Fear and the Christian Message

[Llewelyn Stevenson]

There are some who keep asking me to deliver a concept of Christianity without fear. Such would be a gospel of lunacy although it is expressed by many these days.

Here are some proverbs for consideration:

1. It is better to fear and live than to cast off the restraints of fear and die.

2. Which of you, seeing your child about to drink a deadly poison would not cause them to fear?

3. The lack of fear is irrational, you should have yourself committed.

Take a little time to consider what each of these proverbs is saying, then make your reply. I'm sure you can find real life examples for all of these.

 

[Moral Orel]

1. It is better to fear and live than to cast off the restraints of fear and die.

Are the only options between living and dying being fearful or not? Is it not possible to get a better understanding of something so that you are no longer afraid and no longer at risk of dying? What if we were talking about water, say the ocean, and you had never encountered it before. You see another person go into the ocean and drown, so you become fearful and never go near the ocean again. Wouldn't it be better to learn to swim? Or to build a boat so that you can go out on the water, free from fear, and fish?

2. Which of you, seeing your child about to drink a deadly poison would not cause them to fear?

Why do I need to scare my child to get him to not drink it? I have to run up, screaming and waving my hands, terrifying him so that he associates that fear with drinking poison? Can't I just take the poison away and teach him calmly that it is better to not drink poison? And if we're talking about a very small child who can't understand at all, then it is my responsibility to keep poison out of his reach. Should people keep poisonous substances away from toddlers, or should they put them in their hands and then smack them so that they are fearful of them?

3. The lack of fear is irrational, you should have yourself committed.

Just like the first proverb, better understanding eliminates fear. Sometimes it is a matter of human skill, such as people that are capable of wrestling with alligators. Sometimes it is a matter of technology such as people understanding disease and how to treat it. If we remained fearful of contagious disease, we would never have gotten close enough to cure it.

 

[bhsmte]

There are some who keep asking me to deliver a concept of Christianity without fear. Such would be a gospel of lunacy although it is expressed by many these days.

Here are some proverbs for consideration:

1. It is better to fear and live than to cast off the restraints of fear and die.

2. Which of you, seeing your child about to drink a deadly poison would not cause them to fear?

3. The lack of fear is irrational, you should have yourself committed.

Take a little time to consider what each of these proverbs is saying, then make your reply. I'm sure you can find real life examples for all of these.

You have limited options. Is that by design?

 

[Llewelyn Stevenson]

Are the only options between living and dying being fearful or not? Is it not possible to get a better understanding of something so that you are no longer afraid and no longer at risk of dying? What if we were talking about water, say the ocean, and you had never encountered it before. You see another person go into the ocean and drown, so you become fearful and never go near the ocean again. Wouldn't it be better to learn to swim? Or to build a boat so that you can go out on the water, free from fear, and fish?


Why do I need to scare my child to get him to not drink it? I have to run up, screaming and waving my hands, terrifying him so that he associates that fear with drinking poison? Can't I just take the poison away and teach him calmly that it is better to not drink poison? And if we're talking about a very small child who can't understand at all, then it is my responsibility to keep poison out of his reach. Should people keep poisonous substances away from toddlers, or should they put them in their hands and then smack them so that they are fearful of them?


Just like the first proverb, better understanding eliminates fear. Sometimes it is a matter of human skill, such as people that are capable of wrestling with alligators. Sometimes it is a matter of technology such as people understanding disease and how to treat it. If we remained fearful of contagious disease, we would never have gotten close enough to cure it.

You have, in actual fact, answered yourself. Fear brings understanding. Take the contagious disease, we learned to get close enough to cure it and yet to stay far enough for it not to destroy us. In every case we need to get understanding. So you have given fear a purpose and not just dismissed it. That is the point of the proverbs. The purpose of fear in the gospels is to lead you to understanding.

 

[Llewelyn Stevenson]

A bit of a biography from my past.

I was about 10 years old so it would have been 1970. The Assembly of God in South Africa was holding a conference beside a dam [I don't remember which].

One day another lad I had made friends with went with me to the base of the dam wall, we had been digging up earth worms for fishing. There were a number of African children fishing on the rocks at the wall and, since we were tired of fishing, we decided to give the rest of our worms to them. My friend, holding the can of worms stepped from the rock onto the river bed to cross over to the other children. It was quicksand and he sunk immediately. My heart leapt into my throat.

Fortunately he had grabbed hold of the rock and some of the African children were quick enough to pull him up and save him.

The next I walked along that river bed with my brothers who decided to cross. I quickly stopped them, warning of the danger of quicksand. I picked up a rock, large enough to require two hands, and threw it into the mud where it sank out of sight. We spent some time throwing rocks into the quicksand, then continued another 20 yards down river where there was a road crossing, and crossed there.

I do not remember the name of that friend, his parents considered it dangerous and he was not allowed to leave the camp grounds afterwards. I never saw him again.

If you don't think I was afraid when he disappeared beneath that mud you are sadly mistaken, but I took a hold of that fear and learned from it.

 

[Llewelyn Stevenson]

Why do I need to scare my child to get him to not drink it? I have to run up, screaming and waving my hands, terrifying him so that he associates that fear with drinking poison? Can't I just take the poison away and teach him calmly that it is better to not drink poison? And if we're talking about a very small child who can't understand at all, then it is my responsibility to keep poison out of his reach. Should people keep poisonous substances away from toddlers, or should they put them in their hands and then smack them so that they are fearful of them?

Are you, or have you been a parent? Take the poison away calmly when they are out of reach? Good luck with that. Smack a child for something they mistake as drinkable? I suppose it might happen in the shock of the moment but I hardly think that it is intentional. Quite honestly I would expect this reasoning from someone who hasn't raised a family. Nobody deliberately puts poison in the hands of a small child they love, but accidents can happen, especially with small children who love to be around everything daddy or mummy is doing.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

There are some who keep asking me to deliver a concept of Christianity without fear. Such would be a gospel of lunacy although it is expressed by many these days.

Here are some proverbs for consideration:

1. It is better to fear and live than to cast off the restraints of fear and die.

2. Which of you, seeing your child about to drink a deadly poison would not cause them to fear?

3. The lack of fear is irrational, you should have yourself committed.

Take a little time to consider what each of these proverbs is saying, then make your reply. I'm sure you can find real life examples for all of these.

Do you worship out of fear?

 

[Moral Orel]

Are you, or have you been a parent? Take the poison away calmly when they are out of reach? Good luck with that. Smack a child for something they mistake as drinkable? I suppose it might happen in the shock of the moment but I hardly think that it is intentional. Quite honestly I would expect this reasoning from someone who hasn't raised a family. Nobody deliberately puts poison in the hands of a small child they love, but accidents can happen, especially with small children who love to be around everything daddy or mummy is doing.

I am a parent, and my example was that of your theory that we should make them be afraid of the poison. That was a question, not a statement. The scenario I imagined, based on your evidence, was an example of using behavioral psychology to promote fear of something that someone doesn't have fear of. If you were to calmly explain to the child that they shouldn't drink poison, then you are promoting understanding, which is what I advocate. Understanding > fear.

 

[quatona]

Take a little time to consider what each of these proverbs is saying, then make your reply. I'm sure you can find real life examples for all of these.

...and even a dead clock displays the correct time twice a day.

 

[Catherineanne]

There are some who keep asking me to deliver a concept of Christianity without fear. Such would be a gospel of lunacy although it is expressed by many these days.

Here are some proverbs for consideration:

1. It is better to fear and live than to cast off the restraints of fear and die.

2. Which of you, seeing your child about to drink a deadly poison would not cause them to fear?

3. The lack of fear is irrational, you should have yourself committed.

Take a little time to consider what each of these proverbs is saying, then make your reply. I'm sure you can find real life examples for all of these.

Those are not proverbs from the Bible. In fact, they are not proverbs at all; just words put together. A proverb has to contain at least a modicum of wisdom.

Given they are not Biblical and not particularly wise, I won't waste even a second considering what they say, because they are meaningless.

 

[DogmaHunter]

There are some who keep asking me to deliver a concept of Christianity without fear. Such would be a gospel of lunacy although it is expressed by many these days.

Here are some proverbs for consideration:

1. It is better to fear and live than to cast off the restraints of fear and die.

2. Which of you, seeing your child about to drink a deadly poison would not cause them to fear?

3. The lack of fear is irrational, you should have yourself committed.

Take a little time to consider what each of these proverbs is saying, then make your reply. I'm sure you can find real life examples for all of these.

There's a difference between rational and irrational fears.

Fear in christianity is like the fear of the boogey man. Of the monster hiding under the bed. Of an invisible deity who builds an invisible place of torture.

Fear of poison, fear of falling, etc are rational fears. Fear of the unverfiable, the unfalsifiable, of the invisible... is not a rational fear.

 

[juvenissun]

There are some who keep asking me to deliver a concept of Christianity without fear. Such would be a gospel of lunacy although it is expressed by many these days.

Here are some proverbs for consideration:

1. It is better to fear and live than to cast off the restraints of fear and die.

2. Which of you, seeing your child about to drink a deadly poison would not cause them to fear?

3. The lack of fear is irrational, you should have yourself committed.

Take a little time to consider what each of these proverbs is saying, then make your reply. I'm sure you can find real life examples for all of these.

Fear is a basic human emotion and it is a good thing to have. We fear a lion even it is your pet. Why shouldn't we fear God, even God is love?

 

[DogmaHunter]

Fear is a basic human emotion and it is a good thing to have. We fear a lion even it is your pet. Why shouldn't we fear God, even God is love?

Because lions are demonstrably real.

 

[The Cadet]

Fear is a basic human emotion and it is a good thing to have. We fear a lion even it is your pet. Why shouldn't we fear God, even God is love?

A pet lion is not a good analogy. Lions are animals - non-domesticated, potentially violent animals with strong instincts and less strong mental faculties. God is supposedly perfect. A perfect being who loves me would not allow me to come to any harm. Of course, this is hardly the behavior seen in the biblical god, and I'm not sure if anyone here thinks that God is omnibenevolent, so...

 

[juvenissun]

A pet lion is not a good analogy. Lions are animals - non-domesticated, potentially violent animals with strong instincts and less strong mental faculties. God is supposedly perfect. A perfect being who loves me would not allow me to come to any harm. Of course, this is hardly the behavior seen in the biblical god, and I'm not sure if anyone here thinks that God is omnibenevolent, so...

OK. Then try this: Father-child relationship. Father loves child. Child... FEAR/love father. You do know how a child will become if he has no fear to his parents.
It is a good analogy to God-human relationship.

 

[paulm50]

There are some who keep asking me to deliver a concept of Christianity without fear. Such would be a gospel of lunacy although it is expressed by many these days.

Here are some proverbs for consideration:

1. It is better to fear and live than to cast off the restraints of fear and die.

2. Which of you, seeing your child about to drink a deadly poison would not cause them to fear?

3. The lack of fear is irrational, you should have yourself committed.

Take a little time to consider what each of these proverbs is saying, then make your reply. I'm sure you can find real life examples for all of these.

Many people converted from a religion based on a lot of fear, to Christianity because it preached a more loving alternative.

I agree with you about fear of real dangers, but Christianity doesn't have real dangers. Unless one is in the Middle East, or an anti Christian country. At one time, being a Muslim in a Christian country brought real fear.

 

[Oafman]

OK. Then try this: Father-child relationship. Father loves child. Child... FEAR/love father. You do know how a child will become if he has no fear to his parents.
It is a good analogy to God-human relationship.

Only in dysfunctional families do fathers give their children reason to fear them.

Your analogy implies that your 'relationship with God' is dysfunctional.

 

[estadalamoo]

There are some who keep asking me to deliver a concept of Christianity without fear. Such would be a gospel of lunacy although it is expressed by many these days.

Here are some proverbs for consideration:

1. It is better to fear and live than to cast off the restraints of fear and die.

2. Which of you, seeing your child about to drink a deadly poison would not cause them to fear?

3. The lack of fear is irrational, you should have yourself committed.

Take a little time to consider what each of these proverbs is saying, then make your reply. I'm sure you can find real life examples for all of these.

You can not learn and fear at the same time, this is because fear is a defensive reaction when you lack learning. If you really want your children to fear for goodness sake then don't blame them when they turn evil.

 

[TillICollapse]

You can not learn and fear at the same time, this is because fear is a defensive reaction when you lack learning.

I'm not speaking to the OP, rather to your statement.

I see no reason why a person can't fear and learn at the same time. Are you saying you can't imagine any circumstances where a person experiences fear and learns at the same time ?

 

[The Cadet]

OK. Then try this: Father-child relationship. Father loves child. Child... FEAR/love father. You do know how a child will become if he has no fear to his parents.
It is a good analogy to God-human relationship.

What Oafman said. I don't fear my father. I don't think he will strike me. I dislike his disappointment, but my love for him is not tainted through fear or apprehension. I never worry that if I do the wrong thing, he will lash out at me or stop loving me. If you truly fear your father the way many believers fear hell, then you are in an abusive relationship.

But even here, your example is bad, because again, fathers are not omnibenevolent, omniscient, or omnipotent. They are, much like lions, animals, with often strong instincts and emotional responses. They're not wild or vicious like lions (at least generally they aren't), but this does not exclude an out-of-proportion emotional response. God's properties do.