Effective Communication

[cesty]

There are a few simple rules to follow to avoid creating issues in communication where there is no place for them:

1. Ask questions

It is always good to ask questions when something that someone says appears to either be offensive to you, or unclear. Finding out what people mean when they use certain terms can help to avoid unnecessary conflict. Not everyone uses words in the same way. So it is best to find out what they mean when it appears that they are using words in a way that is foreign to how we use them.

2. A statement is Not an Attack

There is a tendency to assume that just because someone says something negative about something that that means that person is referring to one or more people who are involved in a thread. This is not necessarily true. Sometimes people say things just to add further thought to an idea. It is best not to assume the worst in a response, but to ask for further clarification before identifying it as offensive, or directed at you or someone else in that thread.

3. Always be Polite

If you feel a need to lash out at someone then that is when you need to take a break from that thread. Don't post unless you can honestly say God would approve of the words that you wish to use to convey your message.

4. Don't be Condescending

Don't tell people that they need to read the Bible just because they don't agree with you. There are better ways to get people into the Word. It is not only an insult to speak to someone in this way, but it is an offense to God, because His Word is not to be used as a club. It is to be revered and shared in loving way.

5. Don't be Prideful

Be open to the possibility that you took something the wrong way, and that you may be wrong in how you are interpreting scripture. And if you have caused a person unnecessary pain, then by all means apologize to that person. After all, it is better to make new friends than it is to make enemies.

I think that if more people would follow these rules there would be less conflict.

Perhaps you have some rules that you would like to add to this list.

Maybe we can come to an agreement to follow these rules, and to hold each other accountable to them. Helping each other to grow in Christ is a good thing!

 

[Lisa0315]

Interesting. I am looking forward to this discussion.

Lisa

 

[GreenMunchkin]

Mui excellent post, d00d

It's funny, actually. I can't think of a single person who posts in this forum I wouldn't love to spend a day with at the zoo (or water-slides; fun-fair...) and everyone who posts here is truly lovely. The problem is how easy it is to misconstrue tone of voice here. It's very, very easy to perceive snideyness where there is none, and then fisticuffs do ensue.

Equally, we just communicate differently, I guess depending on what sections we post in. Someone who's well versed in debate and spends most of their time in that environment may have a more abrupt posting style. To someone who's not as debatey, their posts could be seen as abrasive, even if the person behind them isn't. So while I agree that it's up to each of us to temper how we communicate, I also think we should do one another the courtesy of assuming the best, really Tis just nicer that way

 

[cesty]

Mui excellent post, d00d

It's funny, actually. I can't think of a single person who posts in this forum I wouldn't love to spend a day with at the zoo (or water-slides; fun-fair...) and everyone who posts here is truly lovely. The problem is how easy it is to misconstrue tone of voice here. It's very, very easy to perceive snideyness where there is none, and then fisticuffs do ensue.

Equally, we just communicate differently, I guess depending on what sections we post in. Someone who's well versed in debate and spends most of their time in that environment may have a more abrupt posting style. To someone who's not as debatey, their posts could be seen as abrasive, even if the person behind them isn't. So while I agree that it's up to each of us to temper how we communicate, I also think we should do one another the courtesy of assuming the best, really Tis just nicer that way

As Paul would say,

"Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:" (Php 2:3-5)

 

[Nadiine]

Mui excellent post, d00d

It's funny, actually. I can't think of a single person who posts in this forum I wouldn't love to spend a day with at the zoo (or water-slides; fun-fair...) and everyone who posts here is truly lovely. The problem is how easy it is to misconstrue tone of voice here. It's very, very easy to perceive snideyness where there is none, and then fisticuffs do ensue.

Equally, we just communicate differently, I guess depending on what sections we post in. Someone who's well versed in debate and spends most of their time in that environment may have a more abrupt posting style. To someone who's not as debatey, their posts could be seen as abrasive, even if the person behind them isn't. So while I agree that it's up to each of us to temper how we communicate, I also think we should do one another the courtesy of assuming the best, really Tis just nicer that way

Yep, I'm definitely more abrupt in my post style - some of that is becuz my fingers can't take the extra abuse in having to type out all those buffers and extras on an already lengthy post, .. plus I'm just not that way.
In the sermons I've heard on gifts of the Spirit, I also found out that my particular gifts tend to lack that "warm fuzzy" aspect lol Plus, my background is in spiritual warfare.

I'm alot more like Joyce Meyers than a quiet Mrs. Hagee (John Hagee's wife who's softspoken) - so people could take offense to things when I don't even mean them rudely or even as offense.
I just cannot help who I am, and what you see today is alot more calm and compassionate than I was 10 years ago! So...... don't hope for too much more from me

I think if I added anything to the OP list, I'd add to work on not having a spirit that takes such easy offense if people don't stroke you the way you want as well.

This works both ways in communication, I also believe that we're called by God not to have a spirit of offence; that is looking to be angry or hurt at everything people do or say to them.
Those types of people will most definitely take a victim mentality and nobody can get along w/ them unless they cower & obey the intimidation placed on them to act a certain way or recieve the backlash.

 

[rmw8855]

I agree with both GM & Nadiine

If we assume the best about the other poster and don't take offense then most issues can be discussed freely, openly, and without abuse.

The other suggestion I usually make is to re-read your own post before you hit "submit". Not just for grammatical or spelling errors but for tone etc. Try to see it thru someone else's eyes. Sometimes we feel like we just HAVE to respond that we add fuel to the fire instead of helping to put it out.

 

[Nadiine]

As Paul would say,

"Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:" (Php 2:3-5)

Yes but lets also not forget that while Paul wrote this, he was also one of the harshest in other passages....
This verse does not remove rebuke or admonishment - just that when the negatives are used, they need to stem from a motive of LOVE - love of God and person.

I think alot of times we need to focus on the harm coming to the innocent, new or naive person who can be stumbled by what others do and show our love to them.
Not just 'love' to the person doing the harm. (imbalance).

If I'm going to protect a child from a pedophile/predator, I just might need to use some force on the predator for the child's sake to (that's just an explanation to get my point across about harshness with an underlying motive of love - as to who the love is being displayed to - we tend to try to show our ideal of love to the predators/aggressors when some negatives need to be used instead)

I think we have to balance things out so we don't create that 'false love' approach where we turn robotic as if we always have to act like we're on heavy meds without a personality & never raise our tone.
I do disagree with that becuz it's used all throughout the entire bible as an example.

 

[rmw8855]

I agree that love isn't always sweet Nadiine, but as you said even rebuke / admonishment needs to be done in love.

In general (I am not referring to any specific person, just general observations) I think this is an issue (rebuke in love) that gets confused. Sometimes, people are so busy "being right" that they leave out the love. We can't see the love in the poster's heart leading them to correct someone, only the words posted and if the poster is not careful those words can come across as harsh and condemning. Usually it isn't what is said that is the problem, but how it is said.

 

[Nadiine]

I agree that love isn't always sweet Nadiine, but as you said even rebuke / admonishment needs to be done in love.

In general (I am not referring to any specific person, just general observations) I think this is an issue (rebuke in love) that gets confused. Sometimes, people are so busy "being right" that they leave out the love. We can't see the love in the poster's heart leading them to correct someone, only the words posted and if the poster is not careful those words can come across as harsh and condemning. Usually it isn't what is said that is the problem, but how it is said.

Ok RMW, but truly and sincerely, I can say this very thing and apply it to Jesus' rebukes in Mat. 23 & in Paul's rebukes in the NT.

This is my whole point, it's OUR faulty ideal of what love is that makes this problematic.
Discipline of a child is love and that also entails corporal punishment which outwardly looks mean and cruel.
But the motive is love by correction.

If I said 1/2 of things Jesus or Paul said here, I'd be attacked by most Christians in this forum. This is my point.

I think it's our false perception of love that is harming Christian effectiveness in this world today. It isn't genuine love, it's PC love.
(imho).
And no, I do'nt mean go out & throw ad hom around - I'm adamantly against ad hom, ad hom is not loving whatsoever. I see a big difference in ad hom and stern, harsh replies towards an issue (when warrented).

 

[Lisa0315]

Ok RMW, but truly and sincerely, I can say this very thing and apply it to Jesus' rebukes in Mat. 23 & in Paul's rebukes in the NT.

This is my whole point, it's OUR faulty ideal of what love is that makes this problematic.
Discipline of a child is love and that also entails corporal punishment which outwardly looks mean and cruel.
But the motive is love by correction.

If I said 1/2 of things Jesus or Paul said here, I'd be attacked by most Christians in this forum. This is my point.

I think it's our false perception of love that is harming Christian effectiveness in this world today. It isn't genuine love, it's PC love.
(imho).
And no, I do'nt mean go out & throw ad hom around - I'm adamantly against ad hom, ad hom is not loving whatsoever. I see a big difference in ad hom and stern, harsh replies towards an issue (when warrented).

...But, Nadiine, the thing is, we do not have the authority of Jesus or Paul.

I dare say that a harsh rebuke (like corporal punishment) should be only dealt out by a loving hand. No one but my husband and myself spanked our kids. So, unless you know someone very well, and have an outside relationship with them, I don't think a harsh rebuke is appropriate here.

The whole point of a rebuke is to bring the person back to a right relationship with God. If this is done out of turn, with no respect or real knowledge of the person or situation, it causes more harm than good.

So, I think there is zero justification...

For example, I took the rebuke of GM and others here. I didn't like it but I didn't go off the deep end. I at least "heard" it. New Dawn, I do not know, and I will not "hear" it from her. Which is why I responded to her with "Get out of my business" post. See?

Lisa

 

[rmw8855]

I'm not disagreeing Nadiine.

My point is that sometimes the posts come across as so harsh & condemning that they drive the person we are trying to help away which defeats the whole purpose.

I have seen people on CF call people names, attack their character etc. all in the name of "correcting them". To me that isn't done in love, it is also against the rules of this site. I know, I know Jesus called the pharasees (spelling??) a pit of vipers and much worse, but that wasn't against any rules/laws and they weren't his brothers/sisters.

Pointing someone to scripture, correcting their doctrine, etc. isn't wrong even when done in a pointed and strong manner, but being hurtful and judgmental is.

 

[JoeWill]

IMO there can be no doubt that rebuking and warning people who express false teachings is both scriptural and should be done in love. The difficulty is that rebuking and warning individuals may not always be the appropriate response.

A leader of a local gay church where I live has been rebuked and warned lots of times over. If I were to speak to them with just another rebuke, I doubt it would make a lot of difference. It might be more effective to calmly present an argument to encourage them to reconsider their position. Discernment would be needed as well as the scriptures.

 

[Nadiine]

IMO there can be no doubt that rebuking and warning people who express false teachings is both scriptural and should be done in love. The difficulty is that rebuking and warning individuals may not always be the appropriate response.

A leader of a local gay church where I live has been rebuked and warned lots of times over. If I were to speak to them with just another rebuke, I doubt it would make a lot of difference. It might be more effective to calmly present an argument to encourage them to reconsider their position. Discernment would be needed as well as the scriptures.

Agreed.

I'd also add this, that with some, neither love OR rebuke will do any good. And in fact, with most I'd add. We seem to think that love wins everyone over when it actually does not.

Many many people opposed to Christianity look at the love we profess as weakness instead and they find it sickening and it turns them off entirely.
They mock it.
So our thinking that this type of love displayed is the ONLY way to reach people is actually misguided to some degree.
(by the way, I was one of those types that viewed Christian love that way myself. When I lived in heavy rebellion, seeing that love made me sick and even more rebellious becuz I wanted nothing to do with that and didn't want to be like that).

Jude 22-23 mentions something interesting
22And have mercy on some, who are doubting;
23save others, snatching them out of the fire; and on some have mercy with fear, hating even the garment polluted by the flesh.

But I really don't want my point to get lost here, if Jesus or Paul used the rebukes they used in scripture, we'd find it hostile and intolerable and unloving.
What is done here at CF is most often less harsh than what we read in the Bible. In fact, what Paul does in Acts with Simon the sorcerer, I wouldn't have the AUDACITY to say even if I had raging PMS. lol


I think we need to reassess what genuine love is and what PC love is - the type of love this world is trying to force us to display.

Here's something else I think, if Christians have such a hard time not being harsh and have to keep telling themselves "you HAVE to love people"...
I have to start wondering if we're even advocating something natural???

Genuine love of others should come EASY to a born again believer becuz we have God's own Spirit within us changing us. So why do we have to keep having threads & posts telling each other not to take harsh tones but to 'show love' instead?
I honestly wonder if being harsh isn't wrong, but our demand for this type of ""love"" is what's unnatural and false?

I DO love people, what doesn't come naturally is this coddly stuff where we turn robotic without taking any harsh tones no matter what people say or teach.
(and amazingly, the people who demand love be shown, have no problem being harsh and hostile towards people they believe aren't loving enough to correct them).

Sorry I'm being dogmatic, but after 11 years in chat/forum service, this is one of the top reasons I find that causes Christian splits & divisions.
(in my personal experience only of course - maybe it's not the case for others).

 

[rmw8855]

Obviously this is something Nadiine & I will probably never agree on, but that doesn't stop us from being friends and enjoying our disagreements.

re: effective communication
- We also need to acknowledge that we all have different backgrounds/experiences which affect what / how we post. We can't expect other people to necessarily understand what we mean or see something the way we do.
- Also, sometimes the response we see has absolutely nothing to do with us or even what we said. I have noticed this in my life recently. Work has been stressful etc. and if I am not careful sometimes that frustration comes out in my posts.

Both of these go back to GM's original post about assuming the best

 

[Nadiine]

Obviously this is something Nadiine & I will probably never agree on, but that doesn't stop us from being friends and enjoying our disagreements.

re: effective communication
- We also need to acknowledge that we all have different backgrounds/experiences which affect what / how we post. We can't expect other people to necessarily understand what we mean or see something the way we do.
- Also, sometimes the response we see has absolutely nothing to do with us or even what we said. I have noticed this in my life recently. Work has been stressful etc. and if I am not careful sometimes that frustration comes out in my posts.

Both of these go back to GM's original post about assuming the best

In many and most cases yes I agree,

but I cannot assume the best when people bring heresy & false teachings that counter the basics of Christianity & God's commands to us (which do harm and stumble many) and those who chronically work against the faith as an agenda.

Hope that helps clarify a little more

hugs to rmw

 

[rmw8855]

In many and most cases yes I agree,

but I cannot assume the best when people bring heresy & false teachings that counter the basics of Christianity & God's commands to us (which do harm and stumble many) and those who chronically work against the faith as an agenda.

Hope that helps clarify a little more

hugs to rmw

Always hugs to Nadiine

You are right - wisdom and past experience with another person definitely plays a part in communication. How we treat someone we just met is and should be different than how we respond to someone we know well. I don' t have alot of patience with people who go out of thier way to work against faith either.

 

[Nadiine]

Always hugs to Nadiine

You are right - wisdom and past experience with another person definitely plays a part in communication. How we treat someone we just met is and should be different than how we respond to someone we know well. I don' t have alot of patience with people who go out of thier way to work against faith either.

maybe I should have clarified that earlier?? lol

 

[A New Dawn]

...But, Nadiine, the thing is, we do not have the authority of Jesus or Paul.

I dare say that a harsh rebuke (like corporal punishment) should be only dealt out by a loving hand. No one but my husband and myself spanked our kids. So, unless you know someone very well, and have an outside relationship with them, I don't think a harsh rebuke is appropriate here.

The whole point of a rebuke is to bring the person back to a right relationship with God. If this is done out of turn, with no respect or real knowledge of the person or situation, it causes more harm than good.

So, I think there is zero justification...

For example, I took the rebuke of GM and others here. I didn't like it but I didn't go off the deep end. I at least "heard" it. New Dawn, I do not know, and I will not "hear" it from her. Which is why I responded to her with "Get out of my business" post. See?

Lisa

I'd be under the assumption that when it gets to the point that strangers are rebuking you because of the rift that your actions are causing, maybe you should at least consider what they say. I know I have taken advice of strangers who can give an unjaundiced view of the situation, but I guess we are all different.

 

[Lisa0315]

I'd be under the assumption that when it gets to the point that strangers are rebuking you because of the rift that your actions are causing, maybe you should at least consider what they say. I know I have taken advice of strangers who can give an unjaundiced view of the situation, but I guess we are all different.

...no need for a stranger to do so if a friend has already done so...

There are times when restraint is pretty important.

 

[A New Dawn]

I'm alot more like Joyce Meyers than a quiet Mrs. Hagee (John Hagee's wife who's softspoken) - so people could take offense to things when I don't even mean them rudely or even as offense.
I just cannot help who I am, and what you see today is alot more calm and compassionate than I was 10 years ago! So...... don't hope for too much more from me

I know what you mean. I have seen so many women being offered up as examples of what a woman in God is like, that is so opposite of who I am that I begin to wonder what is wrong with me. In many ways, I think that is an unfair comparison to make.

I do agree that we all need to make an effort to not take offense, even when things that are said are meant to be offensive (or that is the way they come across), and I have found that the best thing for me to do is walk away for awhile before I respond because it is the heat of the moment that mostly makes my responses seem harsher than they should be.