Enlightnened by Christ

[butterfoot]

It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, becauseto their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.

Some one help me with this. I think I am understanding this correctly but I want to be sure. I ran across this and was intrigued by it. I thought even if you fell from grace that you could again accept him back in. Am I wrong?

-cw

 

[FreezBee]

Some one help me with this. I think I am understanding this correctly but I want to be sure. I ran across this and was intrigued by it. I thought even if you fell from grace that you could again accept him back in. Am I wrong?

Well, you're not telling us what you mean by that you're "understanding this correctly"

I may not be the right one to answer, but I did give up being a Christian at the age of 13. Many times since other Christians have tried to make me come back, but I have refused.

Yes, I do myself feel that I have crucified Jesus all over again.

Will I repent that?

What would it mean to repent?

I would say that, if you have loosed your faith, it will be very difficult for you to again accept Jesus back in, but it's possible to come to some reconciliation, some kind of atonement.

The main question often is, whether the Christian sociaty you might live in will accept you back, and whether you want to go back to that.

Read Luke 15 may be the best advice I can come up with


cheers

- FreezBee

 

[BigNorsk]

The passage talks about falling away, often translated apostacy.

Now apostacy isn't just to sin.

I don't know exactly how you mean to fall from grace so I won't use that.

You can sin and be brought back to repentance. Even a lot of sin. To rebel against God isn't to deny his existence, you can't rebel against something that doesn't exist.

It seems to me to be a complete turning away from. I don't think you would have any desire to return. Maybe you turned to another god, maybe you just completely don't believe there is God.

Note that it is like crucifying Jesus all over again and we know he was only crucified once. You must be born again, but you can't be born again and again.

So if you are a Christian and turn away completely, you are indeed lost forever.

Marv

 

[butterfoot]

The passage talks about falling away, often translated apostacy.

Now apostacy isn't just to sin.

I don't know exactly how you mean to fall from grace so I won't use that.

You can sin and be brought back to repentance. Even a lot of sin. To rebel against God isn't to deny his existence, you can't rebel against something that doesn't exist.

It seems to me to be a complete turning away from. I don't think you would have any desire to return. Maybe you turned to another god, maybe you just completely don't believe there is God.

Note that it is like crucifying Jesus all over again and we know he was only crucified once. You must be born again, but you can't be born again and again.

So if you are a Christian and turn away completely, you are indeed lost forever.

Marv

Thank you for that Clarification

 

[beatarmy2]

Some one help me with this. I think I am understanding this correctly but I want to be sure. I ran across this and was intrigued by it. I thought even if you fell from grace that you could again accept him back in. Am I wrong?

-cw

You are Definately not wrong!! God will ALWAYS accept us back no matter what. All we need to do is ask for his forgiveness.

 

[EchelonForm]

I always thought that this verse is talking about someone rejecting Christ despite knowing who he is. Experiencing his power and then falling might be a better way. I might be wrong but this is how I always took it.

 

[Theophorus]

This controversial verse should be taken in context of the audience and surrounding verses and historical practices.

It was a common practice in ancient Christianity for some to put off baptism until near death, or when they were in their older years. Many did not wish to soil their baptism.
St. John Chrysostom says in his comentary of Hebrews, that some were making a mockery of Christ by being repeatedly baptized after commiting a sin/sins. He states that Paul was adressing this isue and its implications.

Notice before this verse, there is the plea to move onto issues of perfection and leave behind the "basics" of baptism and the resurection etc., for...

And later in 6:8 he states for those that bear "bad fruit" are nigh unto cursing. St. Chrysostom is quick to point out this verse in his comentary that even though the above mockery had taken place, the person was not cursed, but treading on thin ice so to speak. This comentary is from the 4th century.

 

[Stinker]

Heb.6:4.........."For in the case of those......."

The verse explains that these were people who had received the miraculous power of the Holy Spirit. They had received the word of God miraculously. Though they may have verbally confessed Christ, they did not truly believe. Like Simon the Magician (Acts 8:14-21) one did not have to truly believe in order to have an Apostle lay hands on them and receive miraculous power (gift of the Holy Spirit). Of course, when someone confessed Christ to them, it may have always been considered as sincere to them.

 

[ps139]

I have tried to make sense of this passage, and the only way I've been able to reconcile it is that this passage must be talking about the unforgivable sin.

Although I'll take the opinion of St. John Chrysostom over mine any day of the week!

 

[Yusuf Evans]

Note that it is like crucifying Jesus all over again and we know he was only crucified once. You must be born again, but you can't be born again and again.

So if you are a Christian and turn away completely, you are indeed lost forever.

Marv

I agree. Only, this is impossible once you have recieved the Holy Spirit. This is what he was referring to. If you have recieved the Holy Spirit, then begin to fall away from God, it's about impossible to come back, since you decided to spit on the blood that Jesus sacrificed.

 

[edie19]

I always thought that this verse is talking about someone rejecting Christ despite knowing who he is. Experiencing his power and then falling might be a better way. I might be wrong but this is how I always took it.

I agree with you. True salvation, true faith is complete and can't be reversed. However, there is a point where the decision to reject that salvation is final (God gives man over to their sins). Those who have been repeatedly shown the truth of the Gospel and reject it (apostates) eventually will not be given the opportunity again - and were not truly converted to begin with (1 John 2:19)