• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

For those who have left the Roman Catholic Church

Status
Not open for further replies.

The Liturgist

Traditional Liturgical Christian
Site Supporter
Nov 26, 2019
15,631
8,242
50
The Wild West
✟764,626.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Generic Orthodox Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
Ok, and there are plenty of highly credentialed scholars on all sides of the various theological divides, of course-and I'm admittedly not one of them. In any case I believe a study of historical church understanding and teachings is one of the most valuable undertakings anyone can embark upon.

I agree with this wholeheartedly, and I believe it supports traditional liturgical Christianity, although I don’t think there is enough evidence from historical study alone to say which church (nor is there enough evidence to definitely exclude any of the ancient churches, although we can identify doctrines that are of relatively recent origin, and some churches such as the RCC believe in doctrinal development, and others such as the Orthodox do not, which has been a minor but not insurmountable sticking point in ecumenical discussions, since the Orthodox do concede that the expression of doctrine can and does develop, for example, it was the heresy of Arius that neccessitated the Nicene Creed and the proliferation of heretical apocrypha falsely claiming Apostolic provenance, such as the Acts of Thomas, or the Infancy Gospel of Thomas (poor St. Thomas, everyone was impersonating him - indeed Mani, the Persian heresiarch, named his disciple who he sent to Syria to spread his false religion there Thomas to appeal to the locals due to their devotion to that Apostle, while naming those sent to Egypt and India Hermes and Buddha respectively, based on the presumed popularity of the Hermetic religion in Egypt and the Buddhist faith in India in the third century AD. Ironically both of those Pagan religions would in the following centuries disappear from those lands; Buddhism vanished from India until its recent reintroduction, where it has been popularized under the Dalits, who would have been regarded by Siddharta Guatama as untouchables, at least in his youth, and as for Hellenic and Egyptian Paganism, they are, like the Manichaen religion itself, gone from Egypt, with only Christianity and a religion regarded by St. John of Damascus as a heretical offshoot of Christianity, the Islamic faith, remaining. The only trace of Mani’s religion remaining consists of a couple of apparently Buddhist temples in China which were originally secretly Manichaean, with subtle differences from a normal Buddhist temple such as the expression on the face and certain other references to Mani; this dissimulation was widely practiced by minority religions in the East and differs from the martyrdom-seeking behavior of Christians.
 
Upvote 0

mourningdove~

"Pray, and prepare ..."
Site Supporter
Dec 24, 2005
10,860
4,142
✟696,501.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
I think maybe a reminder might be helpful here?
This thread is addressed to "those who have left the Roman Catholic Church".

As I understand it, this is not a thread for debating with Catholics as to whether or not one should leave the RCC, whether the RCC is 'the one true church', whether those who have left should return, etc.

What I understand the purpose of this thread to be ... from the thread title and opening post ... is a place "For those who have left the RCC" to discuss their experiences after having left it. (And if I am wrong about this, the OP can correct me.)

I hope to hear more from those persons who have left, if they're comfortable sharing their experiences.

Granted, it is a sensitive topic to discuss when Catholics members are known to be within 'range' ... and the OP has requested that there be no Catholic 'bashing' ... but fact is, there IS life after leaving the RCC. I personally know many folks who have left and gone on to live very fruitful and productive lives for the Lord in their new spiritual 'destination'. It's those folks I'd like to hear from, and why I chose to participate in this thread, if any of those are around.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: PloverWing
Upvote 0

mourningdove~

"Pray, and prepare ..."
Site Supporter
Dec 24, 2005
10,860
4,142
✟696,501.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
More fallout from a poorly catechetized generation. So sad.

What is sad to me is when a Catholic won't allow others to make a decision to leave the RCC without accusing them of doing so because they are ignorant.

I'd remind you that this is a thread 'for those who have left the RCC' and not a thread for Catholics to falsely accuse those who have left.

Thank you.
 
Upvote 0

concretecamper

I stand with Candice.
Nov 23, 2013
7,360
2,865
PA
✟333,878.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
What is sad to me is when a Catholic won't allow others to make a decision to leave the RCC without accusing them of doing so because they are ignorant.
False accusation. It isn't up to me to allow or disallow anyone from making a decision.
I'd remind you that this is a thread 'for those who have left the RCC' and not a thread for Catholics to falsely accuse those who have left.
I didn't accuse anyone. And you don't get to decide who posts what where.
 
Upvote 0

mourningdove~

"Pray, and prepare ..."
Site Supporter
Dec 24, 2005
10,860
4,142
✟696,501.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
Without bashing or tearing down the RCC - what difference have you experienced since you left.

With me - the biggest is the intimacy with Christ.

Thoughts?
Lol ... I am wondering why it is so hard to have a thread ... one single little thread ... lol ... where the feedback and opinions of Catholics who have not left the RCC are not welcome, but they keep coming anyway!
:scratch:

I'm not looking for you to provide a reason for this, but I do find the situation to be quite interesting!
 
Upvote 0

mourningdove~

"Pray, and prepare ..."
Site Supporter
Dec 24, 2005
10,860
4,142
✟696,501.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
I didn't accuse anyone. And you don't get to decide who posts what where.
Did you even read the title of this thread?
Did you even read the opening post?

Do you not feel unwelcome here, after reading those things?
Do you not see it as being uncharitable, to not allow others to freely discuss their topics without disruption?

No, I didn't decide who was invited to post in this thread. The OP did.
 
Upvote 0

concretecamper

I stand with Candice.
Nov 23, 2013
7,360
2,865
PA
✟333,878.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Did you even read the title of this thread?
Did you even read the opening post?
I did
Do you not see it as being uncharitable, to not allow others to freely discuss their topics without disruption?
I didn't disrupt anything. In fact, your continuing these actions is disruptive.
No, I didn't decide who was invited to post in this thread. The OP did.
I am free to lament the poor catechesis of a generation if I want to.
 
Upvote 0

Always in His Presence

Jesus is the only Way
Site Supporter
Nov 15, 2006
49,767
17,942
Broken Arrow, OK
✟1,047,963.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
More fallout from a poorly catechetized generation. So sad.
Not sure how that fits with me personally - could be correct - but that isn't what the thread is about.

Please keep on topic one and all.
 
Upvote 0

Always in His Presence

Jesus is the only Way
Site Supporter
Nov 15, 2006
49,767
17,942
Broken Arrow, OK
✟1,047,963.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I might have joined the RCC as I was considering it when two things happened that caused me to become Orthodox when my traditionalist friend Fr. Steven retired from the Episcopal Church, namely, the unexpected retirement of Pope Benedict XVI, memory eternal, and the abduction of the Syriac Orthodox Archbishop and the Antiochian Orthodox Metropolitan of Aleppo while the two were riding back from Lebanon in a car. I had always been fascinated with Orthodoxy, and had grieved for the Serbian Orthodox and Allbanian Orthodox Christians in Kosovo who were persecuted over a decade previously, and during the siege of the Church of the Nativity in 2002 I was greatly upset, and in my youth the Soviet Union and its repression of Orthodox and other Christians was very much in my mind, and the subsequent suffering of those same Christians in the economic collapse that followed the political collapse of the Soviet regime.

But I think Orthodox Catholic - Roman Catholic reconciliation is extremely important, although first I believe that the reunification of the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox, which is in progress, but naturally takes a long time and is not helped by the inaccurate information about the OOs posted by schismatic Old Calendarists on sites like orthodoxinfo.com (they are unaware that ancient Monophysitism is extinct, and the beliefs of the Oriental Orthodox as demonstrated through their worship is the same as ours, indeed, the hymn Ho Monogenes was most likely written by St. Severus of Antioch and added to the liturgy by Emperor Justinian, who married a Syriac Orthodox woman, St. Theodora, venerated in both communions (the Eastern Orthodox venerate her for her piety and the Oriental Orthodox venerate her for advising St. Jacob bar Addai that the Imperial authorities were arresting and perhaps executing all of the Miaphysite bishops of Antioch, of whom he alone survived or remained free, and ordained hundreds of bishops acting sola, which is allowed in emergency conditions, which made it impossible for the Syriac church to be decapitated. The belief that St. Athanasius wrote Ho Monogenes is most likely of Armenian origin, as the Armenians rival the Copts and Ethiopians for their veneration of St. Athanasius, and had a schism with the Syriac Orthodox and apparently are the only Oriental Orthodox church where St. Severus is not widely venerated (and was for a time regarded as heterodox).

However, it seems possible that Roman Catholic - Assyrian, or rather I should say Chaldean Catholic - Assyrian relations could begin sooner; an initial advance was rebuffed by the Holy Synod of the Assyrian Church of the East because of concerns that it would mean the end of their autocephalous status, which they have enjoyed de facto since the evangelization of the Ephesus to Kerala, India trade route by Saints Thomas, Addai and Mari in the first century (as an autonomous church under the Patriarch of Antioch, and later as a fully independent and autocephalous church responsible for all territories beyond the Eastern border of the Roman Empire, streching to Socotra off the coast of Yemen in the Southwest, Urmia and Merv in the Northwest, and to Mongolia in the Northeast, and Tibet in the Southeast, with major population centers in the Nineveh Plains, Seleucia-Cstesiphon, near Old Babylon and modern day Baghdad, and Kerala. Indeed the Chaldean Catholics are members of an Assyrian tribe, the Chaldinaya, Arabic speaking Assyrians chiefly in the city of Baghdad.

Thus we have the question of preserving the autocephalous status our churches are assured under Canons 6 and 7 of the Council of Nicaea in the case of Alexandria, Antioch and Jerusalem, and other canons in the case of Cyprus and constantinople, and by extension, all other autocephalous churches (since if Alexandria, Antioch, Jerusalem and Constantinople have the same authority as Rome in their jurisidictions, that includes the authority to organize new autonomous and autocephalous churches, although lately the current Greek Orthodox Archbishop of North America became notorious as Metropolitan of Bursa (which under his tenure went from an actual Metropolis with one church to a titular Metropolis with no churches, which is unfortunate since Bursa is approximately where Chalcedon was, and there were 15 or so members at the remaining Orthodox church there), by claiming that only the Ecumenical Patriarchate has the power to grant, and even more controversly, to revoke, autocephaly (indeed the controversial tomos of autocephaly granted to the OCU in 2018 appears to give the EP this ability), but it is the case that Constantinople refuses to recognize the autocephalous status of the Orthodox Church in America, despite the OCA having been granted autocephaly in 1970 by the MP.

There is also the important question of the liturgy - from an Orthodox perspective the Novus Ordo Missae comes across as being a bit too close to the liturgies of the mainline churches, often lacking the elements of the ars celebrandi which some dismiss as “bells and smells” which characterize the Traditional Latin Mass and contibute so much to the liturgical beauty of the Orthodox churches and indeed most of the Eastern Rite Catholics, with the exception of the Maronites and some of the Mar Thoma churches (indeed I have even seen celebration versus populum in a Chaldean Catholic church, which would not be something the Assyrians would want to see). Among Byzantine Rite Catholics, paradoxically, in North America the Ukrainian Greek Catholics have liturgy that is less Latinized and in some cases closer to the Ukrainian Orthodox liturgy of the UOC and the UOC-KP than the worship of the OCU, which has adopted the Byzantine style phelonion (a cope-like chasuble) instead of the high-cut Athonite phelonions traditionally used in Ukraine (one of the three main varieties, along with the Athonite phelonion used on Mount Athos and in Russia, Belarus, the Church of Finland (also under the EP) and the Slavonic parishes of the OCA, and the Byzantine Phelonion which lacks the raised collar and is draped over the shoulders like the Western cope, the Gothic-style chasuble or the Syriac Orthodox phayno (and its Maronite equivalent).

I agree with this wholeheartedly, and I believe it supports traditional liturgical Christianity, although I don’t think there is enough evidence from historical study alone to say which church (nor is there enough evidence to definitely exclude any of the ancient churches, although we can identify doctrines that are of relatively recent origin, and some churches such as the RCC believe in doctrinal development, and others such as the Orthodox do not, which has been a minor but not insurmountable sticking point in ecumenical discussions, since the Orthodox do concede that the expression of doctrine can and does develop, for example, it was the heresy of Arius that neccessitated the Nicene Creed and the proliferation of heretical apocrypha falsely claiming Apostolic provenance, such as the Acts of Thomas, or the Infancy Gospel of Thomas (poor St. Thomas, everyone was impersonating him - indeed Mani, the Persian heresiarch, named his disciple who he sent to Syria to spread his false religion there Thomas to appeal to the locals due to their devotion to that Apostle, while naming those sent to Egypt and India Hermes and Buddha respectively, based on the presumed popularity of the Hermetic religion in Egypt and the Buddhist faith in India in the third century AD. Ironically both of those Pagan religions would in the following centuries disappear from those lands; Buddhism vanished from India until its recent reintroduction, where it has been popularized under the Dalits, who would have been regarded by Siddharta Guatama as untouchables, at least in his youth, and as for Hellenic and Egyptian Paganism, they are, like the Manichaen religion itself, gone from Egypt, with only Christianity and a religion regarded by St. John of Damascus as a heretical offshoot of Christianity, the Islamic faith, remaining. The only trace of Mani’s religion remaining consists of a couple of apparently Buddhist temples in China which were originally secretly Manichaean, with subtle differences from a normal Buddhist temple such as the expression on the face and certain other references to Mani; this dissimulation was widely practiced by minority religions in the East and differs from the martyrdom-seeking behavior of Christians.
I read both dissertations -

What one earth do either of them have to do with the topic of the thread???
 
Upvote 0

Always in His Presence

Jesus is the only Way
Site Supporter
Nov 15, 2006
49,767
17,942
Broken Arrow, OK
✟1,047,963.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
The biggest difference I have found (my personal observation) is that my faith went from an institutionalized form, complete with pre written prayers and structure to just about everything - to a one on one relationship with Jesus. I've experience intimacy with Him daily.
 
Upvote 0

NBB

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 19, 2013
3,994
1,874
46
Uruguay
✟647,009.00
Country
Uruguay
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
My mom and grandmother were lets say catholics by tradition, my mom after dad divorced her, was destroyed, some woman started preaching her that Jesus could help, and introducer her to sort of a pentecostal view.

Let's just say having the Holy spirit and the presence of God like some pentecostals seek, is everything in life, and you are not going to find that on the RCC.

I know there is much slander against pentecostals, which i think it has to be expected since where God doing things the enemy is going to throw everything at them, i also i am aware, that anyone can call themselves pentecostals, and there is bad people out there, which can be tricky for others to discern if something is good or not.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: johansen
Upvote 0

DragonFox91

Well-Known Member
Dec 20, 2020
6,244
3,818
33
Grand Rapids MI
✟279,056.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
This is an interesting thread. I'm surprised we don't see more 'why I left XXX denomination' threads. That makes me a little curious sometimes b/c there's so many bad churches & denominations out there, including Rome. I grew up in a bad church, & you don't realize that there's actually good ones out there, you just think they are all bad. It's exactly like if you grow up in a cult. You don't know otherwise until you are rescued from it.

OP, I'm just curious, was your family Roman Catholic? How challlenging was that?
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

PloverWing

Episcopalian
May 5, 2012
5,169
6,151
New Jersey
✟406,006.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
This is an interesting thread. I'm surprised we don't see more 'why I left XXX denomination' threads. That makes me a little curious sometimes b/c there's so many bad churches & denominations out there, including Rome.

I think that that family of threads could be interesting, as long as it doesn't turn into bashing of XXX denominations (for the various XXXs).

Doctrinal truth is important, but I think much of the picture is that various denominations, or even various congregations within denominations, are a better/worse fit for different individuals. Some people thrive on liturgy, while others find it stifling. Some people thrive on long sermons, while others find them a chore. And so on. As we speak the truth of the gospel, it's good if we can speak in ways that people can hear, and that's different for different hearers.

In this thread, we're hearing from previously-Catholic folks who found that they heard the gospel more clearly in the language of another church.

A different thread might invite the stories of those who moved in the opposite direction, people raised in Protestant traditions who joined the Catholic church, because that's where they heard the voice of God most clearly.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DragonFox91
Upvote 0

Valletta

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2020
12,379
5,888
Minnesota
✟330,426.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Let's just say having the Holy spirit and the presence of God like some pentecostals seek, is everything in life, and you are not going to find that on the RCC.
When I left the Catholic Church as a teenager I was totally disconnected and had no idea what I was missing. Now it is hard to imagine how anyone who does not unite themselves with Jesus in the Holy Eucharist can have a more intimate relationship with God.
 
Upvote 0

concretecamper

I stand with Candice.
Nov 23, 2013
7,360
2,865
PA
✟333,878.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
When I left the Catholic Church as a teenager I was totally disconnected and had no idea what I was missing. Now it is hard to imagine how anyone who does not unite themselves with Jesus in the Holy Eucharist can have a more intimate relationship with God.
John 6:57 He that eateth my flesh and drinketh my blood abideth in me: and I in him.
 
  • Winner
Reactions: Valletta
Upvote 0

mourningdove~

"Pray, and prepare ..."
Site Supporter
Dec 24, 2005
10,860
4,142
✟696,501.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
Doctrinal truth is important, but I think much of the picture is that various denominations, or even various congregations within denominations, are a better/worse fit for different individuals. Some people thrive on liturgy, while others find it stifling. Some people thrive on long sermons, while others find them a chore. And so on. As we speak the truth of the gospel, it's good if we can speak in ways that people can hear, and that's different for different hearers.

In this thread, we're hearing from previously-Catholic folks who found that they heard the gospel more clearly in the language of another church.
Beautifully put.
 
  • Like
Reactions: PloverWing
Upvote 0

mourningdove~

"Pray, and prepare ..."
Site Supporter
Dec 24, 2005
10,860
4,142
✟696,501.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
When I think of intimacy with Christ, I think about the instruction we are given in the Word to 'walk in the Spirit'.

But if a believer doesn't understand their new identity in Christ ... spirit, soul, and body ... and doesn't know the Word of God and His promises to us ... it is very hard to follow that command without continually attempting to do so in the flesh, and continually missing the mark.

I learned about the rules in Catholicism, but I learned about the Holy Spirit, and how to walk in the Spirit, within Protestantism.
 
Upvote 0

Always in His Presence

Jesus is the only Way
Site Supporter
Nov 15, 2006
49,767
17,942
Broken Arrow, OK
✟1,047,963.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I was raised in as traditional Roman Catholic as I think you could get.

My father was a seminary graduate, spoke Latin and German - could read Hebrew. The only reason he didn't become a priest is that he fell in love with my mother. I went to a Catholic school through most of my elementary and high school life I can still sing Latin and understand the Latin masses.

OP, I'm just curious, was your family Roman Catholic? How challenging was that?
it was very challenging with certain family members
 
  • Informative
Reactions: DragonFox91
Upvote 0

Xeno.of.athens

I will give you the keys of the Kingdom of heaven.
May 18, 2022
7,435
2,364
Perth
✟202,038.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
I tried going back to the Roman Catholic church because it was my roots, but it was lifeless to me. I found an Assemblies of God Church and WOW! What a difference. Fast forward 40 years and I am an Ordained minister - Assemblies of God pastor and I minister in Europe and the Middle East, training ministers.

Without bashing or tearing down the RCC - what difference have you experienced since you left.

With me - the biggest is the intimacy with Christ.

Thoughts?
I think your claims didn't manage to avoid bashing the Catholic Church because they call it lifeless and allege, by implication, that Catholics have no intimacy with Jesus Christ.
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.