Fibromyalgia/Chronic Fatigue Syndrome

[2scoops]

I am not trying to stir up controversy, I am only trying to help. If you do not want to look into this fine. But I will pass this info along becuase I know of people who have been healed of fibro by Sarno's method. I have never said the pain is all in your head. The pain is very, very real. I know it debalitated me for over two years. If someone told me two years ago about the mindbody, I would have reacted the same way you did. But I got desperate enough, that Sarno was my last option, drugs, surgery, p.t, pain-management, doctor after doctor. Nothing worked so I guess I had to go through all the formalities before I was ready to give it a try. But to go from laying in bed all day for about two years and to get my life back is an amazing testimony and I will pass along that bevuase I have see many helped. There's a reason doctors can only do so much and there is a reason why many are still suffering, there cause or root has not been identified. Stress, tension, anxiety, worry, life's pressures, those pressures we put on oursleves can actually cause different states in our bodies. I mean if we are nervous before giving a speech, we can make ourselves sick to our stomach. That shows there is a direct correlation. I am a person who put myself through a lot of stress and tension, thinking I had to be successful, driven, please everyone. But I put myself through a lot of tension. I also used to woory a lot. And the bible tells us not to worry. I failed to put my life, my problems into God's hands. I have been in a lot of pain, both emtotional and physical. I went through a broken engagement, losing my job, health, etc. But I know see I got the physical pain, to take my attention off the emotional pain. I have been through a lot, but here I am, I've turned the emotions over to God, I am getting closer to Him, learning everyday and I'm practically pain-free. I love you, and I know your are going through hard times. Ionly want to help and I believe this is sort of my calling in life. I care about you and I never meant to cause you anger, and I never would intend to disrespect you. Please forgive me if I have, and pain is never just in oyur head it is very, very real. God bless you and I hope you get healing. Your brother in Christ Matt.

 

[Talie]

you're wrong - no matter how many times you say the same rubbish you're wrong. Just because YOU think FM is psychological does not mean it is, no matter how many times you say it.

You know, some of the people I know dealing with chronic health problems are some of the most positive kind, empathetic and encouraging people I know....so your theory is.......well, a word I wouldn't say here.

I don't care (as in that doesn't change my opinion of YOUR opinion, not that I don't care about you as a person) what YOU went through, what happened for YOU is NOT what is happenign for me or many others who suffer from chronic health problems.

For YOU there may have been a relationship between your "pain" and your "emotions" but that does NOT meant that every single person living with pain in this world is doing so because they're depressed - get over it and let people live their lives. How arogant to think that just because something may have applied to you it instantly applies to the whole world

And if as you said in your PM you "meant to PM me this not post it" then you could have deleted this post, but you didn't, so that shows your motivies where that's concerened.

 

[fmsmom]

Yes the pain is in our heads(don't chastize me read on) but not the way you are saying It is in our heads because it is everywhere in our bodies and since the brain is part of our body yes the pain is there as well. It is possible that God is using that as a means to help some but not all of respond the same way to things so if it helped you great.

 

[Talie]

well, for SOME people (mis-)diagnosed with FM - it really is all about their heads - due to compression of the rear of the brain from which often ends up causing your brain to be pushed down into your spinal canal - a condition called arnold chiari malformation - which is what i have - i have physical proof it's in my head, and i have physical proof that it is nothing to do with my emotional state.....the symptoms are simliar in a lot of ways to CFS or FM which is why so many get mis-diagnosed - I was diagnosed with CFS for 10 years before finding out what the acutal cause of my symptoms were.....yet STILL people say it's all psychological because they're unifnormed and too arogant to accept that THEIR opinion might be wrong

 

[Muzza]

Yes for some people the pain is in their heads, but does that make it any less debilitating?

For many of us though the pain is a very physical reality. We feel the pain so in that respect I suppose you could say that it is in our heads. But to say that we can get rid of the pain by reconciling ourselves with past emotional pain and all that stuff, well that just won't work for some people, because bottom line is, the pain is a physical and genetic part of our very makeup, and no amount of psychology or mindwhatever stuff, will change that reality.

For myself I have all the pain every day, I have had a perfectly happy life, sure it's had it's up and downs, as anyones does. But I have a wonderful supportive family, I've never been abused, bullied, persecuted really in any way. So where would the pain you're talking about come from for me? Purely and simply, my body is a body that gives me pain, there is nothing emotional or stress related, or psychological about it.

There are other possibilities other than the one you're talking about 2scoops. Realise that and accept it, otherwise you'll just end up hurting a lot of people by talking that way.

 

[2scoops]

I've never said that the mind/body is the cause of every person's case. I should have made that clear in my previous posts, and for that I apologize. A person should see a doctor and should rule out serious disease and or trauma. I am sorry Tallie, I did not know your brain was pushed down into your spinal column. You have a symptom from something physical. You are right, many people with fibro get misdiagnosed and some times there is a true physical cause and some times there is not anything the docs can figure out. Personally I do not like that saying the pain is all in your head. It's very misleading. The pain is in fact very real. If one has seen a doctor, and a physical cause has been ruled out, then the books mentioned may be beneficial to someone. I know people have told me that the books have helped them get rid of pain from fibro, carpal tunnel, RSI, back pain, migraines, CFS, acid reflux, foot pain, myofacial pain, and other symptoms. If you don't want to read any of the books that's fine. I just want to help, bottom line. Not everyone's pain is induced by emotions, stress, woory, life's pressures, but if serious diasease has been ruled out, then maybe it's worth looking into.

 

[Talie]

what you're saying is "because you can't see it, it's not real" you know, they used to say that about MS and a lot of other medical conditions that they later discovered are very real and based in a physical cause - just because science doesn't have the answers for somethign NOW does NOT mean it does not exist.

You just don't get it.... in reality you'd rather inult people than help them - and yes, what you are doing IS insulting people who are suffering from very real very physical health problems

So do you go around to everyone who has a broken leg and tell them "just be happy and it will instantly heal itself"? I doubt it, and what you are doing here is not in the slightest different - you're just too blinded to see it

 

[night2day]

...many people with fibro get misdiagnosed and some times there is a true physical cause and some times there is not anything the docs can figure out....

There is a differance between saying "many people with fibro get misdiagnosed" and "some times there is a true physical cause" as if Hey...these people must have an actual illness sometimes!

Actually, we do.

Fibromyalgia and Myofacial Pain have both been classified as neuromuscular diseases. Those who have FM, are more than likely to also have Myofacial Pain. While the same isn't true with Myofacial pain due to it being more localized. However, that makes it no less troubsome and painful for the one who deals with it. To take an example with shingles, whether it starts out within a few local areas and then spreads doesn't compare to when it was localized. Shingles is Shingles which caries a burning rash and nerve damage. Or what about a broken bone? Whether within a toe or a leg, it's still going to affect walking.

In FM, there are also many other side conditions to contend with brought on by the neurodisease as well.

Neuromuscular Disease
​

A myofascial trigger point is a localized area starving for oxygen. It creates an increased local energy demand. This local energy crisis releases neuroreactive biochemicals which sensitize nearby nerves. The sensitized nerves initiate the motor, sensory, and autonomic effects of myofascial trigger points by acting on the central nervous system. Muscles with trigger points are muscles in a constant state of energy crisis.
​

Myofascial trigger points can be identified and documented electrophysiologically by characteristic spontaneous electrical activity (SEA). They may also be identified histologically (which means that the structure of the cells have changed) by contraction knots — the lumps and bumps we know only too well. Both of these phenomenon seem to result from excessive release of the neurotransmitter acetylcholine (ACh) from the nerve terminal of the motor endplate (the complex end formation of the nerve).
​

We now have objective confirmation of electromyographic imaging of a myofascial trigger point. There is also ultrasound imaging of local twitch responses of trigger points, and biopsies of myofascial trigger points that show contraction knots and giant rounded muscle fibers. To quote from this article, "The endplate dysfunction characteristic of MTrPs involves both the nerve terminal and the postjunctional muscle fiber. This relationship identifies MTrPs as a neuromuscular disease." Simons DG. 1999. Diagnostic criteria of myofascial pain caused by trigger points. J Musculoskeletal Pain 7(1-2):111-120.
​

A MTrP is always found in a taut band which is histologically related to contraction knots caused by excessive release of ACh in an abnormal endplate. The pathogenesis of myofascial trigger points appears to involve serious disturbance of the nerve ending and contractile mechanism at multiple dysfunctional endplates. Doctor Hong has even formed a theory concerning fibromyalgia tender points. Hong, C-Z. 1999. Current research on myofascial trigger points-pathophysiological studies. J Musculoskeletal Pain 7(1-2):121-129.
​

Please be considerate in what type of thread you are posting within. Especially when many of us have already been through the "all through your heads" with the doctors and others at some point.

Good intentions or not...I've been offended by the "because it works for me, it'll work for you". You may not have wanted it to come across that way but...

Perhaps begin a thread with possible "alternative to medicines"...? If you're going from thread to thread offering aid to people when you have no knowlege of their condition or no first hand experiance...you are settling yourself up.

If anything...at least learn of the condiions first. People with FM at times do go into remission. People with ME (CFIDS)-FM are worse off and, the longer they have the condition the last chance they have of recovering. Due to the fact ME itself is a neuroimmune disease under the World Heath Org. this should be understandable. Thinking "happy thoughts" will aid someone's outlook and will help them within the circumstances. But it doesn't mean it will change the circumstances.

Recent Side note: Acknowledging pain in others and trying to find ways to aleave it is a kind and noble gesture. However, in doing so, it also helps in acknowledging individuals are dealing with real medical conditions which have true biomedical causes. .

For example: The most recent research on the ME/CFS side by a medical university in Philadelphia that was funded by the Centers for Disease Control concluded the very cell structure of individuals with the disease are being affected on a genetic level.

Still, there's one big way any Christian can always do. And...it should be our first use of defense...not our last: Prayer. God may say yes. He may say no. But He always answers. And He's the only one who holds all of the pieces of the puzzle.

 

[2scoops]

Please be considerate in what type of thread you are posting within. Especially when many of us have already been through the "all through your heads" with the doctors and others at some point.

Let me clarify my self and then I will leave this thread, because I am obviously not helping. I never have said the pain is in your head, the pain is REAL.

Good intentions or not...I've been offended by the "because it works for me, it'll work for you". You may not have wanted it to come across that way but...

I am sorry to have offended you and others and for that I apolgize.

Perhaps begin a thread with possible "alternative to medicines"...? If your going from thread to thread offering aid to people when you have no knowlege of their condition or no first hand experiance...you are settling yourself up.

I am so sorry, I just get excited that I want to pass along what helped me. It's kind of like when I got saved and I wanted people know Jesus, I just wanted to share. My aunt was diagnosed with FMS, MS, herniated disc, and the info I gave her helped her, she is know driving again and able to go back to work. I guess I have seen it touch lives. One christian lady told me her migraines are gone and so is her back pain. I know everyone is different and I do not know eveyone's case, symptoms, etc. you are right, I should have started my own thread. I guess I know people who were diagnosed with fibro and they are now better, and just wanted to pass that along.

If anything...at least learn of the condiions first. People with FM at times do go into remission. People with ME (CFIDS)-FM are worse off and, the longer they have the condition the last chance they have of recovering. Due to the fact ME itself is a neuroimmune disease under the World Heath Org. this should be understandable.
Thinking "happy thoughts" will aid someone's outlook and will help them within the circumstances. But it doesn't mean it will change the circumstances.

I never said to think happy thoughts, I never said positive people never got pain, etc. I never said anything about treatment. Sarno's method is different from tradition medicine, but I never said you had to be positive, or change your life. That's why I recommended the book, which one can get at a local library. I know some people buy book after book and try every treatment under the sun. There is really nothing to lose and if you don't get the book and your not interested that's fine, and I know it will not help everyone but I know it has helped some and that was the reason I posted. Do I know eveything about sickness, disease, no way, I and I never will. But I do know we are spiritual beings, the way God made us, and our relationship with Him is the most important thing in our lives. I thank Godthat I had the pain, because it made my relationship so much closer to Him.

 

[rosemoss]

I think we need a new subject.


How's everybody doing today? I'm not too bad, heat and humidity have caused one of those irritating headaches that won't go away but I'm handling it1

God Bless,

rosemoss

 

[Dr. Holly]

Oh my. I haven't read through the posts yet, I admit, but as most of you know, I've just had surgery. I will however be catching up with this thread because I miss all of you

Just wanted you all to know that you're in my thoughts & prayers always. Hope to talk with you all again soon.

 

[night2day]

Well, the prodigal returns!!

*hugs gently*




Who's turn is it to bring in the Twinkies and Zingers?

I have no heart to kill the calf. Not with those puppy dog eyes...
​

 

[night2day]

How's everybody doing today? I'm not too bad, heat and humidity have caused one of those irritating headaches that won't go away but I'm handling it1

Washed out. Haven't gotten too many migraines since the doc increased my medication. In other news, the ME and FM is under fire from the tropical depression/remnents of Dennis. (Btw, do they just call it "remnants" when it heads too far inland such as the mid west or what?)

Anyway, please pray for those in the Gulf who were struck when the hurricane rammed through...and those who live in the Ohio valley...where the rain's suppsedly supposed to stall.

 

[Muzza]

I'm not having the best of days, it's very cold here, and my legs are in such pain that it's actually difficult to walk, even down to the kitchen. So yeah, not great.

 

[mini_mim]

Huge hugs for Vagal, hope everything went well and you are recovering. Looking forward to hearing all your latest when you are up to it.

As for me, I AM TOO HOT!!!!

Sorry, got a bit carried away there, but it is very hot over here and it is draining me and exhausting me and not letting me sleep or rest. GGGGGRRRRRRR!!!!
Just to clarify, I have ME not FM, but I do get muscular pain a fair bit, mostly mild but sometimes..... well, let's just say, Monday was definitely a sometimes. I have so much love for all of you with FM, who keep up with that kind of pain full-time. I struggle to cope with just every so often, but all the time? You are all amazing

Hugs and prayers for you all,

Miriam xx

 

[rosemoss]

Hello! So glad you're back and feeling better VAGal!
Yep, the heat is a bummer when it comes to pain, seems to make mine worse, but then again so does cold, I need to live in consistent 70-75 degree weather! Where would that be anyway????
Have a lovely and blessed day everybody!

God Bless,

rosemoss

 

[feathergirl]

just peeking in to say hi & see how ya all are today's been kinda weird...i went to see the dr & kinda got upset...so he's giving me some meds for depression...i hope they help. hope ya guys are having a good day. byes.

 

[Dr. Holly]

Hi everybody

I have missed you all so much. Thank you so much for welcoming me back so sweetly. That really touched my heart.

Well, I was back in the hospital today. More complications have arose, and I was in severe pain. They weren't entirely sure what to do for this particular problem, but I am on some heavy duty anti-biotics, pain killers, an anti-inflammatory, and a few other things. We're praying that it clears up. If not, God only knows what will happen. So basically I'm still out of commission for a while

For those of you who would like to hear about the surgery. Well, as we have all talked about in the past ... doctors are terrible these days. Mine is certainly not the brightest crayon in the box! I came out of surgery with a severe infection in my incision, a UTI, Strep throat, and a hematoma in my stomach underneath the incision site. The doc. kept saying it was normal, and as we all know, it simply wasn't. So my recovery time was extended, but most of that is under control. He does however think that he sowed a nerve shut in there, and now the pain won't go away when pushed upon. Oh well -- I'm not letting him touch me again.

So -- it has been a rough ride so far, but I'm still alive so I'm ok Thanks to all of you that prayed and thought of me. You mean more to me than you'll ever know

Now hopefully while I have some more down time, I will feel up to getting online and catching up with you lovely people.

God love & bless all of you!

 

[Dr. Holly]

Oh hun, I am so glad to hear that the doctor got your migranes under control moreso. I am however sad to hear that he had to increase the dosage. Are you having any bad reactions from it? Also sorry to hear that your ME and FM are under fire. I'll be praying for some relief.

And yes, lets pray for those that were hit by the hurricane. It is simply devastating what it has done in some areas. We have just gotten some severe weather here (in VA) that has knocked out power and then some...but nothing like it is in some states/areas. They definitely need God's protection.

Washed out. Haven't gotten too many migraines since the doc increased my medication. In other news, the ME and FM is under fire from the tropical depression/remnents of Dennis. (Btw, do they just call it "remnants" when it heads too far inland such as the mid west or what?)

Anyway, please pray for those in the Gulf who were struck when the hurricane rammed through...and those who live in the Ohio valley...where the rain's suppsedly supposed to stall.

 

[Dr. Holly]

I'm not having the best of days, it's very cold here, and my legs are in such pain that it's actually difficult to walk, even down to the kitchen. So yeah, not great.

Hi Muzza

Sounds so strange to hear you talk about how cold it is. It's about 110* here in the south.

As for your pain, I will be praying for relief to come your way. We all know here just how miserable things can get.

I hope the coming days find you feeling well! God bless you, hun.