Dumbing Down

[Chesterton]

I'd like to hear from any UK/European members here on what we call "dumbing down". Is this an American problem or does it happen overseas too?

There are people who worry about kids' self-esteem so much that they don't want to reward excellence for fear of harming the pysche of those who don't excel. It gets absurd - some don't want to use a grading system, or they want to grade papers with green ink instead of red confused, some high schools nominate multiple valedictorians (I recall a case where a school had 800 students, and 600 of them were called "valedictorian"), and kids often play sports where no score is kept so there are no losers or winners, and everyone who participates gets a trophy, simply for getting out of bed and showing up I guess.

Basically, they want to treat everyone as equal, but we are not. Why should I exert myself, work hard and apply my talents if I'm going to receive the same reward as the slouchers?

 

[JCTheCreation]

Its not just in schools and definitely not just in UK or America. Its everywhere! A dumb society is easy to control. Flouride in our drinking water, mercury in vaccinations, television instead of books, no student left behind and on and on. They are making a world of idiots dependent on the government, so when its go time for the New World Order, most people won't even fight back. Its sad to see it coming from so far away. I just wanna shake people sometimes and tell them to WAKE UP! There is a lot of bad stuff going on and you wanna sit and play xbox for hours on end instead of preparing and trying to raise awareness. Crazy!

 

[Senator Cheese]

Okay, so I'm agreeing that a lot is being done to maintain a fake sense of equality. Then again, I'm not agreeing on all of the points:

1.) Removing the grading system, using green ink instead of red, etc.
This is totally bonkers. In order to maintain a functioning society, the most qualified individuals should be chosen for the respective job. That obviously means it's necessary to identify the respective qualifications.

2.) Playing sports without keeping score
I don't see a problem with this. Some people play for the competition, others are just happy to get some exercise. For young kids, I think motivating them to exercise is the right way to go - especially kids that are overweight and otherwise may be pressured by teammates who are "looking for the win" and see "no use" in the fat kid.

3.) Television instead of books
It's not just the television - it's the kind of programs they show. It sounds dumb, but a lot of the National Geographic shows and Bill Nye is what got me through middle/elementary school.
But in times of Jersey Shore, I do see a problem.

4.) Fluoride in drinking water, mercury in vaccines
I have to disagree on that one. In fact, the general fear that some organic fringe groups are spreading among the populace is one facet of "dumbening down" that I consider most dangerous.
Today, we are told to distrust the pharmaceutical companies and rather shove our money down some throats of homeopathic wizardry. We're told that GMO are bad even though it's been in our food for decades, etc., etc..


Now, the most important point I want to comment is this:

Why should I exert myself, work hard and apply my talents if I'm going to receive the same reward as the slouchers?

If you take a look at the reforms in healthcare, you'll see that the long higher education in medical sciences (6 years of studying, 6 years of specialization, high scores needed to qualify) will not get you much money anymore in Europe. Still, many people want to become doctors.

Money isn't everything. In fact, the Bible says you cannot serve two Gods, you cannot serve mammon and the LORD.

 

[DogmaHunter]

If you take a look at the reforms in healthcare, you'll see that the long higher education in medical sciences (6 years of studying, 6 years of specialization, high scores needed to qualify) will not get you much money anymore in Europe.

I wonder where you got this from. This simply isn't true.
I don't know a single doctor who isn't rich.

And the higher you go in the hierarchy (from a general house doctor to highly trained specialist in specific fields), the richer they are.

I agree most people will choose a carreer path based on interest rather then money. But make no mistake, medical carreers are very lucrative.

 

[Senator Cheese]

I wonder where you got this from. This simply isn't true.
I don't know a single doctor who isn't rich.

And the higher you go in the hierarchy (from a general house doctor to highly trained specialist in specific fields), the richer they are.

I agree most people will choose a carreer path based on interest rather then money. But make no mistake, medical carreers are very lucrative.

This will obviously depend on the nation and medical system and the question as to what is considered an adequate salary for said profession.


What I'm saying is that owning more money than another person shouldn't be what encourages you to do your best (or at least to do good, for that matter). At least in a Christian sense, anyway.

 

[lesliedellow]

Some background information:

Way back when, there was an exam called the eleven plus in Britain. As the name might suggest, it was taken by eleven year okds, and determined whether they went to a secondary school, or a more academically inclined grammar school.

There were also two exams called the 'O' level, taken at age 16, and the 'A' level, taken at 18 by people who stayed on at school for an extra two years.The eleven plus was abolished back in the sixties. The 'O' level was abolished about three decades ago, to be replaced by something called the GCSE. 'A' levels are still with us, because public opinion triumphed over the so called experts.

A few years ago, there was a television program in which a group of teenagers, all starred to get grade 'A' in their GCSE exam, were given what they were told was an old 'O' level paper. Only after they had all failed it were they told that what they had actually failed was an old eleven plus paper. So today's sixteen year olds can't even manage what eleven year olds used to be capable of.

More than that, questions from old 'O' level papers now regularly turn up on 'today's 'A' level papers. I suppose it is inevitable that the universities must also have dumbed down, now that they have to spend probably the first year, teaching students stuff they ought to have learned at school.

I sit on the bus sometimes, and over hear conversations which go something like, "I got five grade A's, how many did you get? Oh, I got seven." It can't get much worse, otherwise they will be giving grade A's away with the cornflakes.

 

[DogmaHunter]

What I'm saying is that owning more money than another person shouldn't be what encourages you to do your best (or at least to do good, for that matter). At least in a Christian sense, anyway.

I disagree.

Take me for example... I have a master in computer science and work as a software engineer.

The effort I will put into my job will be directly related to what my boss is willing to pay me and / or the benefits he's willing to grant me.

If he doesn't reward me for my troubles, he should not expect me to work 1 minute more then what my contract requires me to do.

While I have chosen this carreer out of interest (I love technology and software specifically), I do go to work every day because I'm paid to do so. I don't work for fun. I can have fun making software at home for free, doing only projects that I actually want to do, without business users asking stupid questions.

The amount of effort and energy I will put into my job will be directly related to the salary and benefits my boss will be prepared to offer me.

I work to live, I don't live to work.

 

[PsychoSarah]

This will obviously depend on the nation and medical system and the question as to what is considered an adequate salary for said profession.


What I'm saying is that owning more money than another person shouldn't be what encourages you to do your best (or at least to do good, for that matter). At least in a Christian sense, anyway.

I don't use it as my motivation. I choose work environment and what I would be doing within my job first, then I see if I can make money off of it. But money is always going to have some weight in the decision, even if it isn't the primary factor.