eternal progression

[gort]

Is this an accurate view of eternal progression?

 

[Romans5:1]

Is this an accurate view of eternal progression?

Since the Tanner's put it together, the typical Mormon response it going to be, "Oh, that is just their opinion," "We don't believe that," "That's not official doctrine," or something equally misguided, evasive, or meaningless. That said, yes, it is an accurate view. Thank you!

 

[Rescued One]

Well, honey, it's like this:

Matthew 22
30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

Doctrine & Covenants 132
37 Abraham received concubines, and they bore him children; and it was accounted unto him for righteousness, because they were given unto him, and he abode in my law; as Isaac also and Jacob did none other things than that which they were commanded; and because they did none other things than that which they were commanded, they have entered into their exaltation according to the promises, and sit upon thrones, and are not angels but are gods.

God himself was once as we are now and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! That is the great secret… I say, if you were to see him today, you would see him like a man in form - like yourselves in all the personage, image, and very form as a man - Joseph Smith, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith p345


God himself is increasing and progressing in knowledge, power, and dominion, and will do so, worlds without end - Wilford Woodruff, Journal of Discourses 6:120
God himself was once as we are now and is and exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! That is the great secret… I say, if you were to see him today, you would see him like a man in form - like yourselves in all the personage, image, and very form as a man - Joseph Smith, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith p345

But Joseph Smith didn't always teach them official doctrine. He just liked to get them excited over new ideas that were really his own.

 

[leeuniverse]

NOpe.... Nearly every step is a "perversion" of our beliefs!!!!

Go to LDS.org or your local Deseret Book store in the Missionary section or something to see an ACTUAL diagram of what LDS have as Doctrine, because your's is FULL of speculation and falsehood mostly from the anti-side, not Doctrine of the Church.

 

[leeuniverse]

But Joseph Smith didn't always teach them official doctrine. He just liked to get them excited over new ideas that were really his own.

It IS a great secret..... He's called Jesus Christ, and since Christ is exactly like the Father, it is a True principle though NOT official Doctrine of the Church, except in reference to Christ because God has Chosen NOT to reveal such, except to "prepare" the world for the Reality of it, but they clearly still aren't ready for the World has not the Light yet to be able to recieve it.
Funny how they recieve it with Christ, yet He is supposed to be God to them, but they can't except the reality of it to the Father???

Christ Was AND Did everything the Father did folks..... Did He even saw that seeing Him was seeing the FAther???
Hello, how often does the Bible have to say the same thing before people get a clue as to who we really are and can be and who our Heavenly Family is?

 

[carolbob]

NOpe.... Nearly every step is a "perversion" of our beliefs!!!!

Go to LDS.org or your local Deseret Book store in the Missionary section or something to see an ACTUAL diagram of what LDS have as Doctrine, because your's is FULL of speculation and falsehood mostly from the anti-side, not Doctrine of the Church.

So lee, can you post an accurate diagram of lds salvation?

 

[Romans5:1]

Christ Was AND Did everything the Father did folks.....

Does that mean that Jesus made a conjugal visit to one of his daughters to conceive his only-begotten son, lee? By the way, just who were Jesus' wives, his daughter that he mated with, and what is Jesus' only-begotten son's name? Furthermore, we know that if the Mormon god did as Mormonism teaches, by making that little trip to earth to conceive Jesus, he broke his own laws regarding betrothal. Does that mean that Jesus broke one of the Mosaic laws as well, by conceiving with his daughter (whoever she was)? Also, since it was required that two people be married before they started conceiving children, does that mean that the Mormon god married Mary before having Jesus? If so, when did this marriage take place? Where is it recorded that Jesus was married? Did the Mormon god's wife approve of his conceiving with her daughter? How about Jesus' wife? Did she approve? And when the Mormon god was satisfied with what he had done with Mary, did he remain married to her, or did he write her a bill of divorcement? Are you saying that Jesus did these things too? Was Jesus divorced as well; from his daughter?

Did He even saw that seeing Him was seeing the FAther???

"Saw," lee?

Hello, how often does the Bible have to say the same thing before people get a clue as to who we really are and can be and who our Heavenly Family is?

The problem, lee, is that if the claims you keep making are completely contradictory to what the Bible says as to who or what you "really are," then why do you keep making those claims? Are you simply without "a clue?"

 

[emerald Dragon]

Look here. Seems to be a pretty good explanation and picture of the plan of slavation:

http://lds.about.com/library/weekly/previousyears/aa011499.htm

God Bless,
Emerald Dragon

 

[leeuniverse]

Great quote in there referenced at Jeff Lindsay's site.....

Do you think God was Once a Man?
Lorenzo Snow, a President of the Church, once said "As man now is, God once was: as God now is, man may be." This controversial passage is clearly applicable to Christ himself, a God who became mortal for a time and yet was still and is still God. His work made it possible for us to become as he is, in a sense, for we can receive glorious resurrected bodies (Phil. 3:21; 1 Cor. 15:40-45), we can become "joint-heirs with Christ" (Romans 8:14-18), we can "put on the divine nature" (2 Peter 1:3-10), and we can become "like him" (1 John 3:2). Indeed, Christ even went so far as to say, "Ye are gods" (John 10:34), in reference to the divine potential of human beings. While He and the Father are the one true God, whom we will always worship, He does want us to become more like the Father (Matt. 5:48) and the possibility is there because of Christ. Thus, thinking of Christ and our relationship to Him, what Lorenzo Snow said is accurate. However, it appears that Lorenzo Snow's quote also applies to the Father, indicating that He also experienced a period of mortality, but we know nothing specific. But before you let the idea of "God once being like man" offend you, remember that it is explicitly true about Christ Himself. If Christ were the same being as God the Father, then it would also be true of the Father as well, so non-LDS critics who accept the doctrine of the Trinity shouldn't get so upset. Of course, we believe that God and Christ are separate individuals, one in purpose, heart, and mind. But, in the spirit of pure speculation, let me ask if it is possible that Christ, during His mission on the earth, was doing that which He had seen the Father do? In John 5:19, Christ said "The Son can do nothing, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise." Some people have speculated on what is meant by John 5:19 and on what Lorenzo Snow meant, but we do not know and I get very nervous when people pretend they know. Certainly there are many difficult and foolish questions which can be asked in this arena. The important point is that God, Christ, and man are of the same "species," and that man has divine potential to become more like Christ and the Father (e.g., see Romans 8:14-18; 2 Peter 1:4-10; 1 John 3:2). This concept was understood by the early Christians, as show above.
Knowing who Christ is makes me very suspicious of anyone who says that we will become EXACTLY like Him. The Bible teaches that we can become "joint heirs" (Rom. 8:14-18) and can become "like him" (I John 3:2) and indeed, need to become like him (Matt. 5:48) and one with him (John 17:21-23). Stronger still, Paul in Philippians 2: 5-7 seems to urge us to pursue that goal, not through puffery, but through humble service:

"Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant...."
However, I sense a big difference between the "small g" gods that Christ mentioned (John 10:34) in speaking of the potential of humans (my view) and God the Eternal Father, who is the one and only everlasting God (see also I Cor. 8:5,6). The reference to humans as potential "gods" is clearly meant in a limited sense, but the word used is still "gods." Obviously, we know too little to explain anything in depth about the next life and about "the glory that shall be revealed in us" (Romans 8:18). We are like microbes looking up through the microscope and speculating about the scientist who observes us. We are children, following after our wise and mature Father, knowing little more than a young child does of the things of God. This we know: the glory is to the Father (and Christ) forever. May we return to their presence.

 

[carolbob]

Sorry, we don't become "Gods or gods". Can the clay become the potter? Can you become YOUR father? No, you will always be the son.

 

[leeuniverse]

Sorry, but I'm not "clay".... I'm a Son of God who has been commanded to BE AS HE IS.
So, I will keep going foward in Faith until I stand at His Right Hand right their along with Christ.
I know "who" I am....

 

[gort]

ED quote:

Look here. Seems to be a pretty good explanation and picture of the plan of slavation:

Thanx ED. Both these diagrams are the same.


<><

 

[emerald Dragon]

Just some of the termanology was different, and I wasn't quite comfortable with it-most of it, but not all, as I hadn't learned it that was.

God Bless,
Emerald Dragon

 

[Frankie]

Sorry, but I'm not "clay".... I'm a Son of God who has been commanded to BE AS HE IS.
So, I will keep going foward in Faith until I stand at His Right Hand right their along with Christ.
I know "who" I am....

I am clay that is being molded by the potter (the Holy Spirit) and I am not ashamed to admit as much. I am a child of God through adoption of the Holy Spirit, God is my father and I freely allow Him to mold me into whatever He desires of me. I am nothing compared to my God and I am no where near equal to Jesus. One day, I will have a spiritual ressurected body that will never die and I will live in Heaven with God forever, just like Jesus but I will never be a God like Jesus nor would I seek to do such a thing. There is only one God ever.

Frankie

 

[Doc T]

Sorry, we don't become "Gods or gods". Can the clay become the potter? Can you become YOUR father? No, you will always be the son.

Sorry, your clay/potters analogy does not fit. Does a kitten become a cat? Does a puppy become a dog? Does a colt become a horse? We are the same species as God. (See Acts 17:29 genus iis translated as offspring)
So no, I can't become my father, but I can become like him. We (LDS) do not believe that we will become God, but we can become like him and yes, we will always be his sons.

Doc

~

 

[Frankie]

Sorry, your clay/potters analogy does not fit. Does a kitten become a cat? Does a puppy become a dog? Does a colt become a horse? We are the same species as God. (See Acts 17:29 genus iis translated as offspring)
So no, I can't become my father, but I can become like him. We (LDS) do not believe that we will become God, but we can become like him and yes, we will always be his sons.

Doc

~

Wow! I am not the same species as God. I am human, God is God. I am His creation, He is my creator. I do not have the same nature as God and I am not the same species. If I were, I would be God and clearly, I am far from that.

Frankie

 

[Doc T]

Wow! I am not the same species as God. I am human, God is God. I am His creation, He is my creator. I do not have the same nature as God and I am not the same species.

Acts uses the Greek word genus. It's in the Bible. You may not accept it, and you may try to explain it away, but it is there.

If I were, I would be God and clearly, I am far from that.

Frankie

No you are not God, but of the same genus and thus you have the potential to become like him through the atonement of Christ.

Doc

~

 

[skylark1]

Acts uses the Greek word genus. It's in the Bible.

Source?

 

[Frankie]

Acts uses the Greek word genus. It's in the Bible. You may not accept it, and you may try to explain it away, but it is there.



No you are not God, but of the same genus and thus you have the potential to become like him through the atonement of Christ.

Doc

~

Doc, can you point out specifically where God's Word says this?

Thanks,
Frankie

 

[Doc T]

Source?

Skylark and Frankie, see Strong's 1096 genos

Hope that helps.

Doc

~