Eucharist

[FaithT]

Feel free to ask more questions regarding Mary, Purgatory, and the Saints in here if you want! God bless you and keep you

Thank you so much Riley! I think that the posters (LCMS posters) who are concerned about intercessory prayers to Mary and the Saints and the whole Purgatory belief feel as they do because they say none of those things are in the Bible. And the LCMS is Sola Scriptura.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Thanks! That’s a LOOOOONG encyclical. I’ll read it when I’ve got the time.

It is one of the cornerstone encyclicals of pope John Paul II along with 'Veritatis Splendor' that should be required reading for every Christian. ‘The Splendor of Truth,’ and Why It Still Matters

Some people on another Christian forum think it’s foolish to have so many problems with the LCMSs church teaching on evolution and age of the universe, but it just doesn’t sit well with me.

It's a solid error of science, and it could create other errors that may be theological. Not the biggest error ever. Actually Catholic teaching on it is that it is unresolved so there is freedom. One may be a Catholic creationist or a Catholic evolutionist, either way within certain bounds. Catholics can be like that on lots of things. We don't want another Galileo, while other groups proudly are willing to have their own new Galileo's. There sometimes is just one way but there sometimes is freedom to follow your brain. That said, I like lots of other things about both LCMS and WELS. Way more than ELCA.

My husband started going to church at the LCMS I speak of and he is fairly liberal and he too believes in evolution and an old age for the universe but it doesn’t bother him. IF I return to the RCC I’ll go with him to the LCMS sometimes just so he doesn’t have to go alone. He only started going there because I did. And he’ll never become Catholic.

He could some day surprise you. There are lots of people who said they could 'never ever' become Catholic. But they did. I married one. She said 'never ever'. I asked her why. In investigating her 'never ever' reasons she discovered they were a house of cards and she surprised herself. That said, you are kind to have some solidarity with him planning to go with him sometimes.

 

[FaithT]

It is one of the cornerstone encyclicals of pope John Paul II along with 'Veritatis Splendor' that should be required reading for every Christian. ‘The Splendor of Truth,’ and Why It Still Matters

It's a solid error of science, and it could create other errors that may be theological. Not the biggest error ever. Actually Catholic teaching on it is that it is unresolved so there is freedom. One may be a Catholic creationist or a Catholic evolutionist, either way within certain bounds. Catholics can be like that on lots of things. We don't want another Galileo, while other groups proudly are willing to have their own new Galileo's. There sometimes is just one way but there sometimes is freedom to follow your brain. That said, I like lots of other things about both LCMS and WELS. Way more than ELCA.

He could some day surprise you. There are lots of people who said they could 'never ever' become Catholic. But they did. I married one. She said 'never ever'. I asked her why. In investigating her 'never ever' reasons she discovered they were a house of cards and she surprised herself. That said, you are kind to have some solidarity with him planning to go with him sometimes.

I have a friend in the ELCA who’s invited me to her church but besides the fact that they’re really liberal, there’s none near here and I don’t want to drive out to where she goes.

 

[FaithT]

It is one of the cornerstone encyclicals of pope John Paul II along with 'Veritatis Splendor' that should be required reading for every Christian. ‘The Splendor of Truth,’ and Why It Still Matters

It's a solid error of science, and it could create other errors that may be theological. Not the biggest error ever. Actually Catholic teaching on it is that it is unresolved so there is freedom. One may be a Catholic creationist or a Catholic evolutionist, either way within certain bounds. Catholics can be like that on lots of things. We don't want another Galileo, while other groups proudly are willing to have their own new Galileo's. There sometimes is just one way but there sometimes is freedom to follow your brain. That said, I like lots of other things about both LCMS and WELS. Way more than ELCA.

He could some day surprise you. There are lots of people who said they could 'never ever' become Catholic. But they did. I married one. She said 'never ever'. I asked her why. In investigating her 'never ever' reasons she discovered they were a house of cards and she surprised herself. That said, you are kind to have some solidarity with him planning to go with him sometimes.

My husband did surprise me by going to the LCMS. He wasn’t a churchgoer at all (except Christmas and Easter) until sometime around Easter of this year. So maybe there’s hope. However, he was raised Protestant (First Baptist Church) and his reasoning for not wanting to go regularly to a Catholic Church is because he wasn’t raised Catholic. But like I told him, he wasn’t raised Lutheran either. IMO, his beliefs, as far as science goes, line up more with Catholicism than Lutheran LCMS.

 

[Gnarwhal]

My husband did surprise me by going to the LCMS. He wasn’t a churchgoer at all (except Christmas and Easter) until sometime around Easter of this year. So maybe there’s hope. However, he was raised Protestant (First Baptist Church) and his reasoning for not wanting to go regularly to a Catholic Church is because he wasn’t raised Catholic. But like I told him, he wasn’t raised Lutheran either. IMO, his beliefs, as far as science goes, line up more with Catholicism than Lutheran LCMS.

Is he willing to check it out and just see what we thinks after a fair shake?

 

[FaithT]

Is he willing to check it out and just see what we thinks after a fair shake?

Yes, he’s been there with me a number of times. Holidays, funerals, weddings and the rare regular weekend Mass. He’s not interested.
I’m not even certain that I‘M returning yet.

 

[fide]

That IS another big issue for me with LCMS and especially WELS. Catholics are free to believe that faith and reason are not in conflict. LCMS and WELS force them to be in conflict on evolution, geology, cosmology, and the fossil record. To me there is something wrong with forcing that conflict. Were I to have to be Lutheran I would have to be on the conservative LCMS or WELS side, but their positions on evolution and the history of creation makes that a problem for me too. I want a place where I do not have to 'suspend my disbelief'. It's like watching a science fiction movie. If the movie is really good you don't notice that the physics is just impossible. You just follow the story. A not so good movie and you notice all sorts of issues like that and the movie becomes more of a farce than a good story. Creationism does that for me. It points out the conflict between faith and reason, between dogma and science. At least for Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to put the 'fides' and the 'ratio' together. That was the message of pope John Paul II's encyclical Fides et Ratio, which I recommend especially for you, found here: Fides et Ratio (14 September 1998) | John Paul II

I'm sorry to read that you trust scientists more than Faith. I did not say "science" I said "scientists." They practically define "science" within the field of science. Men are men, and they corrupt any institution they inhabit. Surely the recent shameful swamp revealed within God's Holy Church has proven that appraisal. When I returned to the Church, I was shocked to hear and read of the faith that intelligent, educated, prayerful Catholic men and women - educators, clergy - have in "science". A gross over-reaction, over-correction of the arrogant excessive fideism of the past. We have lost the science of the past, the science of faithful scientists who sought to explore the wonderful creation of God. They had it right. I would expect that they would never get work or even recognition in their field today, unless they would repent of their blindness: actual credence in divine revelation, and active divine Presence in the creation today. "Either God OR Mammon" still holds, and in the secularized world of today, Mammon is the magic word.

End of my venting.

 

[fide]

I disagree with the LCMS’s refusal to believe in evolution, age of the universe, among other things. I was bored in the RCC but now I’m getting bored with my church and went to a Catholic Mass a few weeks ago and am missing their Eucharist, Confession, rosary etc.

Have you ever explored The Kolbe Center? I haven't for some time now, but was happily surprised that it exists - a Catholic center for the study of creation - patron saint St. Maximilian Maria Kolbe OFMConv.

 

[chevyontheriver]

I'm sorry to read that you trust scientists more than Faith. I did not say "science" I said "scientists." They practically define "science" within the field of science. Men are men, and they corrupt any institution they inhabit. Surely the recent shameful swamp revealed within God's Holy Church has proven that appraisal. When I returned to the Church, I was shocked to hear and read of the faith that intelligent, educated, prayerful Catholic men and women - educators, clergy - have in "science". A gross over-reaction, over-correction of the arrogant excessive fideism of the past. We have lost the science of the past, the science of faithful scientists who sought to explore the wonderful creation of God. They had it right. I would expect that they would never get work or even recognition in their field today, unless they would repent of their blindness: actual credence in divine revelation, and active divine Presence in the creation today. "Either God OR Mammon" still holds, and in the secularized world of today, Mammon is the magic word.

End of my venting.

You can vent if you want to. I trust the rocks. Not the scientists. They all are, like me, fallible and sinful. But a rock is neither fallible nor sinful. It can only tell a truth. I have spent a long time with fossils. And it’s not fossils vs faith but fossils and faith. I don’t have to deny one to have the other.

 

[FaithT]

Have you ever explored The Kolbe Center? I haven't for some time now, but was happily surprised that it exists - a Catholic center for the study of creation - patron saint St. Maximilian Maria Kolbe OFMConv.

I don’t think so.

View attachment 335808

 

[chevyontheriver]

I have a friend in the ELCA who’s invited me to her church but besides the fact that they’re really liberal, there’s none near here and I don’t want to drive out to where she goes.

They are GENERALLY liberal, too much so for me. But there are a few exceptions here and there. I used to live near Luther Northwestern Seminary and I was blown away by how anti-Catholic the seminarians were, not concerning the old canards but how woke they were and how they disliked Catholicism for not being woke enough for them.

 

[chevyontheriver]

My husband did surprise me by going to the LCMS. He wasn’t a churchgoer at all (except Christmas and Easter) until sometime around Easter of this year. So maybe there’s hope. However, he was raised Protestant (First Baptist Church) and his reasoning for not wanting to go regularly to a Catholic Church is because he wasn’t raised Catholic. But like I told him, he wasn’t raised Lutheran either. IMO, his beliefs, as far as science goes, line up more with Catholicism than Lutheran LCMS.

Be patient with him and with yourself. Pray, and maybe be surprised. God is good.

 

[RileyG]

I have a friend in the ELCA who’s invited me to her church but besides the fact that they’re really liberal, there’s none near here and I don’t want to drive out to where she goes.

Interesting. They're the most popular Lutheran denomination.

 

[RileyG]

They are GENERALLY liberal, too much so for me. But there are a few exceptions here and there. I used to live near Luther Northwestern Seminary and I was blown away by how anti-Catholic the seminarians were, not concerning the old canards but how woke they were and how they disliked Catholicism for not being woke enough for them.

Not surprising. We do not give into their liberal agenda. People think not ordaining women is sexist, "love is love." Lord, have mercy.

 

[FaithT]

Interesting. They're the most popular Lutheran denomination.

Somebody else told me that, too. We’ve got two LCMS churches near here, though. One in our suburb and the other just outside our suburb.

 

[FaithT]

Not surprising. We do not give into their liberal agenda. People think not ordaining women is sexist, "love is love." Lord, have mercy.

That’s one of several disagreements I have with this ELCA-going friend of mine.I think her pastor is a woman and the friend is very liberal regarding same sex marriage. Then again, my husband has become much more liberal about that (SSM) as he ages.

 

[FaithT]

Read in USA TODAY: A whale of a discovery: Alabama teen, teacher discover 34-million-year-old whale skull — USA TODAY


If I weren’t thinking about returning to Catholicism this particular article would have really bothered me. Every week it seems there’s something in the news that indicates an old earth and or universe.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Read in USA TODAY: A whale of a discovery: Alabama teen, teacher discover 34-million-year-old whale skull — USA TODAY


If I weren’t thinking about returning to Catholicism this particular article would have really bothered me. Every week it seems there’s something in the news that indicates an old earth and or universe.

I remember people telling me that God only made the earth to 'look' old to fool people. That just didn't work for me. If the earth is young it should 'look' young so that people can figure it out and not be fooled. If, for example, continental drift happens in a young earth the continents should drift a few hundred miles a year every year. It's way way less than that.

 

[RileyG]

Somebody else told me that, too. We’ve got two LCMS churches near here, though. One in our suburb and the other just outside our suburb.

That's very interesting. It must be a conservative area.

 

[RileyG]

Read in USA TODAY: A whale of a discovery: Alabama teen, teacher discover 34-million-year-old whale skull — USA TODAY


If I weren’t thinking about returning to Catholicism this particular article would have really bothered me. Every week it seems there’s something in the news that indicates an old earth and or universe.

You need to follow your conscience. If LCMS young earth creation bothers you, then tell your pastor.