LDS Education of 12 LFS Apostles

[Rescued One]

SORRY! LDS APOSTLES, not LFS


President Russell M. Nelson was set apart as President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on July 15, 2015. He was called as a member of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles on April 7, 1984.

An internationally renowned surgeon and medical researcher, Dr. Nelson received his B.A. and M.D. degrees from the University of Utah (1945, 47). Honorary scholastic societies include Phi Beta Kappa and Alpha Omega Alpha. He served his residency in surgery at Massachusetts General Hospital in Boston and at the University of Minnesota, where he was awarded his Ph.D. degree in 1954. He also received honorary degrees of Doctor of Science from Brigham Young University in 1970, Doctor of Medical Science from Utah State University in 1989, and Doctor of Humane Letters from Snow College in 1994.
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Elder Dallin H. Oaks has served as a member of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints since May 1984.

Elder Oaks is a graduate of Brigham Young University (1954) and of the University of Chicago Law School (1957). He practiced law and taught law in Chicago. He was president of Brigham Young University from 1971 to 1980 and a justice of the Utah Supreme Court from 1980 until his resignation in 1984 to accept his calling to the apostleship.
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Elder M. Russell Ballard is a member of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. He has been serving as an Apostle since October 6, 1985, traveling throughout the earth to instruct Church members and direct day-to-day affairs of the worldwide Church.

He attended the University of Utah.

WHAT??? No degree?

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Elder Robert D. Hales was sustained as a member of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on April 2, 1994.

Elder Hales was born in New York City on August 24, 1932. He is a graduate of the University of Utah and holds a master of business administration degree from Harvard. He served in the U.S. Air Force as a jet fighter pilot.
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Elder Jeffrey R. Holland was ordained a member of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on June 23, 1994. At the time of this call, Elder Holland was serving as a member of the First Quorum of the Seventy, to which he had been called on April 1, 1989.

A student leader and varsity athlete at Dixie High School and Dixie College in his native St. George, Utah, he received his bachelor's and master's degrees in English and religious education, respectively, from Brigham Young University. He obtained master and doctor of philosophy degrees in American Studies from Yale University.
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David A. Bednar was ordained and set apart as a member of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on October 7, 2004.

Elder Bednar was born on June 15, 1952, in Oakland, California. He served as a full-time missionary in Southern Germany and then attended Brigham Young University, where he received a bachelor’s degree and a master’s degree. He also received a doctoral degree in organizational behavior from Purdue University.
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Elder Quentin L. Cook was sustained as a member of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on October 6, 2007. Called as a General Authority in April 1996, he served in the Second Quorum, the First Quorum, and the Presidency of the Seventy.

He is a native of Logan, Utah, where he was born on September 8, 1940. He received a bachelor’s degree in political science from Utah State University and a Doctor of Jurisprudence from Stanford University.
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Elder D. Todd Christofferson was called to the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on April 5, 2008. At the time of his call, he was serving in the Presidency of the Seventy.

Born in Pleasant Grove, Utah, on January 24, 1945, he graduated from high school in New Jersey. He earned his bachelor’s degree from Brigham Young University, where he was an Edwin S. Hinckley Scholar, and his law degree from Duke University.
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Elder Neil Linden Andersen was named an Apostle of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on April 4, 2009.

He graduated from Brigham Young University, where he was a Hinckley Scholar, and earned a master's of business administration from Harvard University.
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Elder Ronald A. Rasband was named an Apostle of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on October 3, 2015.

Elder Rasband attended the University of Utah. In 1995, Utah Valley University awarded him an honorary Doctorate of Business and Commerce.
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Elder Gary E. Stevenson was named an Apostle of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on October 3, 2015.

After returning from his mission, he enrolled at Utah State University. While at Utah State, Elder Stevenson obtained a degree in business administration.
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Elder Dale G. Renlund was named an Apostle of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on October 3, 2015.

After receiving B.A. and M.D. degrees from the University of Utah, Elder Renlund received further medical and research training at Johns Hopkins Hospital.
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Those are some of the successful LDS men.

 

[Ironhold]

1. You claimed that all of the church leadership went to BYU and that they received indoctrination accordingly. You yourself have now shown that your statement is false. Can we expect a retraction now?

2. Of those who went to BYU, only one person on your list majored in anything having to do with religion. Instead, the rest majored in such fields as law, business, and medicine. Does this sound like indoctrination to you?

3. Given the variety of experiences, education, and background of these individuals, do you feel them appropriate to lead a church or not appropriate?

 

[Rescued One]

1. You claimed that all of the church leadership went to BYU and that they received indoctrination accordingly. You yourself have now shown that your statement is false. Can we expect a retraction now?

2. Of those who went to BYU, only one person on your list majored in anything having to do with religion. Instead, the rest majored in such fields as law, business, and medicine. Does this sound like indoctrination to you?

3. Given the variety of experiences, education, and background of these individuals, do you feel them appropriate to lead a church or not appropriate?

You do not have to major in religion at BYU to be thoroughly taught the Mormon religion. Private schools have mandatory classes. There is also a missionary training center for future missionaries, and while on their missions the missionaries are required to devote a set number of hours to studying the "scriptures." I read the biographies of the apostles and the positions they formerly held in the Mormon churches required a knowledge of Mormonism. Starting at age twelve, Mormon boys are expected to attend Aaronic priesthood classes. I've read many of the lessons. So you can't tell us that Mormon leaders have less religious instruction than pastors who attend seminaries. How many of your American bishops chose to not go on a mission? Some of the ex-Mormons who post here can chime in.

I ought to have researched the educational degrees of your twelve apostles before now. The information I would like now is what classes are offered at the University of Utah and how many of the apostles attended Institute classes? Also, what are the requirements to become an Eagle Scout in the Mormon church?

FYI, non-Mormons who are reading this:

The LDS institute program is specifically designed for Latter-day Saint students attending college or other post-secondary education. Similar to the seminary program for high school students, institute classes are offered to help older students balance their educations; they provide spiritual learning alongside of the secular.
http://ldsblogs.com/172/mormon_institute_at_the_university_of_ut

 

[Ironhold]

1. The requirements for Eagle Scout are pretty much universal.

2. Institute is pretty much "Sunday school, but for a grade". I myself have taken a number of Institute courses, and that was the level they were taught at.

2A. Seminary is pretty much more of the same.

3. U of U is a public, secular institution. What's more, UU and BYU are rivals, with their rivalry being comparable to that of the University of Texas system and the Texas A&M system. Or, for people who aren't up on colleges, the Jets and the Mets.

4. So - how about that retraction?

 

[Rescued One]

Students benefit most who desire to savor and to ponder, to recognize (in whatever eventual major) the hidden likenesses among the subjects they study, to aim at integration and wholeness. Students benefit most who take the university with them: changed by their experience, they have developed educated habits of mind; they have deepened their faith; they have learned to integrate the sacred and the secular; and they have learned that the craving for knowledge is not fully capable of satisfaction within a lifetime. Students benefit most who become lifelong learners, engaged in service to their fellow human beings.

That it integrates sacred and secular education is the hallmark of a BYU baccalaureate. All disciplines at BYU are "bathed in the light and color of the restored gospel" (Aims, "Spiritually Strengthening"). Religion courses—both Doctrinal Foundation and electives—are not intended as only a devotional supplement to the educational enterprise of the university. At once rigorous and inspiring, they engage the mind and the heart in an ever deeper understanding of the gospel of Jesus Christ through close and meticulous study of the scriptures and the teachings of the living prophets.
https://registrar.byu.edu/catalog/2014-2015ucat/UnivCore.php

 

[Ironhold]

Students benefit most who desire to savor and to ponder, to recognize (in whatever eventual major) the hidden likenesses among the subjects they study, to aim at integration and wholeness. Students benefit most who take the university with them: changed by their experience, they have developed educated habits of mind; they have deepened their faith; they have learned to integrate the sacred and the secular; and they have learned that the craving for knowledge is not fully capable of satisfaction within a lifetime. Students benefit most who become lifelong learners, engaged in service to their fellow human beings.

That it integrates sacred and secular education is the hallmark of a BYU baccalaureate. All disciplines at BYU are "bathed in the light and color of the restored gospel" (Aims, "Spiritually Strengthening"). Religion courses—both Doctrinal Foundation and electives—are not intended as only a devotional supplement to the educational enterprise of the university. At once rigorous and inspiring, they engage the mind and the heart in an ever deeper understanding of the gospel of Jesus Christ through close and meticulous study of the scriptures and the teachings of the living prophets.
https://registrar.byu.edu/catalog/2014-2015ucat/UnivCore.php

You still couldn't prove that the church leadership was 100% BYU, so that part of your assertion is still provably wrong.

Now, how about looking at what I posted?

 

[BigDaddy4]

So to move up in the lds organizational chain, it appears one must live and/or have attended a major Utah college (BYU, Utah, Utah State). No very representative of the masses.

At least the Catholic church calls its servants (popes, cardinals, etc.) from all over the world.

 

[fatboys]

So to move up in the lds organizational chain, it appears one must live and/or have attended a major Utah college (BYU, Utah, Utah State). No very representative of the masses.

At least the Catholic church calls its servants (popes, cardinals, etc.) from all over the world.

There are leaders from all over the world. One of the councilors is from Germany.

 

[Rescued One]

There are leaders from all over the world. One of the councilors is from Germany.

Sure, Dieter Uchtdorf born in Czechoslovakia, refugee to West Germany; he escaped from East Germany and was a former president of Lufthansa Airlines. He's the second counselor to your prophet. Who else?

 

[Rescued One]

So to move up in the lds organizational chain, it appears one must live and/or have attended a major Utah college (BYU, Utah, Utah State). No very representative of the masses.

At least the Catholic church calls its servants (popes, cardinals, etc.) from all over the world.

Actually, I remember Hartman Rector, Jr., who was a convert. He was born in 1924 and baptized in 1952. If he's still alive, he's going be 92 this year. He was a general authority.

 

[Rescued One]

You still couldn't prove that the church leadership was 100% BYU, so that part of your assertion is still provably wrong.

Now, how about looking at what I posted?

100%? I didn't use that figure.

 

[Rescued One]

1. The requirements for Eagle Scout are pretty much universal.

2. Institute is pretty much "Sunday school, but for a grade". I myself have taken a number of Institute courses, and that was the level they were taught at.

2A. Seminary is pretty much more of the same.

3. U of U is a public, secular institution. What's more, UU and BYU are rivals, with their rivalry being comparable to that of the University of Texas system and the Texas A&M system. Or, for people who aren't up on colleges, the Jets and the Mets.

4. So - how about that retraction?

I happen to have known that the University of Utah is a secular school in Salt Lake City. When my friend escaped from BYU she went to UU.

You can't tell me a thing about Seminary and Institute classes. I attended Seminary classes at 6:00 am for a short time. I didn't have the energy to keep up with those hours. I own several manuals and if you were paying attention you would know that I quote from those manuals frequently.

 

[Ironhold]

So to move up in the lds organizational chain, it appears one must live and/or have attended a major Utah college (BYU, Utah, Utah State). No very representative of the masses.

At least the Catholic church calls its servants (popes, cardinals, etc.) from all over the world.

BYU has several programs which are regarded highly, and so it's no surprise that a lot of people who are LDS consider it ahead of secular institutions. I myself actually considered it at one point before realizing that I would probably be a poor fit up there (square peg in a round hole and all that).

In that sense, it's no surprise that people who are in leadership positions have degrees from there.

 

[ToBeLoved]

BYU has several programs which are regarded highly, and so it's no surprise that a lot of people who are LDS consider it ahead of secular institutions. I myself actually considered it at one point before realizing that I would probably be a poor fit up there (square peg in a round hole and all that).

In that sense, it's no surprise that people who are in leadership positions have degrees from there.

I doubt it. Show me some study where BYU is ratedm as a top school.

 

[ToBeLoved]

So to move up in the lds organizational chain, it appears one must live and/or have attended a major Utah college (BYU, Utah, Utah State). No very representative of the masses.

At least the Catholic church calls its servants (popes, cardinals, etc.) from all over the world.

They just let the mark of Cain into the priesthood. Now they can recruit into the poorer countries. Don't rush them into this century!

 

[ToBeLoved]

You still couldn't prove that the church leadership was 100% BYU, so that part of your assertion is still provably wrong.

Now, how about looking at what I posted?

 

[withwonderingawe]

There are leaders from all over the world. One of the councilors is from Germany.

Yep she missed that one, he was a fighter pilot

 

[ToBeLoved]

I actually think most of them have some business connections that are making the church richer. Maybe they provide some critical element to some investment somewhere. I don't think any of them that high up believe.

 

[Ironhold]

I doubt it. Show me some study where BYU is ratedm as a top school.

Bloomberg Business Week's 2015 rankings of top business schools.

Full-Time Business School, US:
BYU's Marriott School of Business comes in at #27, with a ranking index score of 74.17 / 100.

So there's that one.

 

[Ironhold]

I actually think most of them have some business connections that are making the church richer. Maybe they provide some critical element to some investment somewhere. I don't think any of them that high up believe.

Did you really just say that?