Family Values

[feral]

Typically, when the buzz-phrase "family values" is used, it is meant to sound as though family values are supportive of people and working against those who seek (for whatever reason I can't fathom) to destroy families worldwide. Obviously, for many like Jerry Falwell, the American Family Association http://www.afa.org family values are seen as good and positive contributions to society.

My question really is why are all families not supported by "family values" and "pro-family" groups?

For instance...while the traditional family of male breadwinner, female mother or worker is promoted as the one right way of having a family, we know that is not representative of all or even most families. More then half of all marriages end in divorce, so you've got families of single moms or single dads caring for kids. They are a family. However, when it has been proposed that the government fund childcare, "pro-family" groups call it anti-family. Also, many work to limit, curtail or destroy welfare which, although out of hand does help to feed and shelter many children. How is this "pro-family"?

Another big deal (yes...homosexuality :o ) is the recent major acts by "pro-family" groups against gay civil unions or marriages. Instead of supporting two individuals who want to make a lifelong committment, many "pro-family" advocates deny gay marriage as a good thing. Apparently, co-habitation, which is usually discourages by "pro-family" groups is okay in this case and better then a union. How is this "pro-family"? These groups also speak out against allowing gays to adopt - either to adopt their partner's children as step-parents or to adopt children not blood related to either partner. In a civilization that has children living in poorly run foster homes, and where abuse has been proven in many foster and temporary situations, how is this pro family? Would not the formation of a family by two lesbians and an orphan be the best for the child? Why are these families not being helped and supported by "pro-family" groups. The D.O.M.A. (defense of marriage act) cuts short the possibility of starting a fammily for some people, which would appear to be the opposite goal of a real pro-family group.

What do you think? What are family values, and who do you consider to be a family?

 

[tcampen]

Just to clarify, the divorce rate in America "may be as high" as 50 percent. But, also keep in mind that many of those contributing to the high rate have divorced several times, making it appear all marriages fall into this statistical calculation. (My parents are case in point, each divorced three times.) Me....I waited until I was 30 before I got married.

But another point...I've worked with kids in the foster care system, still do, in fact. I see what it is all about. The system has limited funds, limited resources, limited personel, and very limited numbers of good foster parents. Kids who grow up in this environments have the deck stacked against them to the point where it would truely be a miracle for any one of them to escape a life of crime or poverty upon reaching 18. And so many of these kids are problem children and too old for anyone to want to adopt. Thus they are stuck in the foster care system. It really is that bad, and it is the reality of the situation.

I have not been shown what harm would result from gay or lesbian couples who are willing to adopt children others are unwilling to adopt. And if there are some drawbacks, such as the social stigma from some people, how is that any worse than the foster care sytem they would otherwise be in?

So let's deal with reality for just a moment, rather than the dreamland idea of a middle class husband and wife ready and willing to adopt every available child. I see a loving, supportive, same sex household as being a far better environment than what many of these children would otherwise be in thru the Foster Care system.

Am I wrong? Please show me why.

 

[Havoc]

One must wonder why, if the "family" is so important and if God is so important to the success of the "family"... Why is the divorce rate among Evangelical Christians as high as non-Christians?

 

[Arikay]

Not just as high, Often Higher.

 

[Volos]

A family is defined by the people in it.

 

[Kelly]

Any union that gives protection to the children to which they are responsible.

 

[tcampen]

One must wonder why, if the "family" is so important and if God is so important to the success of the "family"... Why is the divorce rate among Evangelical Christians as high as non-Christians?

According to the Christian research Barnas Group, evangelicals had a divorce rate around 27%, compared to atheists at around 22%.

 

[Havoc]

According to the Christian research Barnas Group, evangelicals had a divorce rate around 27%, compared to atheists at around 22%.

Yes but I think the same study showed non-Christians generally at 25%, which is statistically the same as 27%.

In any rate I was trying to be kind

 

[tcampen]

Very kind of you. Even tho I am not an atheist, I still find it interesting that their divorce rates are lower than evangelical christians, by 5 points. It really makes you wonder what all this talk of "morality" and "values" is really all about.

 

[jonah]

Ok, well I guess I will be the one who has to say that I would disagree with everyone here.

I grew up in a very divorced family (and both parents Christians). It has been painful even though I am an adult now. The bottom line on why Christians divorce like everyone else is because they are people like everyone else. Christ promises us that if we bend our will to Him ..our life will look different from others. Most Christians claim the cross but never really come to understand what it means to give over their desires to God. (which affords the entire sin subject) So, my parents married out of selfish reasons. They also divorced for selfish reasons. Neither gave their pride and the "I want" to God. He says we quarrel because we don't get what we want. Now, 30 years later they have come to the point where they are seeing that their life, as a Christian, should not be about them, but about Christ. If they had applied that to their first as they have to their second they would have done better.

We are the traditional family...husband bread winner, wife at home and we HAVE adopted a child. No, I do not think that same sex 'marriage' should be allowed to be given the creedence of 'family' or adoption. It is a well documented subject that homosexual unions bring in an average of 100 partners a year...wouldn't call that very stable. (secular university studies).
Call me a homophobe and I guess I can call you a bigot....give me the same space to have my view as you. And there is the real question....because I do not, nor will I, change my view on accepting this trend does that make me a homophobic? Well, I guess if you have a problem with the Biblical/Christian view you could be easily labled a Christaphobe. So, please don't anyone go there if they don't like that I don't think same sex 'family' is good.

Another well observed fact is nations have crumbled after converting to homosexuality. It undermines the foundations of a nation.

From a Bible pov God made a man...then God made a woman. Hmmm...Why God did call it "GOOD!" ??? It is the boundaries God has set to be natural (jeezzee...just take some time to see how everything made with man and woman work to compliment each other)...and you get a baby to boot! What a blessing from shared love....something a same sex couple....WILL NEVER HAVE.

 

[Icystwolf]

Heres one for the atheist to hack about me.

I put down different view.

I think all that belong to Jesus are all in one family. That way, single mothers can still be part of a family with Jesus, if their family background rejects them. Or is a homeless person, whom never experienced the love and joy of a family, will be part of one with Jesus.

 

[Icystwolf]

Very kind of you. Even tho I am not an atheist, I still find it interesting that their divorce rates are lower than evangelical christians, by 5 points. It really makes you wonder what all this talk of "morality" and "values" is really all about.

I too must wonder now, the quality of evangelical churchs to mainstream people. Theres too many churchs out there that don't seem to have the value of Jesus in it...the one I go to is the closest one I could find that seems to be on the right track.

Churchs like hillsong, seem more commercial, presbyterian seems weak,then theres the bunch of lukewarm churches but the Alliance church is very good-> It produced heaps of strong Christians in the past...better than myself....and they themselves are smacking atheists with a wet towl.....the one I go to is the Evangelical Anglican church.

The two churches, Alliance and Evangelical Anglican have very very low divorce rates as far as I'm aware of it....

 

[tcampen]

Yes, that's why I go to a Unitarian Universalist church.

 

[Diatrive]

the Alliance church is very good-> It produced heaps of strong Christians in the past...better than myself....and they themselves are smacking atheists with a wet towl....

You make it sound like a training ground as opposed to a place of worship.

You should thank us, as it seems the only thing you think about is atheists. Well . . . ."monsters are the the... most eentersting people" Bugs Bunny