Does Jesus love unconditionally? Jesus says, "No"!

[Francis Drake]

I actually have a set of Drake’s Pride Iner ational bowls so I know the story.

Soup bowls?

 

[gordonhooker]

Soup bowls?

Size 4 heavy lawn bowls lol

 

[Hammster]

ADMIN HAT ON


Moved from Traditional Theology.


ADMIN HAT OFF

 

[GraceBro]

John 15:9-10
As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

How does one spew forth doctrine that Jesus loves unconditionally if the above scriptures, printed in red, show that there is one condition? Keeping the commandments is that condition.

Romans 5:8
But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Taking John 15:9-10 and Romans 5:8 into account it would appear to paint a picture that God sends love toward us enough to send His Son but we still have to obey the commandments in order to abide in Jesus' love. This would heavily include, firstly, repentance, and lastly, making disciples of the nations (being a living sacrifice).

Does anyone have some input on this theology? Since the above is true; it would appear that there is a false doctrine that, "Jesus loves you no matter what" which gives the mentality of, "I can live in sin and be a Christian, too". A false doctrine we were warned about in the Bible (scripture below).

2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

Please, I am still learning. If for some reason I am not rightly dividing the word of God please let me know.

What Jesus said in John 15:9-10 was not said to encourage us, but to bury us. The purpose of the Law, that Jesus was amplifying, was to show us our sinfulness and lead us to the conclusion that the only way we could be acceptable to God was through His grace and mercy. There is the mistake made by some in the Church that we can "keep the commandments." However, the only conclusion one can reach is that "they don't love Jesus" because they aren't keeping them. And that is the conclusion Jesus wants you to come to. He is leading people to the cross and, ultimately, to the empty tomb to receive the Holy Spirit of God; which is salvation. We abide in His love by resting from our works (Hebrews 4:9-11). And love is the fulfillment of the Law (Romans 13:10).

 

[Wet Squirrel]

What Jesus said in John 15:9-10 was not said to encourage us, but to bury us. The purpose of the Law, that Jesus was amplifying, was to show us our sinfulness and lead us to the conclusion that the only way we could be acceptable to God was through His grace and mercy. There is the mistake made by some in the Church that we can "keep the commandments." However, the only conclusion one can reach is that "they don't love Jesus" because they aren't keeping them. And that is the conclusion Jesus wants you to come to. He is leading people to the cross and, ultimately, to the empty tomb to receive the Holy Spirit of God; which is salvation. We abide in His love by resting from our works (Hebrews 4:9-11). And love is the fulfillment of the Law (Romans 13:10).

Yea but from other points of view Jesus had to die for us because if he created us without ability to be reconsiled then he would be guilty of our sin .

 

[GraceBro]

Yea but from other points of view Jesus had to die for us because if he created us without ability to be reconsiled then he would be guilty of our sin .

I believe Jesus had to die for us. Sin is so terrible that it required the death of God. Nobody other than Jesus had a life to give that would satisfy God as payment for our sins. Now, I have the ability to approach God with confidence because my sins no longer separate me from Him because of the eternal redemption Jesus purchased on the cross.

 

[Francis Drake]

What Jesus said in John 15:9-10 was not said to encourage us, but to bury us. The purpose of the Law, that Jesus was amplifying, was to show us our sinfulness and lead us to the conclusion that the only way we could be acceptable to God was through His grace and mercy. There is the mistake made by some in the Church that we can "keep the commandments." However, the only conclusion one can reach is that "they don't love Jesus" because they aren't keeping them. And that is the conclusion Jesus wants you to come to. He is leading people to the cross and, ultimately, to the empty tomb to receive the Holy Spirit of God; which is salvation. We abide in His love by resting from our works (Hebrews 4:9-11). And love is the fulfillment of the Law (Romans 13:10).

Amen to that.

 

[Jonathan Leo]

John 15:9-10
As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

How does one spew forth doctrine that Jesus loves unconditionally if the above scriptures, printed in red, show that there is one condition? Keeping the commandments is that condition.

Romans 5:8
But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Taking John 15:9-10 and Romans 5:8 into account it would appear to paint a picture that God sends love toward us enough to send His Son but we still have to obey the commandments in order to abide in Jesus' love. This would heavily include, firstly, repentance, and lastly, making disciples of the nations (being a living sacrifice).

Does anyone have some input on this theology? Since the above is true; it would appear that there is a false doctrine that, "Jesus loves you no matter what" which gives the mentality of, "I can live in sin and be a Christian, too". A false doctrine we were warned about in the Bible (scripture below).

2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

Please, I am still learning. If for some reason I am not rightly dividing the word of God please let me know.

Love is different to grace. Never forget that.
If you loved someone and they constantly abused the marriage, had affairs, stole from you, put you down. Would you stay with it??. Exactly, even though you love them, you need to separate. You wouldn’t keep giving then grace because grace will see more and more [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] thrown in your face. Hebrews 10:26
Yes, God loves us so much that He died for us whilst we were still sinners but that doesn’t mean we can do what we want. Jesus is very clear on both points.
1. He loves us so much that He died for us.
2. If we continue in sin we will be cut off.

Grace is NOT a licence to sin, it’s an offer to respond to Him in our love for Him. Our love towards Him should be to have a relationship with Him the way He says is perfect love and lets face it, He is right.
“ If you love me, you will keep my commands”

A lot of Christians think they can live how they want and that God is a God of love and will forgive them. Err, wrong

I’m now going to debunk once saved always saved, or that God will not send people to hell, or that Jesus died for the sins of everybody.

1. If this were true, then nobody would be going to hell
2. We are told to run the race and we will be victorious
3. Very few find the narrow road. If Jesus is the way, the truth, the light, this means he is the narrow road too. If we not living like Jesus, were on a different road
4. God is a God of love and will forgive us for continuing in sin. Err, wrong.

It will be a very very sad day on judgment day alright but The saddest person will not be unrepented sinners, it will be God the father destroying His creation as He sends them to hell weeping why? why didn’t you come back to me? I gave my all to you and you refused such a salvation.

Gods love is not unconditional, it’s not biblical to think it is.
It’s like any other loving committed relationship here on earth. We give our all and yet it can often times than not get thrown back in our face. This is an exact representation of the gospel. It’s why the Bible goes to great lengths to show that repentance and salvation are like a marriage.
God wants man to be reconciled back to Him and has given Jesus ( Himself ) His all to sustain that relationship, but with free will we can chose to divorce from Him. What a pity but no doubt the reality of it.

So there is one condition to receiving unconditional love.
I know it sounds like an oxymoron, paradox thing but bear with me,
There is one condition as I said and God has given us that condition because we have a choice to chose Him because He created us with free will. God will not force you to love Him. We now know good from evil, we are no longer slaves to sin, the Holy Spirit will guide us, Jesus died to forgive our sins, God wants us dearly, Heaven erupts in joy when we repent back to Him, and without God our lives are krap anyway,
It’s like chess, it’s our move.

 

[Jonathan Leo]

Love is different to grace. Never forget that.
If you loved someone and they constantly abused the marriage, had affairs, stole from you, put you down. Would you stay with it??. Exactly, even though you love them, you need to separate. You wouldn’t keep giving then grace because grace will see more and more krap thrown in your face. Hebrews 10:26
Yes, God loves us so much that He died for us whilst we were still sinners but that doesn’t mean we can do what we want. Jesus is very clear on both points.
1. He loves us so much that He died for us.
2. If we continue in sin we will be cut off.

Grace is NOT a licence to sin, it’s an offer to respond to Him in our love for Him. Our love towards Him should be to have a relationship with Him the way He says is perfect love and lets face it, He is right.
“ If you love me, you will keep my commands”

A lot of Christians think they can live how they want and that God is a God of love and will forgive them. Err, wrong

I’m now going to debunk once saved always saved, or that God will not send people to hell, or that Jesus died for the sins of everybody.

1. If this were true, then nobody would be going to hell
2. We are told to run the race and we will be victorious
3. Very few find the narrow road. If Jesus is the way, the truth, the light, this means he is the narrow road too. If we not living like Jesus, were on a different road
4. God is a God of love and will forgive us for continuing in sin. Err, wrong. Even when we sin there is a condition for us to respond. It’s called CONFESSING

It will be a very very sad day on judgment day alright but The saddest person will not be unrepented sinners, it will be God the father destroying His creation as He sends them to hell weeping why? why didn’t you come back to me? I gave my all to you and you refused such a salvation.

Gods love is not unconditional, it’s not biblical to think it is.
It’s like any other loving committed relationship here on earth. We give our all and yet it can often times than not get thrown back in our face. This is an exact representation of the gospel. It’s why the Bible goes to great lengths to show that repentance and salvation are like a marriage.
God wants man to be reconciled back to Him and has given Jesus ( Himself ) His all to sustain that relationship, but with free will we can chose to divorce from Him. What a pity but no doubt the reality of it.

So there is one condition to receiving unconditional love.
I know it sounds like an oxymoron, paradox thing but bear with me,
There is one condition as I said and God has given us that condition because we have a choice to chose Him because He created us with free will. God will not force you to love Him. We now know good from evil, we are no longer slaves to sin, the Holy Spirit will guide us, Jesus died to forgive our sins, God wants us dearly, Heaven erupts in joy when we repent back to Him, and without God our lives are krap anyway,
It’s like chess, it’s our move.

 

[1213]

John 15:9-10
As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

How does one spew forth doctrine that Jesus loves unconditionally if the above scriptures, printed in red, show that there is one condition? Keeping the commandments is that condition.

Abide means stay. If person doesn’t stay in the love of Jesus, it doesn’t mean Jesus doesn’t love, person has just rejected that and is therefore without it.

 

[Jonathan Leo]

Abide means stay. If person doesn’t stay in the love of Jesus, it doesn’t mean Jesus doesn’t love, person has just rejected that and is therefore without it.

Well said
You cannot grow fruit of the spirit if you don’t abide in me.
I am the vine, you are the branch parable

 

[Francis Drake]

Abide means stay. If person doesn’t stay in the love of Jesus, it doesn’t mean Jesus doesn’t love, person has just rejected that and is therefore without it.

That "God is love" is a certainty. But that doesn't mean he directs that love indiscriminately. I agree that it is people who reject the love of God, but God himself also hides his face from them.

Isaiah59v1Behold, the LORD’S hand is not so short that it cannot save;
Nor is His ear so dull that it cannot hear.

2But your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God, And your sins have hidden His face from you so that He does not hear.

Verse 1 informs us that God has perfect hearing, and w​

e know that God and hears and sees everything. So if scripture states that God does not hear, that is a statement of God's refusal to hear.
God's refusal to hear must obviously include the withdrawal of his love.

 

[1213]

...
God's refusal to hear must obviously include the withdrawal of his love.

I disagree with that. It is not loving to hear all sayings. It is like in case of little kid who in store cries that his mother should buy candy for him. It is not loving to always give what child asks, when you know it is not good for the kid.

Loving parents set rules for kids, because they know what is harmful and what is not and want to spare them from bad things. And interestingly, giving good things for evil, can cause even more evil, because then they think it is ok to be evil.

 

[WorthyCause4Christ]

So Jesus MAY (probably not) love unconditionally but the Father does not. God directed me to this scripture earlier and I just noticed what it says in regards to this post...

John 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

 

[WorthyCause4Christ]

So Jesus MAY (probably not) love unconditionally but the Father does not. God directed me to this scripture earlier and I just noticed what it says in regards to this post...

John 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

 

[BNR32FAN]

John 15:9-10
As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

How does one spew forth doctrine that Jesus loves unconditionally if the above scriptures, printed in red, show that there is one condition? Keeping the commandments is that condition.

Romans 5:8
But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Taking John 15:9-10 and Romans 5:8 into account it would appear to paint a picture that God sends love toward us enough to send His Son but we still have to obey the commandments in order to abide in Jesus' love. This would heavily include, firstly, repentance, and lastly, making disciples of the nations (being a living sacrifice).

Does anyone have some input on this theology? Since the above is true; it would appear that there is a false doctrine that, "Jesus loves you no matter what" which gives the mentality of, "I can live in sin and be a Christian, too". A false doctrine we were warned about in the Bible (scripture below).

2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

Please, I am still learning. If for some reason I am not rightly dividing the word of God please let me know.

The definition of the word abide is accept or act in accordance with (a rule, decision, or recommendation)

So Jesus is saying if you keep my commandments you will accept or act in accordance in my love. It’s not a condition of receiving His love it means if we keep His commandments we will be accepting His love. If we don’t keep His commandments we are not accepting His love.

 

[Rubiks]

John 15:9-10
As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Extremely selective choosing of Bible passages. The John verse you provided is about Jesus' effectual (saving) love. The same author John in verse 3:16 says God loved the entire world.

 

[Rubiks]

‌

 

[Rubiks]

So Jesus MAY (probably not) love unconditionally but the Father does not. God directed me to this scripture earlier and I just noticed what it says in regards to this post...

John 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

No, the Father loves unconditionally as well (NRSV Luke 6:32-33,35-36)

If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners love those who love them. 33 If you do good to those who do good to you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners do the same.

35 But love your enemies, do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return. Your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High; for he is kind to the ungrateful and the wicked. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.

 

[Rubiks]

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[Rubiks]

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