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evolution question

Chriliman

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If Pasteur did not see God create life during his experiment, does that disprove creationism?

If God exists then Pasteur was already observing God's creation, therefore it would be impossible to prove that God did not create everything. Trying to disprove that God created everything is a vein effort. Trying to prove God created everything is also a vein effort because only God can prove He is alive.
 
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Loudmouth

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If God exists then Pasteur was already observing God's creation,

If abiogenesis already happened, then Pasteur was already observing life created by abiogenesis.

therefore it would be impossible to prove that God did not create everything.

How do you think Pasteur disproved abiogenesis?
 
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Chriliman

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If abiogenesis already happened, then Pasteur was already observing life created by abiogenesis.



How do you think Pasteur disproved abiogenesis?

Do you believe he disproved abiogenesis? If so then he proved abiogenesis cannot create life.

Which means you're still searching for the truth behind what created life.
 
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bhsmte

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Do you believe he disproved abiogenesis? If so then he proved abiogenesis cannot create life.

Which means you're still searching for the truth behind what created life.

Did you avoid his simple direct questions on purpose?
 
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Chriliman

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I don't think Pasteur disproved abiogenesis because his methods were completely incapable of doing so.

What do you think?

I'll be honest, I'm not an expert on abiogenesis. Is it basically that life was spontaneously created from non-life?
 
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Chriliman

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Did you avoid his simple direct questions on purpose?

No. I answered his question. But knowing what he believes is important for me to figure out his perspective so I can view things from his perspective and ask appropriate questions.
 
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bhsmte

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No. I answered his question. But knowing what he believes is important for me to figure out his perspective so I can view things from his perspective and ask appropriate questions.

When asked a simple question directed to you, it is not required to know what the other person believes, only what you believe, since the question was asked, of you.

Would you change your answer, depending on what someone else believes?
 
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Chriliman

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I consider it to be a spontaneous product of natural processes.

Okay, but that means natural processes creates lightning in a different way than life. Otherwise we could observe life being spontaneously created just like we can observe lighting being spontaneously created. Agree?
 
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keith99

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LOL! So exactly what are YOUR credentials to question the Ph.D in his respective field that's published and also cited in secular work? I can't WAIT to hear this!

Point or order!

Dr GS Hurd was not so much questioning the man's credentials as pointing out your misrepresentation of what he said.
 
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Loudmouth

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Okay, but that means natural processes creates lightning in a different way than life.

Yes, they would be different processes. I just wanted to be clear on what spontaneous meant in case is was misinterpreted as magical poofing or something.

Otherwise we could observe life being spontaneously created just like we can observe lighting being spontaneously created. Agree?

We could observe life being spontaneously produced by natural processes, if the conditions are right and if we watch long enough. The tough part is figuring out the conditions that are needed.
 
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Ada Lovelace

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Again, just asking for some equal "air time" in the classrooms. ALL theories should be taught otherwise it's academically dishonest to censor other theories just because secularists believe it's the only one that "makes sense."

If ALL theories, regardless as to whether they were actually scientific theories, were taught equally in science classrooms people would graduate from high school at age 30. So you believe equal air time should be given to teaching the creation theories of the Law of Manu about Brahman thinking the world into existence, or Boshongo who vomited the world into existence, or the African Fon mother-creator Mawu who created everything from the back of the rainbow serpent Aido Hwedo? They really aren't any stranger than the Genesis fable of God speaking the world into being; they are just less familiar. Creation myths are ubiquitous throughout humankind because humans have an innate curiosity to know the how, when, and why of life. Religion scholar Charles Long categorized the types of creation theories as creation from nothing (ex nihilo); creation from a preexisting, undifferentiated or chaotic state represented by primal elements or sometimes a primal object such as the cosmetic egg (chaos); creation from the union, division, sacrifice, or separation of parents (world parents); creation by way of a hole in the earth (emergence); and creation by means of diving into the depths of the primordial waters (earth-diver). Each classification has numerous distinctive creation theories that human civilizations have used to formulate their religious beliefs and ethos; organize their lives; and provide an explanation for how the world was created, why, what happens when they die, and what their purpose should be. It was common for creation theories to be treated as etiological and given credence by the scholars of their time. Their beliefs were as immutable, proud, and confident as some YECs are today. All you need to do is go to Greece, Italy, and Turkey to see the ruins of the majestic temples to understand how sacred and profound their creation theories were to them. The creation theory you are most likely to subscribe to is the one your parents and those in your community believe in. It's why Young Earth Creationism is prevalent in certain rural communities and virtually unheard of in others.

Many Christians view the Genesis creation story as a hallowed allegory, as having profound truths about human nature and God's, but not being a literal explanation of how the universe and life within it were created. There are parallelisms between it and the creation theories of other enduring religions that were or are dominant. Viewed in that light it's actually harmonious with the scientific facts that have been established. What's resonated to me the most about teachings of evolution is how universal it is; it doesn't belong to one religion, or one culture; it's the science of humankind. I first learned about it when I was seven from an exhibit at the Australia Museum in Sydney, and when we were back in the States I saw how it was aligned with what is taught at the Smithsonian. I've also gone to natural history museums in Shanghai, London, Madrid, Buenos Aires, New Zealand, and Russia and found remarkable consistency, whereas religious beliefs vary dramatically around the world.
 
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