Don't tell ME it isn't a deviancy! . . . Catholics only, please.

Skripper · Mar 26, 2006

True. If this person is abusive, she's abusive. And would likely still be if she were heterosexual. I think one of the reasons it even made "news" on a wide scale is the alleged reason for the beating. This is likely just what happened to set her off this particular time. If it wasn't this, it's probable that something else would have. As you say, abuse is abuse. And since she apparently is abusive, it's likely that it was just a matter of time before she went off on the poor kid. If not for this "reason," then some other.

WarriorAngel · Mar 26, 2006

CaDan, First my condolences... I also lost 'cherished friends' who did these acts.

Second you prooved my issue.

When a child is forced to accept this, {Forced because you did not make the conscience choice to suggest your 'uncles' live this lifestyle} and then they accept an immoral act, this is not beneficial to them in the long run.

In other words...because you have been foced without your own fault, to accept the immorality of someone you loved, you cannot openly accept punishment for their actions, and thus you no longer see the action as immoral. {perhaps you do, but many do not...they would rather insult God than to accept that those with free will and with their own blame should not be held accountable for their own acts}

Yet many will argue against anyone who doesnt agree to this lifestyle now...because it would hurt any memories of cherished loved ones.

So, this is exactly why this poison should not be allowed to occur especially forced from an institution from whom the Lord entrusted His word the Bible, and instruction thru the centuries...

That those who do these acts and those who applaud them shall NOT inherit the Kingdom of Heaven. 1 Romans.

Peace CaDan, and may you always love your uncles...but see the truth of humanity's faults.

Miss Shelby · Mar 26, 2006

Well I think certain comments in this thread beg the question: Is the Church wrong about what she teaches regarding homosexual activity?

Michelle

Skripper · Mar 26, 2006

Of course not.

Miss Shelby · Mar 26, 2006

Skripper said:
Of course not.

thank you.

fragmentsofdreams · Mar 26, 2006

ps139 said:
The well being of the child must always be put first in these cases.

The Church is pretty clear that by allowing homosexual couples to adopt the child, no matter how nice or loving they are, is "doing violence" to the child.

Who are we to do violence to children? We do not have that right.

from the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith: Considerations regarding proposals to give legal recognition to unions between homosexual persons

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_homosexual-unions_en.html

Leaving kids in the system waiting to be adopted is doing violence to them.

Teshi · Mar 26, 2006

As someone who became lamentably familiar with the US's social services and foster care system, I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that being adopted by any sort of "deviant," so long as they'd treated me okay, would have been better than staying in a group home or in foster care.

IMO wanting to only allow stereotypically picture-perfect nuclear families adopt kids is just as bad as being one of those people who only wants to adopt cute, perfect healthy little white infants. It's fine if you're one of them, kinda sucks hard if you're one of the kids or adults who isn't one of them.

Miss Shelby · Mar 26, 2006

marciadietrich said:
I believe that Catholic Charities are within their rights to make this decision for their adoptions. Certainly they should not be made to do so against their will.

I do believe there are cases where a child would be better off with a gay couple than to languish in the foster care and ophanage system. Children who are not sought out for adoption due to being "too old," problematic or having disabilities. Without regard to any moral questions, I don't believe it would be fair to place an infant with a gay couple over a regular couple who had gone through years and possibly thousands of dollars, not to mention a lot of heartache, attempting to conceive without success.

Marcia

I agree.

Teshi · Mar 26, 2006

fragmentsofdreams said:
Leaving kids in the system waiting to be adopted is doing violence to them.

I would rep you one billion times if I could.

scraparcs · Mar 26, 2006

Miss Shelby said:
Well I think certain comments in this thread beg the question: Is the Church wrong about what she teaches regarding homosexual activity?

Michelle

I think this thread is about abuse, not church teaching on homosexual activity?

Protinus · Mar 26, 2006

fragmentsofdreams said:
Leaving kids in the system waiting to be adopted is doing violence to them.

Miss Shelby · Mar 26, 2006

Lel said:
I think this thread is about abuse, not church teaching on homosexual activity?

The impression that I took from the OP was that it's both.

Michelle

Teshi · Mar 26, 2006

My little sister (though adoption, not biologically), now 21 years old, has permanent brain damage. The back of her head is literally flattened out, which is part of the problem, and another part of the problem is lack of early stimuli. She was left lying in her crib underattended, unhandled, unloved too much in her first year of life. There were just too many babies at the home, I guess...

And people honestly think she'd have been worse off being raised by a gay couple. I don't understand this world, I really don't. It's better for a kid to have THE BACK OF HER SKULL FLATTENED than to grow up with two mommies, or with a single adoptive parent...Jesus forgive us for what we're doing to these kids, people just don't see it.

Irenaeus · Mar 26, 2006

***MOD HAT ON***

Dear posters,

Remember to keep this thread focused on the topic, which is the adoption of children by homosexual couples. You may not discuss the morality homosexuality unless it is a peripherial issue. If it becomes the primary topic, that would be a Rule 4.2 violation. Please be aware of that.

Remember also to keep this thread in the charity of Christ. The best "censorship" is self-censorship. Another word for it is self-control.

Psalm 119:11 "I have hidden your word in my heart that I might not sin against you."

Thank you for your attention.
Irenaeus, Chief Moderator of OBOB and Team Patience.

***MOD HAT OFF***

GraceInHim · Mar 26, 2006

I have followed this story since it effects the mission I volunteer for..

All adoptions for children are placed on hold in Massachusetts by the Catholic Charities... a bill is being sent to the house by Gov. Romney to say that the Church does not have to follow state laws when dealing with adoptions.. because the Church has to go through Social Services before the adoption..

The DSS is not soooo great either.. many children have been placed in foster homes, taken away from parents and I have seen first hand abuse by some Foster homes, like all they wanted was the money... my nephew is one, who lost 20 lbs, had lice, his little brother an infant stayed in a playpen all day besides eating and getting changed... their butts had rashes so bad the baby had scars.. and they would not let me an Aunt take them because I lived 20 minutes away in NH (out of state).. me and my husband took them to court and we got the kids..

DSS has a high leverage in child adoptions and foster homes... I am happy the Church is halting all adoptions until this bill is passed.

Far as the gay lesbian issue, I am with the Church.

Think of the kids rather then issues of what the public wants or has became in the past 50 years..

GIH

Miss Shelby · Mar 26, 2006

Teshi said:
My little sister (though adoption, not biologically), now 21 years old, has permanent brain damage. The back of her head is literally flattened out, which is part of the problem, and another part of the problem is lack of early stimuli. She was left lying in her crib underattended, unhandled, unloved too much in her first year of life. There were just too many babies at the home, I guess...

And people honestly think she'd have been worse off being raised by a gay couple. I don't understand this world, I really don't. It's better for a kid to have THE BACK OF HER SKULL FLATTENED than to grow up with two mommies, or with a single adoptive parent...Jesus forgive us for what we're doing to these kids, people just don't see it.

I am no stranger myself to foster care system and to the damaging affect therein. I know FIRST HAND what it's like to be in it. I'm not going into detail because I don't feel comfortable sharing that aspect of my life for everyone on the internet to see. But I know the kinds of abuses that take place, the physical and the sexual at times-- and there is ALWAYS another side to every story with cases like this--even when it comes to adoption. Because the human condition is flawed.

My initial point was that God gives us a moral law and the ability to discern it. Then it was implied in this thread that that moral law doesn't really exist. That's what concerns me the most, that people believe we don't have the guidance through the Church to accurately discern these things.

Michelle

CaDan · Mar 26, 2006

WarriorAngel said:
CaDan, First my condolences... I also lost 'cherished friends' who did these acts.

Perhaps I wasn't as clear as I could be. I should point out that Tommy and Ben were my great-uncles. And I am quite a bit older than 2.

They died of plain ol' coronary heart disease a decade ago.

WarriorAngel said:
Second you prooved my issue.

When a child is forced to accept this, {Forced because you did not make the conscience choice to suggest your 'uncles' live this lifestyle} and then they accept an immoral act, this is not beneficial to them in the long run.

I'm not sure what your point is.

WarriorAngel said:
In other words...because you have been foced without your own fault, to accept the immorality of someone you loved, you cannot openly accept punishment for their actions, and thus you no longer see the action as immoral. {perhaps you do, but many do not...they would rather insult God than to accept that those with free will and with their own blame should not be held accountable for their own acts}

Yet many will argue against anyone who doesnt agree to this lifestyle now...because it would hurt any memories of cherished loved ones.

Ah! There's the point!

The only anecdotal evidence which I may receive is that all same sex couples are mentally ill child abusers. Got it.

WarriorAngel said:
So, this is exactly why this poison should not be allowed to occur especially forced from an institution from whom the Lord entrusted His word the Bible, and instruction thru the centuries...

That those who do these acts and those who applaud them shall NOT inherit the Kingdom of Heaven. 1 Romans.

Peace CaDan, and may you always love your uncles...but see the truth of humanity's faults.

This is probably neither the time nor the place for the argument on this issue.

That being said, my experience is at odds with the the anecdotal evidence offered in the OP.

scraparcs · Mar 26, 2006

Miss Shelby said:
The impression that I took from the OP was that it's both.

Michelle

Well, I wanted to separate them more distinctly. Abuse is not the same as homosexual activity, and vice versa.

Teshi · Mar 26, 2006

All I'm saying is that in trying so damn hard to keep kids away from sinners (at least the sinners we see as worse than all the rest of us sinners) we're sinning ourselves by the harm we do...all those people in prison we're supposed to be visiting, all those hungry we're supposed to be feeding, all those sick we're supposed to be tending, because in doing so we're loving Jesus Christ himself, those are the kids in the social service trap. To me these gay couples who want to adopt, they're our modern Samaritians, the distrusted neighbors of the Jewish people...they're doing what's right by these children, putting the cloak over the beaten ones and caring for their wounds, while we sit back in our righteous judgement of them for who they are...and we will pay for it, I have no doubt.

GraceInHim · Mar 26, 2006

Remind you, Catholic Charities and DSS are two different entities when it concerns fostering children.. there are children that are fostered by the Catholic Charities, when it comes time for adoption they have to go through the State (DSS).. other children who are taken by the state (DSS) are placed in foster homes..

Don't tell ME it isn't a deviancy! . . . Catholics only, please.

Legend

I close my eyes and see you smile

Legend

Legend

Legend

Critical loyalist

Teshi

Guest

Legend

Teshi

Guest

aka Mayor McCheese

...once more unto the breach dear friends

Legend

Teshi

Guest

Sub tuum praesidium confugimus!

† Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

Legend

I remember orange CF

aka Mayor McCheese

Teshi

Guest

† Need a lifeguard? Mine walks on water †

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency