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heythereterry

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I know I know it sounds crazy... but what do you do with all the evidence??

Here is a link to some crazy amount of evidence that would like to test for myself somehow.

http://www.testingtheglobe.com/bible.html

Could the world leaders really be deceiving us?
 

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Papias

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I know I know it sounds crazy... but what do you do with all the evidence??

Could the world leaders really be deceiving us?

Actually, the evidence itself shows a globe, even though things look flat to us. This is a good example of why we can't simply take the Bibles literally - since the Bibles clearly and repeatedly say that the earth is flat, in dozens of verses.
(Ibid)
Flat Earth-

Bible tells us that the earth is flat like a piece of clay stamped under a seal (Job 38:13-14), that it has edges as only a flat plane would (Job 38:13-14,.Psa 19:4), is set on a foundation, like a table (2Sm 22:16, Ps 18:15, 102:25, Pr 8:27-29, Is 48:13), has a length as only a flat plane would (Dan 4:11, Job 11:9, Job 28:24, Job 37:3, Job 38:13, Job 38:44, Jrm 16:19), that it is a circular disk (Isa 40:22), and that its entire surface can be seen from a high tree (Dan 4:10-11) heaven (Job 28:24) or mountain (Matt 4:8) or which is impossible for a sphere, but possible for a flat disk. Taken literally, as the YECs insist we do, any one of these passages shows a flat earth. Taken together, they are even more clear. And many Christians in history have interpreted it as such.

Geocentrism-

The Bible describes the earth as unmovable, set on a foundation of either pillars in water (1 Sam 2:8, 1 Chr 16:30, Job 9:6, 38:4, Psa 24:1-2, 75:s3, 93:1, 96:10, 104:5, 136:6). It also tells us that, although the earth does not move, the sun and stars do move about it (Josh 10:12, Psa 19:4-6, 50:1, Ecc 1:5 (note “returns”, not perspective), Hab 3:11). And that the stars could be dropped down onto the earth like fruit falling from a tree (Rev. 6:13). Taken literally, as the YECs insist we do, these verses show geocentrism. And many Christians in history have interpreted it as such.

We live in a Planetarium-
The Bible describes the sky (firmament -- literally "metal bowl made by a hammer"- Gen 1:6-8, 1:14-17) as a solid dome, like a tent (Isa 40:22, Psa 19:4, 104:2, Pr 8:27-29, Ezk 1:26), that is arched over the surface of the earth. It also has windows to let rain/snow in (Gen 7:11, 8:2, Deut 28:12, 2 Kings 7:2, Job 37:18, Mal 3:10, Rev 4:1). Ezekiel 1:22 and Job 37:18 even tell us that it's hard like bronze and sparkles like ice, that God walks on it (Job 22:14) and can be removed (Rev 6:14). Ex 24:10 suggests that it is like sapphire. Joshua 10:12 estimates how far the Sun and Moon are from Earth’s surface. The Sun was stopped to illuminate the Valley of Gibeon, and the Moon was stopped to illuminate the Valley of Aijalon, showing that one wasn’t sufficient for both valleys (too close). So some basic trigonometry shows that they are therefore at a roughly similar height as the valleys are from each other – which is around 20 miles. Similarly, the whole Star of Bethlehem story in Mt (where a star designates a single house) makes no sense if stars are millions of miles across, but makes perfect sense if the stars are little lights hanging from a dome above us. Taken literally, as the YECs insist we do, these verses show a solid sky above us. And again, many Christians in history have interpreted it as such.

Many Christians today have recognized this. Deciding to actually take their Bible literally, they are honest, and hence ascribe to a flat earth. Here is but one example of many:


In Christ-
Papias
 
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SkyWriting

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I know I know it sounds crazy... but what do you do with all the evidence?Here is a link to some crazy amount of evidence that would like to test for myself somehow.
Could the world leaders really be deceiving us?

The world is experienced as flat. It's not a big deal.
 
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SkyWriting

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Actually, the evidence itself shows a globe, even though things look flat to us. This is a good example of why we can't simply take the Bibles literally - since the Bibles clearly and repeatedly say that the earth is flat, in dozens of verses.

Nope. But it does explain things as people experience the world....mostly flat.

Even if you're on a mountain top, you likely will not even see the base of the
mountain due to terrain. In mountain country, you can't see much of
anything other than more mountain tops. So the flat claim fails.
 
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Widlast

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<staff edit>The ancient Greeks knew the Earth was a globe and had the size within a few hundred miles.
Dig a hole 20 feet deep, have a plumb-bob hanging in the center, at sunset (or as soon as the stars are visible) note the stars and their positions that are "straight up" from the bottom of the hole. Walk 100 miles away from your present position (might take a few days but that's okay) and repeat the procedure. Note that there is a difference in what "straight up' is. The angle of the difference can be calculated and a rough determination of the circumference of the globe also. If the world was flat the plumb-bobs would be parallel, they never are, nor can they be.
 
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SkyWriting

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Just as most people experience the world as if evolution wasn't true? So that's why it's not explicitly spelled out in scripture?

I woulds say that the concept of change is fully supported
and that restrictions to "kinds" are not. But I am a full
Creationist, none-the-less. Just not like I used to be.
 
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SkyWriting

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<staff edit>

Not at all. The earth is 99.9 percent flat...which is fine 99.9%
of the time. Why pander to science? We might at well say
we are mostly dark matter and dark energy. Stupid scientists.
 
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SkyWriting

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Any person <staff edit> can disprove it without trying very hard.

Wrong. Water is used as a level.
It's never used as a curve.
 
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SkyWriting

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Dig a hole 20 feet deep, have a plumb-bob hanging in the center, at sunset (or as soon as the stars are visible) note the stars and their positions that are "straight up" from the bottom of the hole. Walk 100 miles away from your present position (might take a few days but that's okay) and repeat the procedure. Note that there is a difference in what "straight up' is. The angle of the difference can be calculated and a rough determination of the circumference of the globe also. If the world was flat the plumb-bobs would be parallel, they never are, nor can they be.

That only denotes the center of gravity, not the earths shape.
A perfectly flat surface one mile thick would also have the same result.
 
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Widlast

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That only denotes the center of gravity, not the earths shape.
A perfectly flat surface one mile thick would also have the same result.
<staff edit>

If an object has a "center of gravity", then obviously it is not a flat plane, eh?
How would a flat plain have consistent gravity all across the flat surface? (unless you suggest that gravity is magical and not a characteristic of the nature of matter).
<staff edit>
On a flat surface, two holes would be parallel. Since stars are (from a practical point of view) infinitely distant, the two holes would be pointing at exactly the same set of stars even if they were 100 miles apart.

But that is not what we observe on Earth.
Two holes 100 miles apart are NOT parallel, different sets of stars would bee seen. They diverge by an angle that with a little math will give you a rough estimate of the size of the globe Earth.

Another point, why do ships disappear as they sail away?
If the ocean was flat they would be visible for a practically infinite distance.

Another point, how can you fly west from California to Hawaii, then west to Japan, then west to Turkey, then west to France, then west to Atlanta, and then west to California again?
<staff edit>
 
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SkyWriting

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Another point, why do ships disappear as they sail away?
If the ocean was flat they would be visible for a practically infinite distance.

Yes... in space.
Dust, water vapour and pollution in the air will rarely let you see more
than 20 kilometres (12 miles), even on a clear day.
 
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Hieronymus

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I know I know it sounds crazy... but what do you do with all the evidence??

Here is a link to some crazy amount of evidence that would like to test for myself somehow.

http://www.testingtheglobe.com/bible.html

Could the world leaders really be deceiving us?
Yes they could.
They have Christians believe in evolution, and how about 9/11 ?

BUT:


not in this case.
 
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SkyWriting

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SkyWriting

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I know I know it sounds crazy... but what do you do with all the evidence??

For the most part, the earth is flat. People can only see 12 miles due to atmospheric dust.
 
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Hammster

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ADMIN HAT ON


Two mod hats already.

Here's my thinking. If you need to insult someone to get your point across, your argument is probably not that strong. I get that insults can be fun, and you get to be witty.

But they result in threads getting closed, and members getting warnings. No warnings yet. But if you all can't disagree without flaming, then they will happen.

So just be nice.


ADMIN HAT OFF
 
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