Florida vs. Disney...even if the bill passes, will anything come of it?

[ThatRobGuy]

Disney to Lose Special Tax Status in Florida Amid ‘Don’t Say Gay’ Clash


An interesting exchange I found on the topic...

Michael Knowles (a staunch conservative from the Daily Wire) had Chris Hahn (one of his rivals, and a staunch progressive) on his show to have a conversation about it.

I thought it was actually a pretty interesting exchange

...and Chris Hahn made some excellent points about some of the challenges and financial pitfalls the state of Florida will face even if the bill gets implemented with regards to reincorporating the "Reedy Creek Improvement District" into Florida.

It's 15 mins and worth a listen.

 

[The Liturgist]

Well realistically just increased compliance and regulatory costs for Walt Disney World, and the requirement to obtain planning permission from Orange and Osceola Counties.

The reason for the original legislation was to facility Walt Disney’s project of building EPCOT, not the amusement park we know today, but an Experimental Prototype Community Of Tomorrow, which was originally planned as an actual city with its own airport, police force, city government, and nuclear power plant. The Reedy Creek Improvement District which the 1960s legislation created gives Disney vast powers which clearly they have no intention of exercising, because the ideology of EPCOT is anathema to their current Woke cultural values and open disdain for the particular brand of patriotism espoused by Walt Disney, who was a great Christian by the way, a fact Disney has tried very hard to obscure for many years, and who was also politically conservative, another fact they try even harder to obscure.

For those interested, here is a video showing Walt Disney’s plans for EPCOT circa 1966. Note the express provision of spaces for churches, which are notably absent from WDW today.

While he was dying of lung cancer (he had begun chain smoking while serving in France as a Red Cross ambulance driver after WWI in 1919), Walt Disney continued to work on plans for EPCOT, with maps of the project pasted above his hospital bed.

 

[now faith]

For years now, I have found the agenda of the Disney corporation, contrary to family values.
The ambiguity of the symbolism in their toys, movies, and now stepping into the political arena to support a corrupt agenda.
We cannot help to wonder who the Disney people really are.
I will say it.....
They are now trying to support, and legitimize pedophiles teaching our children.
Its just wrong.
Its time for a Governor to make a stand, rather than trying to please everyone.
Ron DeSantis has done a great job, at every point of opposition that would cause harm to the Children, Elderly, and working people of Florida.
He uses common sense, and that is a rare commodity in politics today.
His resume is something to look at, personally I would like to see Him in the White House in 2024.

 

[Fantine]

It basically comes down to a company exercising its First Amendment rights and being punished for it.

Disney has lots of theme parks--in Asia, Europe, California--and lots of ways it can spend money. They may choose to stop developing in what they deem a hostile governmental environment, and I wouldn't blame them.

Isn't what Florida has passed basically the same as when Venezuela "nationalized" the oil industry? Florida was delighted for Disney to build all its own infrastructure when it couldn't afford to, and now it wants to operate all that infrastructure and reap the financial rewards from doing so.

I am not wholeheartedly a Disney supporter, but I don't think their making a public comment about controversial governmental policies deserves such an extreme response.

Businesses are fighting back. They have relocated huge sporting events with huge revenues, and I believe they also pulled some film projects out of Atlanta.

I don't live that far from Branson where there was some Disney buzz several years ago. If they stop expanding Florida and show some love to Branson, I'll be thrilled.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

Making big corporations pay their fair share in taxes - one of the traditional goals of the Democratic Party.

 

[The Liturgist]

Disney has lots of theme parks--in Asia, Europe, California--and lots of ways it can spend money. They may choose to stop developing in what they deem a hostile governmental environment, and I wouldn't blame them.

Isn't what Florida has passed basically the same as when Venezuela "nationalized" the oil industry? Florida was delighted for Disney to build all its own infrastructure when it couldn't afford to, and now it wants to operate all that infrastructure and reap the financial rewards from doing so.

In no respect. The Walt Disney Company under the Reedy Creek Improvement Act had the legal authority to build, without state or local input, a nuclear power plant, and to form and operate its own private police department. The powers they have enjoyed at Walt Disney World were granted to them in order to enable them to develop Walt Disney’s visionary concept for a futuristic prototype utopian city intended by Walt (you can tell I am a true Disney fan with many friends who are CMs at both parks in the US) to develop solutions to urban problems which were becoming increasingly severe in the 1960s in the United States, addressing transportation infrastructure and other technologies and providing housing and jobs for 20,000 people to start.

Then Walt died, Roy started building the parks, but EPCOT, the city, not the glorified Worlds Fair, was never constructed, nor was the industrial park nor the airport nor the nuclear power plant. Yet Disney has continued to be the local government on WDW property since the 1960s. They do not enjoy that power in Anaheim, nor in France, nor in Tokyo. Can you imagine the furor if Disney sought to build a nuclear power plant in Anaheim, or Tokyo, or run its own police department and fire brigade in Paris or Shanghai, or do any of the above in Hong Kong?

No other Disney park in the world is its own local quasi-municipal authority. Nor does any private amusement park anywhere in the world. Even the National Park Service, by virtue of the nature of the federal bureaucracy, is unable to operate to the self-regulatory, self-contained extent of WDW.

Objectively, it is my view that the Reedy Creek Improvement Act should have been given a sunset clause requiring Disney to complete EPCOT as a city within 20 years with certain core features outlined in the proposal, but this was not done; otherwise Disney should have simply received more conventional planning permission.

Also, of the extraordinary powers Disney has which are being rescinded, they have never used any of them. There is no WDW Police. There is no nuclear power plant. This legislation is a symbolic act, revoking extraordinary powers of self-government Disney obtained to facilitate a project they promised, but due to the tragic death of Walt Disney, failed to deliver. No other Disney park in the world has anything like the system of autonomous local government WDW has, and WDW can operate just fine without them.

 

[durangodawood]

In no respect. The Walt Disney Company under the Reedy Creek Improvement Act had the legal authority to build, without state or local input, a nuclear power plant, and to form and operate its own private police department. The powers they have enjoyed at Walt Disney World were granted to them in order to enable them to develop Walt Disney’s visionary concept for a futuristic prototype utopian city intended by Walt (you can tell I am a true Disney fan with many friends who are CMs at both parks in the US) to develop solutions to urban problems which were becoming increasingly severe in the 1960s in the United States, addressing transportation infrastructure and other technologies and providing housing and jobs for 20,000 people to start.

Then Walt died, Roy started building the parks, but EPCOT, the city, not the glorified Worlds Fair, was never constructed, nor was the industrial park nor the airport nor the nuclear power plant. Yet Disney has continued to be the local government on WDW property since the 1960s. They do not enjoy that power in Anaheim, nor in France, nor in Tokyo. Can you imagine the furor if Disney sought to build a nuclear power plant in Anaheim, or Tokyo, or run its own police department and fire brigade in Paris or Shanghai, or do any of the above in Hong Kong?

No other Disney park in the world is its own local quasi-municipal authority. Nor does any private amusement park anywhere in the world. Even the National Park Service, by virtue of the nature of the federal bureaucracy, is unable to operate to the self-regulatory, self-contained extent of WDW.

Objectively, it is my view that the Reedy Creek Improvement Act should have been given a sunset clause requiring Disney to complete EPCOT as a city within 20 years with certain core features outlined in the proposal, but this was not done; otherwise Disney should have simply received more conventional planning permission.

Also, of the extraordinary powers Disney has which are being rescinded, they have never used any of them. There is no WDW Police. There is no nuclear power plant. This legislation is a symbolic act, revoking extraordinary powers of self-government Disney obtained to facilitate a project they promised, but due to the tragic death of Walt Disney, failed to deliver. No other Disney park in the world has anything like the system of autonomous local government WDW has, and WDW can operate just fine without them.

I do agree that the corporate-municipality is absurd.

But Desantis is clearly engaging in unconstitutional govt retaliation for free speech actions.

 

[The Liturgist]

I do agree that the corporate-municipality is absurd.

But Desantis is clearly engaging in unconstitutional govt retaliation for free speech actions.

It may be retaliatory but I do not see how it is unconstitutional.

 

[durangodawood]

It may be retaliatory but I do not see how it is unconstitutional.

scotus has found that govt reprisals against individuals or groups for protected free speech violates the 1st amendment.

And I agree with that in principle.

 

[The Liturgist]

scotus has found that govt reprisals against individuals or groups for protected free speech violates the 1st amendment.

This isn’t a reprisal for protected speech, it is a reprisal for a corporation having failed to deliver what it promised when lobbying for the Reedy Creek Improvement Act and then failing to be a good corporate citizen.

 

[durangodawood]

This isn’t a reprisal for protected speech, it is a reprisal for a corporation having failed to deliver what it promised when lobbying for the Reedy Creek Improvement Act and then failing to be a good corporate citizen.

If that was so, they would have done it long ago. But no, its right when Disney decides to publicly oppose Desantis policy. Its transparent retaliation.

 

[hedrick]

CNN looked at the implications. At the moment Disney has a separate municipality which has to fund its own services. Now the counties they are in take over the responsibility. They will likely have to raise taxes.

 

[rjs330]

I wonder how everyone feels about corporations paying their fair share of taxes. Should corporations be allowed to participate in government and speech activities. I know some have said corporations should not be allowed to donate and support candidates.

I think it's fair to say that Disney's pushback on Florida Parental Right law is the cause of this action. As big a conservative as I am I think it is retaliation for it. However, I'm not sure that this would actually fly in court. Because Florida is to "punishing" Disney in that sense. Disney did promise to put in place certain things that allowed them autonomy, which they failed to do. Requiring them to live up to their agreement or lose their status is a legitimate legal action.

They are not being required to do extra things or being required to pay extra money or have legal privileges removed even though they have fulfilled their requirements. Removing their special status for failing to live up to their agreement is not really punishment that is over the top.

If we're the court on a suit if Disney does sue I would give Disney a certain amount of time to fulfill their requirements or lose their status. And it wouldn't be a long time because they have already had a lot of years to do it.

 

[DaisyDay]

Disney to Lose Special Tax Status in Florida Amid ‘Don’t Say Gay’ Clash


An interesting exchange I found on the topic...

Michael Knowles (a staunch conservative from the Daily Wire) had Chris Hahn (one of his rivals, and a staunch progressive) on his show to have a conversation about it.

I thought it was actually a pretty interesting exchange

...and Chris Hahn made some excellent points about some of the challenges and financial pitfalls the state of Florida will face even if the bill gets implemented with regards to reincorporating the "Reedy Creek Improvement District" into Florida.

It's 15 mins and worth a listen.

It's weird that Disney is the more progressive, less fascistic player here.

 

[hedrick]

When I wrote the last comment I hadn't realized that DeSantis is angry at Orange County. Sticking them with costs for police and fire for Disney may be feature, not a bug.

I agree that Disney is unlikely to have a court case. Establishing special districts is discretionary on the part of the state. Of course morally it’s a violation of the 1st amendment, but probably not one that can be enforced.

 

[Desk trauma]

When I wrote the last comment I hadn't realized that DeSantis is angry at Orange County. Sticking them with costs for police and fire for Disney may be feature, not a bug.

They will also be on the hook for servicing around a billion dollars worth of bonds that would otherwise be Disneys responsibility.

 

[7thKeeper]

They will also be on the hook for servicing around a billion dollars worth of bonds that would otherwise be Disneys responsibility.

And the maintenance of roads and some highway, if what I heard is correct as well.

 

[Hank77]

They will also be on the hook for servicing around a billion dollars worth of bonds that would otherwise be Disneys responsibility.

Will the new taxes that the state and municipalities will be charging Disney pay for the bond expense and the new services and maintenance?

 

[Desk trauma]

Will the new taxes that the state and municipalities will be charging Disney pay for the bond expense and the new services and maintenance?

I doubt it.

 

[The Liturgist]

Will the new taxes that the state and municipalities will be charging Disney pay for the bond expense and the new services and maintenance?

And then some, if the counties prudently manage their expenses. Alas if only Walt had built in Polk County...