Endurance Of The Ten Commandments (incl. Sabbath)

[Cribstyl]

It's not hard to figure out. What happened 430 years after Abraham?

BFA

Good show BF1, Gal 3 explains what was added

An important fact to notice is, what Paul establish as "obedience to the truth,Gal 3:1
Paul compares, doing what the law requires, verses "the hearing of faith" Gal 3:2
This indicates that the preaching of the law and the preaching of faith are different messages. Verse 1 indicates that those who preach the law to you are "confusing" (bewitching) the gospel being preached.

verse 5 asks this question: "Does the minister we send to you, preach that you must keep the commandments or do they preached that you must have faith in Jesus Christ and receive the Holy Spirit?Gal 3:5


The subject is clearly about the law and faith... Paul reenforces biblical history about when the law was first added to God's chosen people.

Visionary and others often raise compelling arguments that are unsupported by texts.

CRIB

 

[visionary]

Good show BF1, Gal 3 explains what was added

An important fact to notice is, what Paul establish as "obedience to the truth,Gal 3:1
Paul compares, doing what the law requires, verses "the hearing of faith" Gal 3:2
This indicates that the preaching of the law and the preaching of faith are different messages. Verse 1 indicates that those who preach the law to you are "confusing" (bewitching) the gospel being preached.

verse 5 asks this question: "Does the minister we send to you, preach that you must keep the commandments or do they preached that you must have faith in Jesus Christ and receive the Holy Spirit?Gal 3:5


The subject is clearly about the law and faith... Paul reenforces biblical history about when the law was first added to God's chosen people.

Visionary and others often raise compelling arguments that are unsupported by texts.

CRIB

So do you my friend
My compelling arguments are supported by the consistency of God and lots of scripture texts in keeping with the hebrew mindset context. After all the authors are Jews and back when they were trying to preach the gospel of having faith in Christ and the receiving of the Holy Spirit, it was a new message, but did not do away with the established faith upon which all men were invited to join in worshipping the King of the Jews.

Ro 3:2 - Show Context
Much in every way! In the first place, the Jews were entrusted with the very words of God.

Be like Yeshua, be in His Kingdom, as one of the members known as Jews. .. a member of this commonwealth.

 

[Byfaithalone1]

Good show BF1, Gal 3 explains what was added

An important fact to notice is, what Paul establish as "obedience to the truth,Gal 3:1
Paul compares, doing what the law requires, verses "the hearing of faith" Gal 3:2
This indicates that the preaching of the law and the preaching of faith are different messages. Verse 1 indicates that those who preach the law to you are "confusing" (bewitching) the gospel being preached.

verse 5 asks this question: "Does the minister we send to you, preach that you must keep the commandments or do they preached that you must have faith in Jesus Christ and receive the Holy Spirit?Gal 3:5


The subject is clearly about the law and faith... Paul reenforces biblical history about when the law was first added to God's chosen people.

Visionary and others often raise compelling arguments that are unsupported by texts.

CRIB

Great points.

I am also intrigued by Galatians 4 (i.e. the very next chapter) in which Paul compares Hagar, the slave woman, with the covenant that was from Sinai. In making that comparison, Paul reminds us that God gave the command to get rid of the slave woman and not to return to slavery.

I would guess that our friend might wish to dispute that the covenant that was from Sinai included the ten commandments. It seems that he may wish to replace Jesus Christ (the true vine) with a human commonwealth. This is a new form of replacement theology that I find most distasteful.

BFA

 

[visionary]

Great points.

I am also intrigued by Galatians 4 (i.e. the very next chapter) in which Paul compares Hagar, the slave woman, with the covenant that was from Sinai. In making that comparison, Paul reminds us that God gave the command to get rid of the slave woman and not to return to slavery.

I would guess that our friend might wish to dispute that the covenant that was from Sinai included the ten commandments. It seems that he may wish to replace Jesus Christ (the true vine) with a human commonwealth. This is a new form of replacement theology that I find most distasteful.

BFA

Do you even recognise the covenant of Mount Sinai... it is found in the parchment laid on the side of the Ark of the Covenant. It is not that which is found under the mercy seat which is forever and ever. That which is written on stone, is to be written in the heart, in the new covenant.

 

[Byfaithalone1]

Apparently, BFA is rather good at predicting responses.

Do you even recognise the covenant of Mount Sinai...

Yes. It is the stone tablets given by God to Moses on Mount Sinai. See Exodus 19-20 to learn more about the covenant that was from Sinai.

it is found in the parchment laid on the side of the Ark of the Covenant.

The parchment laid on the side of the ark of the covenant included the ten commandments. It was these commands that were given on Sinai.

It is not that which is found under the mercy seat which is forever and ever.

That which was on the mercy seat is the very thing that was given at Sinai.

BFA

 

[visionary]

The covenant is the relationship deal. The Law of God is for ever and ever.

Ps 119:44 - Show Context
I will always obey your law, for ever and ever.

You can not throw out any verse just because it does not fit within your concepts.. all of scripture will hamonize when you allow God to be your guide on how they all fit together.

 

[ricker]

Do you even recognise the covenant of Mount Sinai... it is found in the parchment laid on the side of the Ark of the Covenant. It is not that which is found under the mercy seat which is forever and ever. That which is written on stone, is to be written in the heart, in the new covenant.

Interesting that you would take this view and probably still think the clean/unclean meat laws contained in the parchment are binding.

 

[Byfaithalone1]

The covenant is the relationship deal. The Law of God is for ever and ever.

Ps 119:44 - Show Context
I will always obey your law, for ever and ever.

You can not throw out any verse just because it does not fit within your concepts.. all of scripture will hamonize when you allow God to be your guide on how they all fit together.

Agreed. We should not throw out verses. They all explain how we have gotten to this point.

Since you don't throw out verses and since you will always obey His law for ever and ever, please explain how you avoid the animal rights activists as you offer your animal sacrifices on the seventh day of each week.

[BFA braces himself for the "there is no temple excuse" that will inevitably follow. BFA will wonder to himself whether Cain and Abel had a temple.]

The slave woman represents the covenant that was from Sinai. God gave the command to get rid of the slave woman.

BFA

 

[Byfaithalone1]

Interesting that you would take this view and probably still think the clean/unclean meat laws contained in the parchment are binding.

Well said.

BFA

 

[dragNdrop]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Testimony Of Paul[/FONT]






[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]“Honor thy father and mother; which is the first commandment with promise;[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]3[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]That it may[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth.[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]” Eph 6:2-3[/FONT][/FONT]



[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Paul is reinforcing the 5th of the 10 Commandments. Why is he reinforcing the 5th[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]commandment when the Ten [FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Commandments are no longer binding ?[/FONT][/FONT]



[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]The Sabbath commandment is a fourth of the ten. Seeing that the other commandments [/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]are still binding we see no reason for rejecting the Sabbath.[/FONT]

There is just no way to escape obedience to the law.

 

[k4c]

The issue with the Law is, are you trying to be save through keeping the Law or are you keeping the Law because you are saved and love God?

If you are trying to keep the Law to saved you will be in bondage to it but if you are in Christ you are free. You are not free from expressing love through the Law, but free from keeping the Law in order to get saved.

Acts 15:1 And certain men came down from Judea and taught the brethren, "Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.''

Galatians 3:2 This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

Romans 4:2-9 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something of which to boast, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? "Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.'' Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt. But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works: "Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven, and whose sins are covered; blessed is the man to whom the Lord shall not impute sin.'' Does this blessedness then come upon the circumcised only, or upon the uncircumcised also? For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness.

Just because we have been justifed apart from the Ten Commandments does not mean we can now sin, ie; break the Law.

Romans 6:15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not!

 

[Byfaithalone1]

The issue with the Law is, are you trying to be save through keeping the Law or are you keeping the Law because you are saved and love God?

Or, is it true that there are none who truly keep the law?

If you are trying to keep the Law to saved you will be in bondage to it but if you are in Christ you are free.

If I believe that the sealing will one day be based on keeping the law, am I keeping it to save me?

Just because we have been justifed apart from the Ten Commandments does not mean we can now sin, ie; break the Law.

Do we sin?

BFA

 

[k4c]

[/size]

Or, is it true that there are none who truly keep the law?



If I believe that the sealing will one day be based on keeping the law, am I keeping it to save me?



Do we sin?

BFA

The question should be, 'Do you try not to sin?'

Prior to Christ I didn't try not to sin but now that I'm in Christ, I try not to sin. Since I'm in Christ, when I do sin I have an advocate.

 

[visionary]

The issue with the Law is, are you trying to be save through keeping the Law or are you keeping the Law because you are saved and love God?

Keepers of the Law are not saved by keeping it, because salvation comes only through Christ. Keeping the Law is because of a faith in the Law Giver and Redeemer and it is because of His offer of salvation and love, that we honor and respect His Wisdom, and thus keep from sin by staying away from that which God has defined as sin. Since the Law of God lays out the definitions of sin, transgression are something that through the power of the Holy Spirit, we are compelled and enpowered to obey.

 

[Avonia]

Since the Law of God lays out the definitions of sin, transgression are something that through the power of the Holy Spirit, we are compelled and enpowered to obey.

How have you experienced this power?

 

[Byfaithalone1]

The question should be, 'Do you try not to sin?'

Prior to Christ I didn't try not to sin but now that I'm in Christ, I try not to sin. Since I'm in Christ, when I do sin I have an advocate.

When I try not to sin, do I actually avoid sin or does sin remain?

Can evidence of faith be found in "trying not to sin?"

BFA

 

[visionary]

How have you experienced this power?

Yes, I have. Small example, trying to quit a pack and a half cigarettes a day habit, praying and actually getting down to one cigarette a day, then celebrate with a cigarette. God came to me in a dream. I was standing before the Lord and I am unworthy to look Him in the face so I look at His chest but soon find myself unworthy to look at Him so I look down at my feet. I notice a pack of cigarettes there and so I try to kick them out of sight. They re-appear. I kick them back out of sight, they re-appear. I get so distracted with my efforts to get rid of them, I am consumed with the need to before Him without a pack of cigarettes. Then the Lord says, " would you like mel to take them away." I said , "YES" and woke up. I still had the desire, I still had the withdrawls, I even had hallucinations of cigarettes between my fingers, and this went on for forty days.

Did I experience His power? Absolutely. I trusted Him and believed Him and the Will power to overcome was granted me. Amen. I have not smoked a cigarette since that day.

Now some would look at all the ways the devil tempted me and say that I did not receive His power. Why was not the cravings, the desires, and the temptations taken away?

The answer is that God wanted to know if I believed Him. I did and trusted Him. How could I pick up a cigarette, which would have shown a lack of faith. So I got more than just kicking a bad habit, I had my faith strengthened, God's Will power in my life in action, and an answer to my prayers.. among other things. It is all to the glory of God and I praise Him for His Wisdom and understanding.

 

[Avonia]

Visionary, that is an interesting response to the question.

 

[dragNdrop]

In summary I guess what Visionary is saying is a testimony to a demonstration of a
power of true grace.

 

[Byfaithalone1]

In summary I guess what Visionary is saying is a testimony to a demonstration of a
power of true grace.

If, in a moment of weakness, Visionary were to smoke a cigarette, would that mean that God was less powerful or less gracious?

BFA