Ellen White on the Sabbath

[Dale]

One of the famous historical commentaries on the Bible, among Protestants, is Matthew Henry's Commentary. This is what he has to say about the day of the week in Revelation 1:10.


Quote



The day and time in which he had this vision: it was the Lord’s day, the day which Christ had separated and set apart for himself, as the eucharist is called the Lord’s supper. Surely this can be no other than the Christian sabbath, the first day of the week, to be observed in remembrance of the resurrection of Christ. Let us who call him our Lord honour him on his own day, the day which the Lord hath made and in which we ought to rejoice. 4. The frame that his soul was in at this time: He was in the Spirit.

End Quote








CommentariesMatthew Henry Commentary on the Whole Bible (Complete)RevelationRevelation 1


Link


Revelation 1 - Matthew Henry Complete Commentary on the Whole Bible


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[Dale]

Sorry--duplicate post.

 

[Dale]

Because the scriptures say it all, i dont need to add to it. No man needs a teacher. I just post what needs to be seen. And sometimes i worship God by posting scripture, i post truth and we must worship in spirit and truth. Its all good.

More Coffee is right. There isn't much point in quoting scripture without some indication of what you take it to mean and why you are quoting it.

In this case, I got what you are driving at but some scripture-quoters can be quite baffling.



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[weariedsoul]

More Coffee is right. There isn't much point in quoting scripture without some indication of what you take it to mean and why you are quoting it.

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

 

[mmksparbud]

One of the famous historical commentaries on the Bible, among Protestants, is Matthew Henry's Commentary. This is what he has to say about the day of the week in Revelation 1:10.


Quote



The day and time in which he had this vision: it was the Lord’s day, the day which Christ had separated and set apart for himself, as the eucharist is called the Lord’s supper. Surely this can be no other than the Christian sabbath, the first day of the week, to be observed in remembrance of the resurrection of Christ. Let us who call him our Lord honour him on his own day, the day which the Lord hath made and in which we ought to rejoice. 4. The frame that his soul was in at this time: He was in the Spirit.

End Quote


Let's see---everybody gets upset about EGW but I'm supposed to care about what some guy I never heard of says???!!!----Don't think so!!

Taking the bible as its own interpreter, no such thing as Sunday being the Lord's Day--never was never has been and never will be. The 7th day is the 7th day and was recognized by Christ as such when He said "pray that your flight be not on the sabbath day"--That was the 7th day sabbath that all the deciples kept and Christ expected it to be kept after His death and resurrection.
But then nobody really cares what I think either!!--








CommentariesMatthew Henry Commentary on the Whole Bible (Complete)RevelationRevelation 1


Link


Revelation 1 - Matthew Henry Complete Commentary on the Whole Bible


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[Lysimachus]

James 2:10
For whosoever shall keep the whole law - All except the single point referred to. The apostle does not say that this in fact ever did occur, but he says that if it should, and yet a man should have failed in only one particular, he must be judged to be guilty. The case supposed seems to be that of one who claimed that he had kept the whole law. The apostle says that even if this should be admitted for the time to be true in all other respects, yet, if he had failed in any one particular - in showing respect to persons, or in anything else - he could not but be held to be a transgressor, The design of this is to show the importance of yielding universal obedience, and to impress upon the mind a sense of the enormity of sin from the fact that the violation of any one precept is in fact an offence against the whole law of God. The whole law here means all the law of God; all that he has required; all that he has given to regulate us in our lives. (Albert Barnes)

And thus, it is emphasized, that while no one has kept the whole law, it is our duty as Christians to do our very best and keep it to the best of our abilities.

The expression is clear: "so speak ye and so do". It means to obey God's commandments.

 

[MoreCoffee]

And thus, it is emphasized, that while no one has kept the whole law, it is our duty as Christians to do our very best and keep it to the best of our abilities.

Well, no. That is not our duty. It is not our goal. A Christian's calling is to follow Jesus in faith, fidelity, loyalty, goodness, mercy, trust, and love ... probably some other adjectives are also applicable. But we're not called to follow Moses, not to walk in legal obedience, not to serve under the law. That is the ministry of death.

The expression is clear: "so speak ye and so do". It means to obey God's commandments.

 

[Lysimachus]

That'd be because 7th day breaking was not significant to non-Jewish Christians. I do not quite understand why Seventh Day Adventists (and any other non-Jewish 7th day observers) make such a fuss about something that was an obligation for Israel but not for anybody else.

"The sabbath was made for mankind" (Mark 2:27)

"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether [it be] good, or whether it be evil." (Ecclesiastes 12:13, 14)

"Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant." (Isaiah 56:6)

Your theology is in error.

 

[dollarsbill]

Do you execute your relatives who dishonor their parents? Do you execute members in your church for stealing or committing adultery?

Of course not. It is YOU who are preaching the Law that REQUIRES executing sinners.

This argument has been addressed a thousand times by Adventists. You should no better. It is a futile argument. Sin is sin. We don't have the authority to execute punishment--Israel removed the theocracy from Israel, and now declares "vengeance is mine". But the punishment is now deferred to the Day of Judgment for all those who willfully violated His law. James is very clear that we will be judged by the law of liberty, which is the Ten Commandments. It means to be liberated from the bondage of sin, which is transgression of the law.

I'll stick with the NT wherein is salvation.

More repetition. You know very well that we have dealth with this texts thousands, and I mean thousands of times.

For good measure, however, here are the answers again:

WHAT LAW WAS NAILED TO THE CROSS PT 1 by forerunner777 - YouTube

WHAT LAW WAS NAILED TO THE CROSS PT 2 - YouTube

So far, the Colossians 2:16 argument used by Evangelicals has proven to be debunked.

Col 2:16 could not be true if we are still under the Law of Moses. We must choose. NT or the Law of Moses.

So we now have a license to kill, steal, commit adultery, worship idols? Because we no longer execute these punishments, this means that breaking these commandments is not sin?

Who said that???

I think you know better than that. We are teaching what God's requirements are. We're not going to execute punishment that belongs to God.

The commandments are to YOU and whoever chooses to be under the Law. Not to me.

Punishment against transgressors of God's law will transpire when all the wicked are gathered together at the end of the millennium. All the willful violations of God's law will be recorded, and all will be punished at the same time.

Are you under the Law or not? If you are then YOU are REQUIRED to execute sinners.

 

[dollarsbill]

Because the scriptures say it all, i dont need to add to it. No man needs a teacher. I just post what needs to be seen. And sometimes i worship God by posting scripture, i post truth and we must worship in spirit and truth. Its all good.

But NOTHING you have quoted implies in any way that Christians are under the Law of Moses. We are not.

Galatians 5:18 (NASB)
18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law.

 

[MoreCoffee]

"The sabbath was made for mankind" (Mark 2:27)

But the verse does not say "mankind" is says "man". And scripture is very specific that the 7th day sabbath was given by God to israel as a sign that israel was his peculiar people. So, please, no more misquotes.

"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether [it be] good, or whether it be evil." (Ecclesiastes 12:13, 14)

Do you really believe that is the conclusion of the whole matter, really?

Seems that the author of Ecclesiastes summarises in those words what is man's duty but not what is the conclusion of everything. The truth is that God alone is the 'conclusion' of everything. Christian's know this at an almost instinctual level and that's why we do not submit to legalism. Obedience to aspects of the law as an exercise in holiness is okay, it has many benefits, but obedience to the whole law brings death for man not life. Jesus is the one who gives life, the law is weak and incapable of forgiving sins, animal sacrifices were only a temporary measure that was to end when the reality came and now that he has come we no longer seek to live according to Moses' law.

"Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant." (Isaiah 56:6)

Your theology is in error.

You are so keen on proving that you are under the law that I wonder why you do not simply become a Jew and be done with it.

 

[dollarsbill]

And thus, it is emphasized, that while no one has kept the whole law, it is our duty as Christians to do our very best and keep it to the best of our abilities.

The expression is clear: "so speak ye and so do". It means to obey God's commandments.

Such is not in the NT. Read Galatians.

 

[weariedsoul]

But NOTHING you have quoted implies in any way that Christians are under the Law of Moses. We are not.

Galatians 5:18 (NASB)
18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law.

I agree. Thats what i have been letting scripture say for itself.




1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Joh 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
Joh 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
Joh 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
Joh 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.
Joh 14:20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.
Joh 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
Joh 14:22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?
Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
Joh 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.


Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

 

[Dale]

Yes, well, you know what I say mi friend?

I unabashedly declare that Ellen White was not wrong. And the charges are erroneous. She is right. The critics are wrong. And in a court of law, all criticisms against Ellen White will fail miserably. She will never be torn down. No matter how hard the critics try. She stands vindicated! I know it's tough medicine to swallow.

Civil War issues resolved:

Ellen White comments on the American Civil War

Chapt 9 - The Civil War Predictions

12. During the American Civil War, Ellen White predicted the downfall of the USA - Seventh-day Adventists' Leading Forum - Club Adventist

Ellen White Apologetic - Britain to Enter the US Civil War - YouTube

Thus, the so called "criticisms" have been buried long before they have surfaced.

But as the saying always goes, the higher they go, the harder they fall.



You apparently have not yet heard of the principles understood in James 4:17 and John 9:41 and Hebrews 10:26?

Such individuals, who dedicated their lives to Sunday keeping, while having not yet been exposed to the Sabbath truth, will not be held accountable before God, for they did what was best according to what they knew.

But once the truth reaches their ears about the Sabbath, and then WILLFULLY reject it, no longer can they be considered innocent before God.

There are some exceptions, however. Sometimes the Sabbath truth is misrepresented to them, and yes, while it is true that they rejected the Sabbath truth, what they were rejecting was not so much the Sabbath truth, but the misrepresentation of the Sabbath truth. Thus, according to God, one cannot rightfully accept a truth if it is misrepresented, for the manner in which that truth is being falsely conveyed cannot be considered as "truth" to the hearer. =]

God will still save them in this case.

Lysimachus,


You seem to assume that I get my information on Ellen White being wrong about the Civil War from second, third, or fourth hand sources. I did not. I looked up her own words from SDA sources and I know the history well enough. There's no doubt about it. Ellen White was wrong, wrong and wrong about the major events during her lifetime, and she was mean spirited to boot.

The fact that Ellen White never apologized for being wrong, and never apologized for all of her absurd put-downs directed at Abraham Lincoln and his Administration doesn't put her any closer to being a prophet. It just shows how mean and self-centered she was.


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[mmksparbud]

Lysimachus,


You seem to assume that I get my information on Ellen White being wrong about the Civil War from second, third, or fourth hand sources. I did not. I looked up her own words from SDA sources and I know the history well enough. There's no doubt about it. Ellen White was wrong, wrong and wrong about the major events during her lifetime, and she was mean spirited to boot.




The fact that Ellen White never apologized for being wrong, and never apologized for all of her absurd put-downs directed at Abraham Lincoln and his Administration doesn't put her any closer to being a prophet. It just shows how mean and self-centered she was.

This thread is about EGW on the Sabbath----if you wish, how about starting a thread on the American civil war (that is the civil war you are refering to--she did write about other civil wars)--and you can enlighten us with with her statements along with the sources where you get these quotes. And also about how mean spirited she was, along with the sources, please.

 

[MoreCoffee]

mmksparbud, There will be threads about Ellen White and other topics. I started one on Nicodemus, remember? It was about Baptism mainly. Quite a good thread.

 

[bugkiller]

But the verse does not say "mankind" is says "man". And scripture is very specific that the 7th day sabbath was given by God to israel as a sign that israel was his peculiar people. So, please, no more misquotes.

Do you really believe that is the conclusion of the whole matter, really?

Seems that the author of Ecclesiastes summarises in those words what is man's duty but not what is the conclusion of everything. The truth is that God alone is the 'conclusion' of everything. Christian's know this at an almost instinctual level and that's why we do not submit to legalism. Obedience to aspects of the law as an exercise in holiness is okay, it has many benefits, but obedience to the whole law brings death for man not life. Jesus is the one who gives life, the law is weak and incapable of forgiving sins, animal sacrifices were only a temporary measure that was to end when the reality came and now that he has come we no longer seek to live according to Moses' law.You are so keen on proving that you are under the law that I wonder why you do not simply become a Jew and be done with it.

Actually it does say mankind in the orginal Greek text. But to use it in the way the SDA use it is twisting it for their purposes. The context is very important here. If the verse is divorced form the context and only considered as a stand alone sentence having no reference or inference Jesus contradicts Moses. This poses a problem at least for me. I have to ask who is telling the truth. Is it Moses or Jesus? If it is not both, which one is lying? What does this do to the Scripture?

Moses said -
3 The Lord made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day. Deut 5

Then Moses proceeds with the 10 Cs identified as the covenant. This includes the sabbath. No other nation or group is included in the covenant. The SDA use this to prove no Gentile can be saved without becoming a Jew to require the submission to that covenant. This means the NC is denied and so is salvation according to Gal 5:4.

13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the Lord that doth sanctify you. Ex 31

Who did God tell Moses to speak to? Why is it insisted that you is the whole world?

Psalms says -
19 He sheweth his word unto Jacob, his statutes and his judgments unto Israel.
20 He hath not dealt so with any nation: and as for his judgments, they have not known them. Praise ye the Lord.

Who was Jesus speaking to in MK 2:27-28? The whole world? Hardly. The SDA people claim that Jesus was also speaking to Gentiles because they were in the group. This is assumed. Jesus is not responding to a question from Gentiles nor having a conversation with them. Jesus is responding to Jews that asked Him a question. And it is in this context that Jesus replies and agrees with Moses and the Book of the Law given at the direction of our Father.

If this is not so then it needs to be explained how the sabbath can be a special sign to anyone since all mankind is obligated to it as the SDA claim.

I think all it takes is for one to read the Scripture to see how thin and false the presentation that the sabbath is for all mankind really is. But some are carried away because they first will not read the Bible and secondly get carried away with the emotion and passion of the moment. As noted even professional clergy get off base because they fail to see and understand what is really going on and perpetuate a religious system for the fool.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

Here is a P. S. to the above post -

12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the Lord that sanctify them. Eze 20

I do take it that the sabbath was given exclusively to Israel.

bugkiller

 

[MoreCoffee]

Actually it does say mankind in the orginal Greek text.

The Greek says, "καὶ ἔλεγεν αὐτοῖς· τὸ σάββατον διὰ τὸν ἄνθρωπον ἐγένετο, οὐχ ὁ ἄνθρωπος διὰ τὸ σάββατον·", and ἄνθρωπον means man, not mankind. In fact it is a singular, not even plural. Thus "and he was saying to them, 'the sabbath through the man came to be, not the man through the sabbath'". Even in a very literal translation, such as the one I just gave, it is clear that the verse points to the giving of rest for [a] man's sake rather than the giving of [a] man for the sabbath's sake. Our SDA interlocutors ought to know this.

But to use it in the way the SDA use it is twisting it for their purposes. The context is very important here. If the verse is divorced form the context and only considered as a stand alone sentence having no reference or inference Jesus contradicts Moses. This poses a problem at least for me. I have to ask who is telling the truth. Is it Moses or Jesus? If it is not both, which one is lying? What does this do to the Scripture?

Moses said -
3 The Lord made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day. Deut 5

Then Moses proceeds with the 10 Cs identified as the covenant. This includes the sabbath. No other nation or group is included in the covenant. The SDA use this to prove no Gentile can be saved without becoming a Jew to require the submission to that covenant. This means the NC is denied and so is salvation according to Gal 5:4.

13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the Lord that doth sanctify you. Ex 31

Who did God tell Moses to speak to? Why is it insisted that you is the whole world?

Psalms says -
19 He sheweth his word unto Jacob, his statutes and his judgments unto Israel.
20 He hath not dealt so with any nation: and as for his judgments, they have not known them. Praise ye the Lord.

Who was Jesus speaking to in MK 2:27-28? The whole world? Hardly. The SDA people claim that Jesus was also speaking to Gentiles because they were in the group. This is assumed. Jesus is not responding to a question from Gentiles nor having a conversation with them. Jesus is responding to Jews that asked Him a question. And it is in this context that Jesus replies and agrees with Moses and the Book of the Law given at the direction of our Father.

If this is not so then it needs to be explained how the sabbath can be a special sign to anyone since all mankind is obligated to it as the SDA claim.

I think all it takes is for one to read the Scripture to see how thin and false the presentation that the sabbath is for all mankind really is. But some are carried away because they first will not read the Bible and secondly get carried away with the emotion and passion of the moment. As noted even professional clergy get off base because they fail to see and understand what is really going on and perpetuate a religious system for the fool.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

I agree. Thats what i have been letting scripture say for itself.




1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Joh 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
Joh 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
Joh 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
Joh 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.
Joh 14:20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.
Joh 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
Joh 14:22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?
Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
Joh 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.


Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

Jesus also said -

10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love. Jn 15

John also said under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit -

23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. I Jn 3

bugkiller