriage and gets pregnant again, then yes, she should also be sterilized. He should be the first one though, simply because it's easier to make him incapable of producing more children, and costs less.

The reason I said that is cause many Christians think that life should come regardless of the situation....they don't believe in any fourm of birth control...and it doesn't matter if they can even afford to have the children or not...they take the verse in Genesis literally ...go forth and mulitiple...

They seem to ingore the fact that many children all over the world strave to death ..children that didn't even have to be conceived in the first place but either due to the lack of birth control or reglious beliefs, thousands upon thousands of children die every day just due to lack of food, health, etc. ...and this doesn't count those that are killed due to civil wars, abused, being sold at work or sex slaves, and so on...they believe that life 'must' happen, not looking at the end results and yes that bothers me greatly. We aren't a bunch of animals that needs to breed like this.

This post hit a nerve with me...so sorry for my soap box here. My sister adopted three children because her and her husband couldn't have their own. Two were from the same family...taken from the state due to severe neglect and abuse. They had different fathers. This 'mother' and I use the term lightly here...has also had numberous children all with different dad....all the 'dad' were abusive. All the kids end up being taken from her yet she continues having more. She is college educated too. Its not like she doesn't know better...she is probably mentally ill.

The state finally got where as soon as a baby was born to her, they took him or her for their own safty. She then moved out of state so she could have a better chance of keeping them...an neglecting them and abusing them.

My sister got these two when they were I think five and six years old...they are SO totally messed up even to this day and they are young adults now, its not funny. They live in a world of their own it seems..both dx with mental illness...have gotten voilent SO many times my sister knows the police officers names. Yes they have been in treatment, on medication..she has done everything she possibly could for them, yet they treat her like dirt...they are a mess!

They have hurt her and our whole family in so many ways...I can't begin to tell you the stories of the damage they have done....at least one of them is dx with RAD..which happens to a baby early on that is not bonded with by a care giver...they develop no trust in this world...they develop no conious of right and wrong...meaning when they do wrong, even knowing its wrong, they are unable to feel bad or guilty about it. lying, stealing, going to jail even, mean nothing to them...they don't care...they only care about what 'they' want...

Its unbelievable the damage that can happen when a baby is still so small that can last a life time...alot of these kids when they get older the dx is changed from RAD to boardline personality disorder...emotionally they are a mess and incapable of ever having a true close relationship with anyone. I would bet our prison are filled with people like this too...

I have alot of anger toward women that just breed and don't care about what happens to their babies. I don't see the state taking the babies as a reward to them though...how are they getting rewarded by losing their children?

 

[Lokisdottir]

Perhaps instead of forced sterilization, the woman could be forced to have an IUD fitted. Today IUDs are extremely reliable (more so than even tubal ligation), and last either 5 or 10 years, depending on the type. After that time has passed, she would undergo psychiatric evaluation to judge whether or not she is fit to have children.

 

[loriersea]

I do not condone forced sterilization in any circumstance. I think that the decision to bear or not bear children is fundamental to our rights as human beings, and that the government has no place interfering in that. Some abuses of the system are going to occur, but I don't think it's right to ever sterilize someone against their will.

 

[Jetgirl]

I want some opinions on a situation I am currently dealing with. Iam a foster parent who adopted 1 of 5 siblings from foster care. After giving up thier rights to 5 children the parents started over again they had a baby girl two years after losing the 5. She had another child in May and it is rummored that she is pregnant again. These children are not in the system yet but it is just a matter of time. When is it time to say enough is enough and you cannot continue to bring children into the world that you are not going to care for.

I particularly liked what that one guy was doing (I don't remember the organization, any links would be appreciated):

Women with crack addictions could receive a large sum (to be used in any way they'd like) to voluntarily be sterilized.

Brilliant! Everyone gets what they want, no one is forced to do anything, no more crack babies come out of those women.

 

[skipper]

You have to pass a test to have a drivers liscence, but you can produce and ruin children then give them away and have another whole batch, children aren't puppies I think they need to go into the hospital and take them as soon as they're born. Iam not saying that everyone should not have the right to have children but someone needs to have the right to say enough is enough.

 

[Jetgirl]

How about this idea:

When a woman has her children taken by the state for neglect, abuse, etc... she is offered a lump sum of funds (to be used in any way) to be sterilized.

After more than three incidents where children have to be removed from the home (not three children, but three incidents) she will be neccesarily sterilized.

Seems fair to me, she just got plenty of chances to ruin children (who will, likely as not, stay ruined) as she sees fit. I think that's a pretty good place for society to put it's foot down.

 

[Lycaenidae]

I particularly liked what that one guy was doing (I don't remember the organization, any links would be appreciated):

Women with crack addictions could receive a large sum (to be used in any way they'd like) to voluntarily be sterilized.

Brilliant! Everyone gets what they want, no one is forced to do anything, no more crack babies come out of those women.

This is a good idea provided that:

1. the sum of money is sufficient (maybe $5000)
2. no group is targeted specifically

 

[Lycaenidae]

How about this idea:

When a woman has her children taken by the state for neglect, abuse, etc... she is offered a lump sum of funds (to be used in any way) to be sterilized.

After more than three incidents where children have to be removed from the home (not three children, but three incidents) she will be neccesarily sterilized.

Seems fair to me, she just got plenty of chances to ruin children (who will, likely as not, stay ruined) as she sees fit. I think that's a pretty good place for society to put it's foot down.

That seems reasonable to me.

 

[whitestar]

Good idea....but the top dogs in charge never ask us for any ideas on how to solve any problems do they? Its doubtful anything like this will really ever happen...meanwhile the state (which is us) gets to pay for the care of these children's needs for the rest of their lives...and few families want to adopt drug babies... (poor little ones, I feel so bad for them). They are now saying on the news that Meth has gotten so bad its even in middle and upper class neighborhoods now and being SO addictive they can't stop...not on their own. They put their children in terrible danger running these meth labs out of their homes...they evenutally get busted and the kids get removed from the home and many have had this drug in their system...meth increases the sex drive so more babies are born with meth in their system and from what they showed on the news these babies are very hard to take care of..they cry constantly, have alot of pain and can be dealing with all sort of disablities the rest of their lives...

Now a drug user can get help and get better and get their kids back...those that neglect and abuse...boy...how many success stories do we hear on that? I don't know... meanwhile the system is being flooded with children from all these types of home and no place to send them. Sad, sad....

 

[skipper]

I completely agree. Except for the children staying ruined my daugter and her
siblings that were removed are doing wonderfully in thier new enviorment. With the right kind of help most of these children are salvagable.

 

[loriersea]

Wow, I guess I'm the only person who finds putting a woman's reproductive capabilities up for sale to be troubling. I certainly could not condone the government giving desperate addicts who are in no condition to give informed consent to anything, much less a procedure that will affect their entire lives, money to feed their habit if they will agree to be sterilized. Instead, we should be providing them with the support they need to enter rehab, turn their lives around, and be reunited with their children, which is what is ultimately in the child's best interest. We certainly should not be financing drug binges on the condition that they hand over their ovaries.

Maybe we could even try giving some of that money to struggling mothers BEFORE they become drug addicts, to prevent that from happening.

 

[Ledifni]

I wouldn't force her to be sterilized as that is barbaric and a serious detriment to human rights,

You know, I hear that a lot. However, I question whether the "right" to have babies is really such a universal thing. Why do you believe it cannot ever be taken away under any circumstances? We take away other "inalienable" rights when we decide criminal activity demands it, so why not this one?

 

[Kroger99]

I do not condone forced sterilization in any circumstance. I think that the decision to bear or not bear children is fundamental to our rights as human beings, and that the government has no place interfering in that. Some abuses of the system are going to occur, but I don't think it's right to ever sterilize someone against their will.

I tend to agree with you on this. I just have a huge problem with the Government forcing anyone to be sterilized. That, to me is just one more step towards total control.

I particularly liked what that one guy was doing (I don't remember the organization, any links would be appreciated):

Women with crack addictions could receive a large sum (to be used in any way they'd like) to voluntarily be sterilized.

Brilliant! Everyone gets what they want, no one is forced to do anything, no more crack babies come out of those women.

This could work, but again...I don't think the Government should be envolved.

 

[knightlight72]

I want some opinions on a situation I am currently dealing with. Iam a foster parent who adopted 1 of 5 siblings from foster care. After giving up thier rights to 5 children the parents started over again they had a baby girl two years after losing the 5. She had another child in May and it is rummored that she is pregnant again. These children are not in the system yet but it is just a matter of time. When is it time to say enough is enough and you cannot continue to bring children into the world that you are not going to care for.

REmember the movie Minority Report? Where they would arrest someone before they even committed a crime? We cannot judge someone before the crime has happened. As much as it may seem that they are not good parents, what if they become good parents? With Jesus no one is without hope. These parents may see Jesus in a day, week, a year, a decade. Ultimately, they always have a chance of bettering themselves through Jesus.

They are having babies for a reason. Only God gives children to us. It is His gift, and ultimately, we don't have any say in it. So respctfully, we have no say in this. We can deal with it, if the parents can't handle it.