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Evolution/Creation on Trial

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joshua 1 9

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How many people did you find and where did you find them?
Not that many as they lead you to believe. Mostly just doing a Google search. I was more doing a comparison of pre civilized man's health vs civilized man. It is well established that hunter gathers were more healthy.
 
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Goonie

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We would expect the fly to evolve into a different sort of insect. A dragonfly or something. Yet you start with a fly and you end up with a fly. Lots of evidence for micro evolution, no evidence for macro evolution.
And over millions of years what do all these micro evolutions add up to? I'll give you a clue it begins with macro.
 
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[serious]

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We would expect the fly to evolve into a different sort of insect. A dragonfly or something. Yet you start with a fly and you end up with a fly. Lots of evidence for micro evolution, no evidence for macro evolution.
No, we just said that ISN'T what evolution is. One type doesn't change into another. One type splits into novel types. An early fly might split into fruit flies and house flies, but both are still flies. That early fruit fly might split into the common fruit fly and the asian fruit fly, but both are still fruit flies which in turn are still flies. If a group of those common fruit flies then speciate into a new species, they will still be a subset of common fruit flies, which are still fruit flies, which are still flies, which are still insects, which are still hexapods, which are still arthropods, which are still bilateria, which are still animals, which are still eukaryotes.
 
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joshua 1 9

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How does extinctions and explosions fit into this?
 
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Not_By_Chance

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Well said. Believers who put their faith in evolution just don't seem to get this and when we ask for evidence in the fossil record of one species changing into another species (not a variant of the same species) they can't provide any. Then there are the artists impressions of what they think a creature looked like, based perhaps on one or two fragments of bone. Where is all the overwhelming evidence for evolution then? I'll tell you where, it's in the imaginations of those who adhere to the faith.
 
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Archaeopteryx

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Well said. Believers who put their faith in evolution just don't seem to get this and when we ask for evidence in the fossil record of one species changing into another species (not a variant of the same species) they can't provide any.
Perhaps it's because you expect to see something ridiculous, like a crocoduck.
 
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Not_By_Chance

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Or, a non-Christian, who has rejected Jesus, finds out that the words that Jesus spoke are true as he stands before him on the great day of judgement...

Mat 12:30 "Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.
Mat 12:31 And so I tell you, people will be forgiven every sin and blasphemy. But blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.
Mat 12:32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.
Mat 12:33 "Make a tree good and its fruit will be good, or make a tree bad and its fruit will be bad, for a tree is recognized by its fruit.
Mat 12:34 You brood of vipers, how can you who are evil say anything good? For out of the overflow of the heart the mouth speaks.
Mat 12:35 Good people bring good things out of the good stored up in them, and evil people bring evil things out of the evil stored up in them.
Mat 12:36 But I tell you that people will have to give account on the day of judgment for every empty word they have spoken.
Mat 12:37 For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned."

and also this...

Joh 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.

even more worrying for the non-believer...

Rev 20:10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Rev 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. The earth and the heavens fled from his presence, and there was no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books.
Rev 20:13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and everyone was judged according to what they had done.
Rev 20:14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
Rev 20:15 All whose names were not found written in the book of life were thrown into the lake of fire.

I don't think there will be much joking go on.
 
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HitchSlap

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News flash: The gospels are fiction, Jesus never existed, & ToE is as robust as they come.



 
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lasthero

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We don't have to look in the fossil record to see new species emerging. That's happened in real time.

Type 'speciation' into google.
 
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HitchSlap

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How does extinctions and explosions fit into this?
Sorry, but as a creationist, you're not allowed to use data collected by real scientists.

I do have a question for you though, there have been five mass extinctions in earth's history; how do you think species repopulated the earth, if not evolution?
 
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[serious]

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How does extinctions and explosions fit into this?
Starting where we are now, let's say that something kills off a large amount of the mammals on earth. Heck, let's say everything but rats. All those lineages that were lost, pigs, dogs, horses, etc. are gone and will never return. Since rats are the only mammal left, all mammals from that point on will be rats. Those rats probably initially have lots of resources since they are all that's left, so the spread throughout the world (as they have proven good at doing already). Now you have rats all over the world competing with each other in different environments. As they compete for those local resources, they change. eventually you have rats that are accomplished tree climbers to get at fruit first, others that that get better at hunting insects, etc. Eventually, they evolve to fit the various niches in which they find themselves.The massive number of available niches paves the way for an explosion of speciation.
 
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Goonie

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And jesus also said
"For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and will then repay every man according to his deeds. Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom. (Matthew 16: 27, 28) christianity is still waiting, all those who stood there are almost 2000 years dead.
 
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AV1611VET

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News flash: The gospels are fiction, Jesus never existed, & ToE is as robust as they come.
I'm not sure what channel you're watching, but for the record:
Virtually all modern scholars of antiquity agree that Jesus existed historically,
SOURCE
 
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[serious]

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Why would we expect to see something that evolution says shouldn't ever happen?
 
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HitchSlap

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I'm not sure what channel you're watching, but for the record:SOURCE
The Reality channel. (Not that that matters to you, the bible says it settles it mantra of yours.)
But for anyone else not immune to reality, the evidence for a literal Jesus is non-existent, and, based on prior probabilities, puts Jesus squarely into the 'mythical savior deity' camp.
 
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AV1611VET

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The Reality channel.
In that case, whose reality is bigger?

Myopic science's?

Or the Bible's?

Hint:[VERSE=2 Kings 6:17,KJV]And Elisha prayed, and said, LORD, I pray thee, open his eyes, that he may see. And the LORD opened the eyes of the young man; and he saw: and, behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire round about Elisha.[/VERSE]
HitchSlap said:
But for anyone else not immune to reality, the evidence for a literal Jesus is non-existent,
Oh-oh!

Caught an Arab phone here!

First you said:
Jesus never existed.
Now you're saying:
The evidence for a literal Jesus is non-existent.
 
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HitchSlap

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Reality is not a choice. There is only one reality. You just choose to ignore it.

Yes, highly unlikely, based on prior probability that Jesus was a mythical savior deity. So unlikely, as to confidently say he didn't exist. Based on prior probability of Jesus being nothing but a typical (at least 15 identified priors) mythical savior deity, that to prove a literal Jesus, there would have to be overwhelming evidence to the contrary, of which there is none.
 
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AV1611VET

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Reality is not a choice.
But belief in its size and contents are.
HitchSlap said:
There is only one reality. You just choose to ignore it.
Not even close.
HitchSlap said:
Yes, highly unlikely, based on prior probability that Jesus was a mythical savior deity.
Oh, now we're going to factor in 'savior deity,' aren't we?

Ever since I showed you the article from Wikipedia that disagrees with your initial statement, you've been changing your words.

However, let's simplify this discussion and go back to the beginning.

In your opinion and right to believe what you want to believe, did (or does) Jesus exist or not?
 
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joshua 1 9

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how does this differ from the Bible where we are told God will preserve a remnants to repopulate the earth. Even a close reading of genesis says man is to replenish the earth.
 
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crjmurray

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That's why I've asked to be buried with figs.
 
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