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Not exactly. The Pharisees, that famous Hebrew group, also taught life after death.yes and also the immortal "soul" concept is from greek philosophers.
Not exactly. The Pharisees, that famous Hebrew group, also taught life after death.
I always have found this point interesting because of all the criticism that the Bible otherwise directs at the Pharisees (legalists, hypocrites, etc.).
Not exactly. The Pharisees, that famous Hebrew group, also taught life after death.
I always have found this point interesting because of all the criticism that the Bible otherwise directs at the Pharisees (legalists, hypocrites, etc.).
In Jesus' teaching at the dinner in the prominent Pharisee's house (Lk 14:1-17:10), he presented several parables: on Israel's unbelief (14:15-24), the cost of being his disciple (14:25-33), on spiritual death and rebirth (15:1-7, 8-10, 11-32), shrewdness in the Christian life (16:1-9); as well as teachings on faithfulness and trustworthiness (16:10-13), the sureness of God's word (16:16-18); and the parable of the rich man and Lazarus (16:19-31), which is what is pertinent here.from an immortal soul aspect? Where are the verses?
In Jesus' teaching at the dinner in the prominent Pharisee's house (Lk 14:1-17:10), he presented several parables: on Israel's unbelief (14:15-24), the cost of being his disciple (14:25-33), on spiritual death and rebirth (15:1-7, 8-10, 11-32), shrewdness in the Christian life (16:1-9); as well as teachings on faithfulness and trustworthiness (16:10-13), the sureness of God's word (16:16-18); and the parable of the rich man and Lazarus (16:19-31), which is what is pertinent here.
Jesus presents Lazarus after death, not as in oblivion, but in Abraham's bosom (by his side), alive to take water to the rich man, and to warn the man's brothers.
Likewise, with Paul in 2Co 5:6-9, where he equates absence from the body and presence with the Lord, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord (v.8), and not in oblivion.
The NT presents the human spirit as immortal.
.
No, its focus is the agony of the immortal spirit of the rich man in the fire of Hades, (v.24) and the unbelief of the Jews (the five brothers), who would not believe even a man (Jesus Christ) who had come back from the dead.The Lazarus story is a parable ... and ... (I agree to disagree)
it's focus is on the greedy rich ... it is not a teaching about an immortal spirit
Php 1:21-24 makes clear that it is exactly what it is: where Paul prefers to be away from the body; that it is better by far to depart; that to die is gain. It is all preferable and better because death means he will be with Christ.Paul states he would RATHER be absent from His body and present with the Lord ... of which any of us would prefer that as well. It is not a teaching that we have an immortal soul ... there is nothing immortal about us .... it is one of the main points when Jesus returns that is when we are changed and receive immortality.
The mortal to be clothed with the immortal is the body, not the spirit. The body will be immortal at the resurrection.1st Corinthians 15:53
In an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must be clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality
God alone is immortal in himself, the origin and source of the immortality of all spirits--angelic, fallen (Satanic) and human, all immortality comes from him, just as he alone has life in himself, and is the source of all life, physical, spirit and spiritual.1 Timothy 6:16
14Keep this commandment without stain or reproach until the appearance of our Lord Jesus Christ, 15which the blessed and only Sovereign One— the King of kings and Lord of lords— will bring about in His own time. 16He alone is immortal and dwells in unapproachable light. No one has ever seen Him, nor can anyone see Him
Not according to Jesus and Paul.There is nothing immortal about us until Jesus returns.
In Jesus' teaching at the dinner in the prominent Pharisee's house (Lk 14:1-17:10), he presented several parables: on Israel's unbelief (14:15-24), the cost of being his disciple (14:25-33), on spiritual death and rebirth (15:1-7, 8-10, 11-32), shrewdness in the Christian life (16:1-9); as well as teachings on faithfulness and trustworthiness (16:10-13), the sureness of God's word (16:16-18); and the parable of the rich man and Lazarus (16:19-31), which is what is pertinent here.
Jesus presents Lazarus after death, not as in oblivion, but in Abraham's bosom (by his side), alive to take water to the rich man, and to warn the man's brothers.
Likewise, with Paul in 2Co 5:6-9, where he equates absence from the body and presence with the Lord, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord (v.8), and not in oblivion.
The NT presents the human spirit as immortal.
.
No, its focus is on unbelief of the Jews, who would not believe even a man who had come back from the dead (Jesus Christ).
And its focus on the point does not negate the premise (immortality of the spirit) on which the parable is based.
It's more clearly stated in Php 1:21-24: where he prefers to be away from the body; that it is better by far to depart; that to die is gain. It is better because he will be with Christ,
If death of the body means oblivion of his spirit, for what reason would he prefer death when to live is Christ?
The mortal is the body, not the spirit. The body will be immortal at the resurrection.
He alone has immortality in himself, just as he alone has life in himself.
Nt according to Jesus and Paul.
God alone is immortal in himself, the origin and source of all immortality--the angels, human spirits--all immortality comes from him, just as he alone is life in himself, and the source of all life--physical, spirit and spiritual.I don't know how more clear this is. . .
14Keep this commandment without stain or reproach until the appearance of our Lord Jesus Christ, 15. . .the King of kings and Lord of lords— will bring about in His own time. 16He alone is immortal and dwells in unapproachable light. No one has ever seen Him, nor can anyone see Him
God alone is immortal in himself, the origin and source of all immortality--the angels, human spirits--all immortality comes from him, just as he alone is life in himself, and the source of all life--physical, spirit and spiritual.
Scripture does not contradict itself.
Your understanding of 1Ti 16:16 sets Scripture against itself in Php 1:21-24.
Yes immortality does come from Him ... but we don't become immortal until He returns.
1 Corinthians 15:54
English Standard Version
Again, two things:When the perishable puts on the imperishable, and the mortal puts on immortality, then shall come to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”
Again, two things:
1) In that passage (1Co 15:35-54), Paul is speaking of the body:
sown perishable (subject to decay), raised imperishable (v.42);
sown a natural body, raised a spiritual (sinless, glorious, powerful, imperishable) body (v.45), in contrast
to the natural body, "flesh and blood" (v.50) which is sinful, dishonorable, perishable, weak (vv. 42-43);
which mortal (subject to death), perishable (subject to decay) body must clothe itself
with the imperishable (not subject to decay), immortal (not subject to death) body of the resurrection, because the natural body--flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God (v.50).
2) Your understanding of 1Ti 6:16 contradicts Jesus' parable (Lk 16:9-31) and
Paul (Php 1:21-24), both on immortality of the spirit,
as well as misapplies to our spirit what Paul teaches regarding our resurrection body (1Co 15:35-54).
Since Scripture does not contradict itself; your understanding is incorrect.
Yes, as Paul shows in 1Co 15:36-50, our bodies do not have immortality now.Yeah ... when He returns we get new bodies .... heavenly ones.
1 Corinthians 15:36-50
You foolish person! What you sow does not come to life unless it dies. And what you sow is not the body that is to be, but a bare kernel, perhaps of wheat or of some other grain.
But God gives it a body as he has chosen, and to each kind of seed its own body. For not all flesh is the same, but there is one kind for humans, another for animals, another for birds, and another for fish.
There are heavenly bodies and earthly bodies, but the glory of the heavenly is of one kind, and the glory of the earthly is of another.
Never in Scripture are the words "immortal" or "immortality" used in reference to mankind in his earthly, fallen existence. Christian believers "seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life" (Rom. 2:7, KJV).
We do not have immortality now; we are looking forward to it.
Paul is referring there back to his doxology of 1:17.Immortality at the second advent (1 Cor. 15:51-54) is possible because Christ earned it for us on Calvary (2 Tim. 1:10). By comparison with earthly humans, God "only hath immortality"
(1 Tim. 6:16).
His focus was on it being better by far to depart, on prefering to be away from the body (so if his spirit is in oblivion who/what is "away from the body"), because to die is gain.Every believer has the assurance that Christ will bestow immortality upon him at the second advent.
Paul was looking forward to the resurrection of the body at the second advent (Rom. 8:11, 22, 23; Phil. 3:20, 21; 1 Cor. 15:4-44).
His focus was not on being a disembodied spirit after death but on being with Christ on the resurrection morning (2 Tim. 4:8; 1 Cor. 15:51-54).
Yes, as Paul shows in 1Co 15:36-50, our bodies do not have immortality now.
But as Paul (Php 1:21-24) and Jesus show (Lk 16:9-31), our spirits are immortal now.
Paul is referring there back to his doxology of 1:17.
His focus was on it being better by far to depart, on prefering to be away from the body,because to die is gain.
It is all preferable and better because death means he will be with Christ, which is his focus.
So if, as you say, death of the body means oblivion of his spirit, for what reason would he prefer death when to live is Christ?
Paul makes absence from the body equivalent to presence with the Lord, which was his focus.
Again, your understanding of 1Ti 6:16 makes Scripture contradict itself in Jesus's parable (Lk 16:9-31),
as well as in Paul's declaration (Php 121-24) that it is far better to depart (to die).
Again, as demonstrated from the NT by Paul (Php 1:21-24) andIn the Old Testament, man is referred to as a "soul" (Hebrew nephesh) more than 130 times. The first place we find nephesh in reference to mankind is in the second chapter of Genesis: "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul" (Genesis 2:7, KJV).
The word translated "soul" in this verse is again the Hebrew word nephesh. Other translations of the Bible state that man became a living "being" or "person." This verse does not say that Adam had an immortal soul; rather it says that God breathed into Adam the "breath of life," and Adam became a living soul. At the end of his days, when the breath of life left Adam, he died and returned to dust.
The Old Testament plainly teaches that the soul dies. God told Adam and Eve, two "living souls," that they would "surely die" if they disobeyed Him (Genesis 2:17). God also told Adam that He had taken him from the dust of the earth and he would return to dust (Genesis 3:19).
Among the plainer statements in the Bible about what happens to the soul at death are Ezekiel 18:4 and 18:20. Both passages clearly state that "the soul who sins shall die." Again, the word for "soul" here is nephesh. In fact, this same word was even used of corpses—dead bodies (see Leviticus 22:4; Numbers 5:2; Numbers 6:11; Numbers 9:6-10).
Not only do all these scriptures show that the soul indeed can and does die, but the soul is identified as a physical being—not a separate spirit entity with existence independent of its physical host.
The Lazarus story is a parable ... and it's focus is on the greedy rich ... it is not a teaching about an immortal spirit ... (I agree to disagree)
Paul states he would RATHER be absent from His body and present with the Lord ... of which any of us would prefer that as well. It is not a teaching that we have an immortal soul ... there is nothing immortal about us .... it is one of the main points when Jesus returns that is when we are changed and receive immortality.
1st Corinthians 15:53
In an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must be clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality
1 Timothy 6:16
14Keep this commandment without stain or reproach until the appearance of our Lord Jesus Christ, 15which the blessed and only Sovereign One— the King of kings and Lord of lords— will bring about in His own time. 16He alone is immortal and dwells in unapproachable light. No one has ever seen Him, nor can anyone see Him
There is nothing immortal about us until Jesus returns.
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