• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Does Math Logic Disprove Evolution?

Status
Not open for further replies.

no1nose

Junior Member
Jan 2, 2006
200
7
North Island
Visit site
✟22,865.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Evolution is a linear type idea however we live in a nonlinear and quantum universe. Therefore Evolution can never be the complete truth-- only tangent to it at one point.



Evolutionary theory operates completely in a macro linear world whereas life itself occupies a four dimensional nonlinear space with critical functions occurring at the quantum level. Evolutionary theory is a systematic conscious thought form. But the human mind is only capable of linear thought on the conscious level. Therefore the theory of evolution will never be anything more than simply tangent to reality at one or more points. Evolution theory is based on a foundation that in truth does not exist and so it is at best a very poor guide to explaining life.

The unconscious mind is capable of leaps of “inspired” thought which at times brings human thought into contact with reality. All human theories in time are found to diverge from reality – evolution is no different, in time it will be abandoned as new information makes it obsolete.


Theories are like straight lines with reality being a curved discontinuous surface. The idea is that rational human thought is sequential and “linear” whereas reality is nonlinear and quantum.



There is much physical evidence that evolution is nonlinear and discontinuous – there are species popping in and out of existence. And one of the great preoccupations of evolutionist is trying to shoehorn this evidence into a linear and sequential framework. We have comets and volcano and so on. Instead of accepting that nonlinear and quantum nature of reality we try and fit evidence into our limited thought processes.

The idea that evolution is a linear thought form is difficult for many to grasp at first so here are some other examples of “linear thought”.

First is bureaucracy. The mental processes that shape bureaucracy are any example of “linear” thinking. They are logical and rational but always dysfunctional. Linear in this case means policies that progress in an orderly sequential straight line fashion. But the reality that the bureaucracy and policy are aimed at never fits the mold.

A second example is the academic world. The great discoveries almost always begin outside the university. Einstein is the most famous example but I can’t think of any great inspirational work that has its roots in a university – art, music, science. Again “linear” thinking causes learning institutions to be out of touch with the cutting edge of human development.

The idea of “linear thought” is an analogy. Conscious rational thought follows a straight line. Whereas reality is more like curved lines and is sometimes discontinuous. On the unconscious level we sometimes make breakthroughs that bring us back into touch with the real world.

What is being said here is that consciousness occurs in its own “space” and this “space is not the same as the physical world around us. The space of our conscious minds limits our perception of reality. For example our minds have invented the shapes of square, triangles and circles whereas none of these shapes occur as such in nature (you will not find anything in nature that is an exact square or triangle or circle).

Using the math analogy: consciously we can think a + b = c (whereas c = some conclusion to our thinking) But we can not think conscious thoughts like a2 + b2 = c2. which can reflect the real world. Our conscious minds create thoughts that run in a straight line and our conclusions will tend to diverge from the real world.


Only the mind of God can truly know the world around us.
 

FreezBee

Veteran
Nov 1, 2005
1,306
44
Southern Copenhagen
✟1,704.00
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Single
no1nose said:
Evolution is a linear type idea however we live in a nonlinear and quantum universe. Therefore Evolution can never be the complete truth-- only tangent to it at one point.

Hi no1nose and welcome to the CF :wave:

While evolution of course cannot be the complete truth, human life is linear; we are born, we live, and we die. Adam was before Jesus, and the 2nd coming is after the 1st coming.

So. if you want to disprove evolution, this way, be prepared to loose more than you gain :)


- FreezBee
 
Upvote 0

no1nose

Junior Member
Jan 2, 2006
200
7
North Island
Visit site
✟22,865.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Hi and thanks for your comment. I would agree that to our minds life can seem linear but in truth it isn’t.



The point I am trying to make is that all human theories have a shelf life. For many people evolution = reality but this is not so. And for me it is easy to point this out by pointing out that all theories exist in only in our minds and are limited by our ability to think and consciousness.
 
Upvote 0

ThaiDuykhang

Active Member
Jan 9, 2006
360
1
✟23,005.00
Faith
Christian
Whenever a small evolution has no survival value, natural selection and evolutionism is falsified.

examples:
develop a wing 1mm wide after a mutation has no use at all. it can't be used for flying or gliding. An evolution supporter claim wings at the beginning was used to assist running, however, without strong muscle wings can only generate more aerodynamic drag and slow the animal down, so it also has no positive effect on survival.
 
Upvote 0

Dannager

Back in Town
May 5, 2005
9,025
476
40
✟11,829.00
Faith
Catholic
Politics
US-Democrat
ThaiDuykhang said:
Whenever a small evolution has no survival value, natural selection and evolutionism is falsified.

examples:
develop a wing 1mm wide after a mutation has no use at all. it can't be used for flying or gliding. An evolution supporter claim wings at the beginning was used to assist running, however, without strong muscle wings can only generate more aerodynamic drag and slow the animal down, so it also has no positive effect on survival.
It's important to note that the vast majority of all mutations are not beneficial or detrimental - they are neutral. Even if a mutation has no use at all, as long as it does not adversely affect the organism that carries it, it can still be passed on.
 
Upvote 0

ThaiDuykhang

Active Member
Jan 9, 2006
360
1
✟23,005.00
Faith
Christian
Dannager said:
It's important to note that the vast majority of all mutations are not beneficial or detrimental - they are neutral. Even if a mutation has no use at all, as long as it does not adversely affect the organism that carries it, it can still be passed on.

However my post only deals with mutations that eventually proved beneficial.
for a better gene to pass on to offspings and accumulate, old genes and inferior genes have to be extinct. an example: Giraffes neck. some deer today by accident still can have a gene to dictate longer necks. however with those short necked deer not starved to death. the gene is quickly lost during breeding. according to evolution, that's why you won't see deer developing into giraffes today
 
Upvote 0

john crawford

Well-Known Member
Sep 10, 2003
3,754
9
84
usa
Visit site
✟3,968.00
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Dannager said:
It's important to note that the vast majority of all mutations are not beneficial or detrimental - they are neutral. Even if a mutation has no use at all, as long as it does not adversely affect the organism that carries it, it can still be passed on.
As a matter of fact, all genetic mutations cause a loss of information in the genome of an organism, resulting in gradual devolution and extinction, not progressive evolution and survival.
 
Upvote 0

chaoschristian

Well-Known Member
Dec 22, 2005
7,439
352
✟9,379.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
no1nose said:
Evolution is a linear type idea however we live in a nonlinear and quantum universe. Therefore Evolution can never be the complete truth-- only tangent to it at one point.
Have you read Thomas Kuhn's "Structure of Scientific Revolutions?" If not, I think you would enjoy it.
 
Upvote 0

FreezBee

Veteran
Nov 1, 2005
1,306
44
Southern Copenhagen
✟1,704.00
Faith
Seeker
Marital Status
Single
ThaiDuykhang said:
Whenever a small evolution has no survival value, natural selection and evolutionism is falsified.

examples:
develop a wing 1mm wide after a mutation has no use at all. it can't be used for flying or gliding. An evolution supporter claim wings at the beginning was used to assist running, however, without strong muscle wings can only generate more aerodynamic drag and slow the animal down, so it also has no positive effect on survival.

Well, that evolution supporter might be wrong, don't you think? Most evolutionists that I know of, and that have a theory about this, simply say that at first round scales were turned into feathers, which was more avantageous in a changed climate.

ThaiDuykhang said:
However my post only deals with mutations that eventually proved beneficial.
for a better gene to pass on to offspings and accumulate, old genes and inferior genes have to be extinct. an example: Giraffes neck. some deer today by accident still can have a gene to dictate longer necks. however with those short necked deer not starved to death. the gene is quickly lost during breeding. according to evolution, that's why you won't see deer developing into giraffes today

Not exactly so. Humans and other primates together with guinea pigs lack solely of all (known) mammals the ability to synthesize ascorbic acid (C-Vitamin). No problem for the guinea pigs and non-human primates, they live in areas with rich supplies of plant food rich on ascorbic acid. It's only a problem for humans without access to ascorbic acidm such as long-your sailors in prior times. A loss of an ability is not necessarily any catastrophe, if the ability isn't really needed under the current circumstances.


john crawford said:
As a matter of fact, all genetic mutations cause a loss of information in the genome of an organism, resulting in gradual devolution and extinction, not progressive evolution and survival.

Not exactly so. Some mutations cause a genome to become defunct, but some simply cause it to code for another protein - it's rather a change in information than a loss in information.


- FreezBee
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.