Focus on the Family.

[imind]

Can you tell us why you think that? I would be interested to know. Thanks.

abstinence only sex-edu
the lottery
civil unions
'judicial activism'
evolution
spongebob
stem cell research


they are so full of nonsense its unbelievable. here is an example...

Jeremy was a typical teenager with baggy jeans, an appetite like a horse and a "‘tude" the size of New Hampshire. Or at least that’s what his parents thought. But more and more, they began to see how different he was from other teenage boys they knew. Ever since he started junior high school, Jeremy felt like he didn’t fit in. It seemed like most of the guys in his class were only interested in sports. Jeremy was interested in music. He was shorter and skinnier than many of the boys in his gym class—a glaring fact that caused him to feel self-conscious. Most of his friends were girls. For some reason, he felt he could relate to them more easily.

But he never realized how different he was until the first time someone called him “queer.” It was like a devastating gunshot wound to his heart. And when others joined in and added the title “[bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]” to the insults, Jeremy was humiliated beyond words. By the time he reached high school, he was basically considered an outcast. He couldn’t communicate his fears to his dad—in fact, Jeremy couldn’t relate to him at all. So, slowly, he found himself in a world with no male companions or acceptance from men. Soon, Jeremy began to crave attention from guys and even fantasize what it could be like if a boy really liked him.

this boy was turned gay because others called him names. yup, thats how it happens.

If no one fights for our rights as Christians, we will lose them.

what rights, exactly, will christians lose that nobody else will? absurd.

 

[GraceLikeRainFallsDown]

I don't believe any value that we assign to be Godly and being Christian should EVER have to be 'fought' for. If we Christians recognize them as values, and they are blessed by God, we will always have them. To me, the idea of 'fighting' for values kinda reminds me of how Judas wanted Jesus to fight the Roman authority. But that isn't how Jesus works.

/QUOTE]

What about the issue of abortion? Do you not think it OK to fight for the unborn child who cannot fight for themselves? Especially the partial birth abortions where the baby is partially born and then killed. I do not care what anyone says, I believe that baby feels pain.

Or what about the right to pray in public schools. We still have this right, but what if they wanted to take it away. Would it be worth writing a letter about?

What about our right to read a Bible publicly? Of course we still have this right also and I could never imagine not having it, but there are countries today that do not allow this.

How about worshipping the Lord publicly? Not worth fighting for?

I think we are to submit to the laws of the land. But, I also think the land will be a better place with Christian people influencing those laws.

This is just my opinion. I respect your right to disagree.

 

[helenofbritain]

Is FOTF a lobby group? I'm guessing so. Are they only in America? It seems that way.

Knowing nothing about them, I would observe that most people probably rate how they feel about FOTF based on the number of issue that are important to them the FOTF stands for.

So if you don't care about "traditional family values" you probably won't have much time for FOTF.

I would be wary of organisations that exaggerate situations to get the sympathy vote though. If you can't make your point telling the truth, then I don't want to be a part of your "truth".

as-salaam-alaikum!

 

[GraceLikeRainFallsDown]

Is FOTF a lobby group?

I would not consider them an lobby group. Actually they are a non-profit Christian organization. I do not know if they are outside of the U.S. I would assume no.

They do have another organization, Focus on the Family Action which is a separate legal entity that is not non-profit that is more of what I would consider a lobby group. They created the Action group so that there non-profit status would not be harmed for the FOTF organization. They fight for "traditional family values" as you stated.

 

[GraceLikeRainFallsDown]

I would be wary of organisations that exaggerate situations to get the sympathy vote though. If you can't make your point telling the truth, then I don't want to be a part of your "truth".

Agree

 

[TheDag]

Is FOTF a lobby group? I'm guessing so. Are they only in America? It seems that way.

They are in Australia as well. I can't recall the website although shouldn't be too hard to google. They aren't as big in Oz as America of course.

I would be wary of organisations that exaggerate situations to get the sympathy vote though. If you can't make your point telling the truth, then I don't want to be a part of your "truth".

and that is my issue with them. I have found they have not done their research to find out facts but rather just repeat what they have been told. As I have said before though they do good work as well. I just have high standards when it comes to integrity.

 

[churchrat]

this boy was turned gay because others called him names. yup, thats how it happens.

I won't make a debate of this, but rather just give a quick reply:

If you reinforce in a child that they're good, smart kids, they are more likely to be so. On the other hand, a child who's always told that they're naughty, stupid, etc will probably be exactly who they're told they are.

Of course, if you believe that homosexuality is a genetic quirk rather than a sinful tendency (Why did God 'make' some people attracted to the same sex? For the same reason he allows others to be tempted by lying, stealing, promiscuity, etc...), then this is probably apples and oranges to you.

 

[paladin_carvin]

I don't believe any value that we assign to be Godly and being Christian should EVER have to be 'fought' for. If we Christians recognize them as values, and they are blessed by God, we will always have them. To me, the idea of 'fighting' for values kinda reminds me of how Judas wanted Jesus to fight the Roman authority. But that isn't how Jesus works.

/QUOTE]

What about the issue of abortion? Do you not think it OK to fight for the unborn child who cannot fight for themselves? Especially the partial birth abortions where the baby is partially born and then killed. I do not care what anyone says, I believe that baby feels pain.

Or what about the right to pray in public schools. We still have this right, but what if they wanted to take it away. Would it be worth writing a letter about?

What about our right to read a Bible publicly? Of course we still have this right also and I could never imagine not having it, but there are countries today that do not allow this.

How about worshipping the Lord publicly? Not worth fighting for?

I think we are to submit to the laws of the land. But, I also think the land will be a better place with Christian people influencing those laws.

This is just my opinion. I respect your right to disagree.

I don't think we will be losing our rights to read the Bible publicly or worshiping the lord publicly. These are protected by the constitution. Even still, they didn't have these in ancient Greece in the 'Bible times', and we seem to think they were the epitome of Christian church, so they must have managed without it.

As for the 'right to pray in public school' I did so every day in high school, I was even in a prayer group. This is a misconception that this was a horrible thing. What they got rid of was making everyone pray in school. It's not like when some kid says grace at lunch, some teacher comes over and expells him.

As for abortion, I am against it, but I don't believe it's a religious issue. I've seen some compelling arguements FOR abortion using the Bible, and I don't find the small handful of verses against it to be all that convincing. I find abortion to be a moral issue backed by scientific reasoning, nothing else.

 

[imind]

Or what about the right to pray in public schools. We still have this right, but what if they wanted to take it away. Would it be worth writing a letter about?

What about our right to read a Bible publicly? Of course we still have this right also and I could never imagine not having it, but there are countries today that do not allow this.

How about worshipping the Lord publicly? Not worth fighting for?

the aclu has done more to ensure these rights will not be lost than fotf can ever dream of doing. the difference is that the aclu doesn't lie in their presentation.

If you reinforce in a child that they're good, smart kids, they are more likely to be so. On the other hand, a child who's always told that they're naughty, stupid, etc will probably be exactly who they're told they are.

you could never convince someone to be attracted to and to enjoy sexual relations with the sex they are not inherently attracted to. it just doesn't work like that.

I would be wary of organisations that exaggerate situations to get the sympathy vote though. If you can't make your point telling the truth, then I don't want to be a part of your "truth".

bingo.

 

[TheDag]

you could never convince someone to be attracted to and to enjoy sexual relations with the sex they are not inherently attracted to. it just doesn't work like that.

This statement makes me feel sorry for bi-sexuals. If they are only supposed to marry one person then how do they decide which "natural attraction" to follow? I do belioeve it is possible to convince someone they are attracted to something different. After all we tell kids all the time that boys don't cry or you have to like talking about cars or if you like drama then your a pansy. I could list so many more examples of where we make things tough for boys by making stupid statements like the above. So when a boy doesn't enjoy typical macho things what is he supposed to think when it is perfectly acceptable for gay people to enjoy those same things. Let's not kid ourselves that these stereotypes aren't reinforced by christians either. Untill those stereotypes are gotten rid of then these problems will occour.

 

[FireQuest]

From what I've seen and heard, I think they are a good ministry. Is there room for improvement? Sure, but that goes for ALL ministries and people!

 

[GraceLikeRainFallsDown]

the aclu has done more to ensure these rights will not be lost than fotf can ever dream of doing. the difference is that the aclu doesn't lie in their presentation.

I am glad to know the ACLU takes some worth while cases.

It is only a good thing to have more than one organization fighting for our rights. I think even the ACLU might agree that FOTF has a right to support legislation they agree with and speak out against things they do not agree with.

I do not know of any lies. There may be differences of opinion, but I do not think FOTF knowingly lies in their presentation. I would like evidence of this accusation.

As was already stated, no organization is perfect since the people that run it are not perfect.

 

[paladin_carvin]

This statement makes me feel sorry for bi-sexuals. If they are only supposed to marry one person then how do they decide which "natural attraction" to follow? I do belioeve it is possible to convince someone they are attracted to something different. After all we tell kids all the time that boys don't cry or you have to like talking about cars or if you like drama then your a pansy. I could list so many more examples of where we make things tough for boys by making stupid statements like the above. So when a boy doesn't enjoy typical macho things what is he supposed to think when it is perfectly acceptable for gay people to enjoy those same things. Let's not kid ourselves that these stereotypes aren't reinforced by christians either. Untill those stereotypes are gotten rid of then these problems will occour.

Uhh... I don't know if I'm missing your point, but it's not that hard. We just don't decide which 'natural attraction' to follow, we lead with both. That's like saying to someone attracted to both white and african girls 'You have to decide one or the other'. In reality, you just let life come to you, hoping to find someone in either group, and when you find someone, you concentrate on loving that person, forsaking all others.

A person can be attracted to a sex opposite their dominate- it happens all the time. How do you think those nutball Christians who 'change' do it? They don't change, they just unblock the thinking to the opposite gender and do their best to deny their dominate feelings. Of course, this is often destructive and hurtful, and filled with constant feelings of self-hate and worthlessness as continual failure is not easy to deal with, and I think no one should have to go with that- but it IS possible.

 

[carrymeaway06]

I don't have time to read the whole thread. But so far I've found NOTHING wrong with "Focusing" on the family... seriously, the concepts are awesome and the people I've talked to from FOTF were inspirational

 

[romanov]

How do you think those nutball Christians who 'change' do it?

This kind of langauge is really not needed. Would you label every man who tried to bed as many women as possible a "nutball Christian" for denying their domonate feelings and cleaving to one wife? Some of those folks and maybe most of those folks could be very happy with their new life. It is unjust to label them anything other than peole who are trying to follow G_D"s word as they see it.

 

[TOsteve]

From my what I’ve seen FOTF has provided many helpful ministry tools for Christians over the years – especially in the areas of pastoral care. That’s certainly not to say that I agree with or support everything they’ve published.

But for me, the biggest caution flag that goes up when talking about FOTF is the political direction that Dobson is steering the ship. From my earliest awareness of this organization they have always had dalliances with the quest for political influence, but over the years those dalliances seem to have turned into all consuming love affairs – which in my opinion, is to the detriment of their credibility. I don’t say this simply because I don’t like their politics (which for the most part, I don’t) but more because history has given us a long list of examples why political power and the church make for strange bedfellows.

 

[paladin_carvin]

I don't have time to read the whole thread. But so far I've found NOTHING wrong with "Focusing" on the family... seriously, the concepts are awesome and the people I've talked to from FOTF were inspirational

I've listened to some of this stuff, my dad would play it sometimes if it was on. I found it pretentious at best... we'd discuss it a bit, and basicly come to the conclusion it was drivel... Hey- it did cause bonding! (seriously, I wasn't making this point when I started typing) Maybe I should reconsider my point...

This kind of langauge is really not needed. Would you label every man who tried to bed as many women as possible a "nutball Christian" for denying their domonate feelings and cleaving to one wife? Some of those folks and maybe most of those folks could be very happy with their new life. It is unjust to label them anything other than peole who are trying to follow G_D"s word as they see it.

I don't know what man trying to bed with women has to do with a point on homosexuality... but- point taken. It is unfair to say that. I suppose it's a bit out of bitterness, since it seems that a very tiny fraction of a minority of a minority 'change', and it seems to convince a lot of people that know nothing about the subject that they anyone can do this 'change'. But- I it IS unfair. Certainly, even if I don't think it is wrong- giving up anything for the sake of being closer to God should not be frowned on. Thank you for pointing out my error. I shall work on this.

 

[romanov]

I don't know what man trying to bed with women has to do with a point on homosexuality... but- point taken. It is unfair to say that. I suppose it's a bit out of bitterness, since it seems that a very tiny fraction of a minority of a minority 'change', and it seems to convince a lot of people that know nothing about the subject that they anyone can do this 'change'. But- I it IS unfair. Certainly, even if I don't think it is wrong- giving up anything for the sake of being closer to God should not be frowned on. Thank you for pointing out my error. I shall work on this.

Thank you for your integrity.

 

[jak]

About nor researching enough... I remember in one of his earlier books, Dr. Dobson confessed that he had pre-judged Dr. Benjamain Spock (the issue was spanking) without actually reading or understanding his exact position, and written some stuff against him, too. When he finally did understand Spock's exact position, he realised he'd been really unfair to him, and he apologised, in print, which made my opinion of him rise.

My present issue with FOTF is that they take a very hard line "man is the head of the family, and men have authority in church" position. I think there's (a lot! of) room for being more open on the issue.

 

[TracerBullet]

I have often been disturbed by FOTF’s pro-discrimination policy and the almost constant use of false witness to further that agenda.