Music4Hym777 said:
I will agree that there are very liberal ELCA churches that will tell you that and say those things. I once stepped foot into an ELCA church where the sermon was on how there is no such thing as God's will. But you also remember that there are other ELCA churches (the majority) that speak actual truth. They dont coat it, they speak law and gospel. I one time did an experiment, I went to an 8:00 (traditional) LC-MS church and then to a 10:30 (traditional) ELCA service, they were the EXACT same, same liturgy and all, I thought it was rather interesting.
It can't be said the same of all churches within either Synod. One only needs to look at what each publically and officially teaches and who they fellowship with. Not even are the various church districts the same within the differing parts of the country. For example, many of the northeast coast districts of the LCMS are rather liberal while many of the midwestern districts are not.
To do a thorough experiment, you would probabaly have to attend quite a few LCMS
and ELCA churches. Some would be as expected. Some may be the oppisite as one may expect.
A friend of ours from one of the churches where my father had been a minister had visited us and relayed what she saw when she was at the church in Kirkwood, where Kieshnick, the synodical president, is pastor. Can anyone say "
megachurch"? The way she described almost everything was not designed for a worship sevice...but for a show and entertainment.
But then, this is one who feels remaining within sound Biblical doctrine isn't important...it's missions. However, how will one properly be able to able to spread the Law and Gospel if they don't know what sound Biblical doctrine is?
I am not one to play sides on the different synods and you all know that.
I personally tend to be much more critical about my own.
I agree that the ELCA needs praying for. Some of the churches are going way to far off the deep end. The ones that need the most prayers are those that are RIC (Reconciling in Christ), they are the ones that are on the front lines of the LGBTQ movement.
ELCA first allowed women ministers...then homosexuals into ministery. Whether active or not , what ELCA offically did was first state God's word can be changed. And then they opened themselves up to pulpit and alter fellowship with two other denominations who have fully accepted homosexual practices as acceptable.
Then state someone's perception of themselves should be fully accepted. People dealing with temptation of any type, including homosexuality, does not make them guilty of that sin. They're only guilty of that sin if they fall into that sin. However, like all sin there is forgiveness offered. But that by no means excuses encourging or accepting that sin.
My brother knows a campus pastor. During an event for college-age LCMS Lutherans there was a RIC table there filled with leaflets seeking for youth to join in. I have to wonder just how that table got there. As I recall there were other speakers there from other denominations. I can perhaps understand one or two depending on the subject. Such as when one of the speakers was Joni Erikson Tada regarding issues of the sanctity of life (even though there is "Lutherans for Life" and mayhaps Gene Gartan could have been called.) But more than a handful...and I have to ask how can it be termed as a Lutheran event?
On the flipside though I have seen some rather radical LC-MS churches, they are LCMS but I know that there is controversy about them being registered LCMS parishes. They seem to be on the front lines of over seas missions...Does anyone have anymore information on these LCMS churches?
I haven't heard of those...at least in the sense of
over-seas missions. What I have heard more of were
mission churches. LCMS-speak of stating "church growth" as well as focusing on "megachurches".
But again...sound doctrine and the Great Commision were meant to go hand in hand as Christ Commanded. Not "mission first, be concerned with Biblical doctrine later".
Updated: Almost forgot to add, I read recently these "mission churches" the center of the LCMS speaks of is referring to churches building sister churches and those churches build more churches. They're not referring to the more known form in which a new congergation would form from another congergation in which the previous became too large and simply prayed anc called on a pastor and became a mission congergation.
From what I read it appeared more on center in on more missions....build more churches. But don't look into more into what these churches are teaching. Quanity over quality.
